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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Lifestyle > Vegetarian & Vegan

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  #11  
Old 10-01-2016, 08:06 PM
innerlight innerlight is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burntfruit
I don't believe any life form would wish to live such as a life as portrayed in factory farms.

I can't understand it.

I guess humans are 'higher souls' but we still have a responsibility.

We are in the age of transition.

In the future things will change.

In a perfect world, things would be different, and they would be in more humane places.. But this not a perfect world. It's not meant to be. It's a school house designed to learn and grow. It takes many pieces of a puzzle to achieve what it does. Some of those pieces are willing to make the sacrifices that are needed to accomplish the end game. In this case, an animal was compassionate enough to offer it's life to sustain another. Not many of those "higher soul" humans would be willing to give up their life for another. There is much we can learn from the smallest create to the largest.

Not everyone can be a vegan and some environments can not support it. So without the love and compassion of animals willing to allow themselves to be consumed, some people would not be able make it... But we can take such lessons and apply it to the future, where they are raised and houses in places of love and compassion. Returning the same things that they give to us.
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  #12  
Old 10-01-2016, 10:01 PM
knightofalbion knightofalbion is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by innerlight
Some of those pieces are willing to make the sacrifices that are needed to accomplish the end game. In this case, an animal was compassionate enough to offer it's life to sustain another.

It did not 'offer' though did it. It had no choice.

Leave the factory farm doors open, leave the slaughterhouse gates open, and let us see how 'willing' to have their throats slit they are.

I suspect we would learn that life is equally dear to all. Though surely that much is already self-evident.
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All this talk of religion, but it's how you live your life that is the all-important thing.
If you set out each day to do all the goodness and kindness that you can, and to do no harm to man or beast, then you are walking the highest path.
And when your time is up, if you can leave the earth a better place than you found it, then yours will have been a life well lived.

http://holy-lance.blogspot.com
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  #13  
Old 10-01-2016, 11:00 PM
innerlight innerlight is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knightofalbion
It did not 'offer' though did it. It had no choice.

Leave the factory farm doors open, leave the slaughterhouse gates open, and let us see how 'willing' to have their throats slit they are.

I suspect we would learn that life is equally dear to all. Though surely that much is already self-evident.

We're speaking about the soul itself. So who is to say the soul of the chicken did not make the choice long before it came to the body of the chicken? Who's to say the chicken and any animal knew what it was getting into coming to earth. Does the Zebra not come to earth because a lion would eat it in the wild? No. It's all part of the natural cycle of life.
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  #14  
Old 10-01-2016, 11:30 PM
knightofalbion knightofalbion is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by innerlight
We're speaking about the soul itself. So who is to say the soul of the chicken did not make the choice long before it came to the body of the chicken? Who's to say the chicken and any animal knew what it was getting into coming to earth. Does the Zebra not come to earth because a lion would eat it in the wild? No. It's all part of the natural cycle of life.

"Who is to say". Can you 'say'?

The natural cycle of life is that we live for a season then return to spirit, but bloodshed and cruelty are not pre-ordained, any more than war is.

I don't think 'you' can make a valid correlation. An animal is slave to its nature, or at least a carnivorous animal is. Herbivores don't kill or resort to savagery.

Humans should know better. 'We' certainly have the option of choice.
And as the whole purpose of earthly incarnation is to grow in wisdom, love and understanding, to continue in practices from Neanderthal times and before ....
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All this talk of religion, but it's how you live your life that is the all-important thing.
If you set out each day to do all the goodness and kindness that you can, and to do no harm to man or beast, then you are walking the highest path.
And when your time is up, if you can leave the earth a better place than you found it, then yours will have been a life well lived.

http://holy-lance.blogspot.com
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  #15  
Old 10-01-2016, 11:57 PM
innerlight innerlight is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knightofalbion
"Who is to say". Can you 'say'?

The natural cycle of life is that we live for a season then return to spirit, but bloodshed and cruelty are not pre-ordained, any more than war is.

I don't think 'you' can make a valid correlation. An animal is slave to its nature, or at least a carnivorous animal is. Herbivores don't kill or resort to savagery.

Humans should know better. 'We' certainly have the option of choice.
And as the whole purpose of earthly incarnation is to grow in wisdom, love and understanding, to continue in practices from Neanderthal times and before ....

Except it's only from a place of "arrogance" can one assume that one is not growing in wisdom and love because they consume a meat product. One can be very loving and compassionate and very in tune with life and the earth and consume meat. Only when we assume we know them and how they live their life can we reach such judgements.

You say herbivores don't resort to savagery.. But one could also say they they viciously pluck the leaves from the ground to make themselves a salad. Savagery and violence can be seen anywhere, and perhaps if that plant could walk away, it also would walk out the door, and not be made into food, much in the same way that chicken you used as an example earlier.

Bloodshed is a part of life. Our earliest ancestors had to adapt their diets to consume what they needed to to survive. There was an article just recently about the real life king kong, who dies out because of refusal to adapt its diet. Not everyone can eat just plants and fruits. That does not make them any less of a person than someone who doesn't.
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  #16  
Old 11-01-2016, 12:05 AM
knightofalbion knightofalbion is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by innerlight
Except it's only from a place of "arrogance" can one assume that one is not growing in wisdom and love because they consume a meat product. One can be very loving and compassionate and very in tune with life and the earth and consume meat. Only when we assume we know them and how they live their life can we reach such judgements.

You say herbivores don't resort to savagery.. But one could also say they they viciously pluck the leaves from the ground to make themselves a salad. Savagery and violence can be seen anywhere, and perhaps if that plant could walk away, it also would walk out the door, and not be made into food, much in the same way that chicken you used as an example earlier.

Bloodshed is a part of life. Our earliest ancestors had to adapt their diets to consume what they needed to to survive. There was an article just recently about the real life king kong, who dies out because of refusal to adapt its diet. Not everyone can eat just plants and fruits. That does not make them any less of a person than someone who doesn't.

You're in the 'Vegetarian and Vegan' section remember ...

I think we'll leave it there.
__________________
All this talk of religion, but it's how you live your life that is the all-important thing.
If you set out each day to do all the goodness and kindness that you can, and to do no harm to man or beast, then you are walking the highest path.
And when your time is up, if you can leave the earth a better place than you found it, then yours will have been a life well lived.

http://holy-lance.blogspot.com
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  #17  
Old 11-01-2016, 02:46 PM
7luminaries 7luminaries is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burntfruit
I think you make good important points.

I have never considered organic products before. It is worth thinking about.

I struggled as a vegan in the past - sometimes I would just go and buy some chicken - eventually the diet fell apart.

But focusing on organic produce now and then - could be a good solution.

Thank-you

No problem Burntfruit & glad this could offer some options for you.
It gives me some earnest peace of mind, since I trust the operations and local suppliers.

Peace & blessings,
7L
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Here we must be unafraid of what is difficult.

For all living beings in nature must unfold in their particular way

and become themselves despite all opposition.

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  #18  
Old 12-01-2016, 12:54 AM
Tobi Tobi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knightofalbion
Pain and suffering are part of the cycle of growth a soul must go through.

All life is evolving and animals are no different to humans in that respect.
They are on their own evolutionary path and seeking the Divine Light as we all are.

They have their own world of experience, they learn lessons and take these back to 'nourish' and enlighten the group soul.

As you say, it is difficult to contemplate the majority of them learning anything other than that humans are cruel and predatory.
That being said, many people keep chickens and show them kindness. So not all is a dark experience.

Of course in the realms of soul evolution, the order of the day is helping others up the spiritual ladder as we in turn are helped up ourselves. Because at the end of the day, we are all here to help each other along.
So the best thing we can do for chickens and our fellow humans is to set an example of kindness and compassion.

That is a most beautiful post dear Knight.
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  #19  
Old 13-01-2016, 01:04 AM
phoenix13 phoenix13 is offline
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Burntfruit,

Interesting question. I think something you could ask yourself is, "Why do humans keep incarnating?" Isn't the life of a human also filled with similar hardship and suffering? Many people have worse lives than chickens, by far. On the other hand, many people have better lives than chickens. There is no simple answer to this question. I believe that we all have a lesson to learn. If you believe in karma, you may see the suffering of a chicken as penance for the suffering that soul caused in another life. It all depends on how you look at it. Thanks for sharing.

-Phoenix
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  #20  
Old 19-01-2016, 10:35 PM
Myoho Myoho is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knightofalbion
"Who is to say". Can you 'say'?

The natural cycle of life is that we live for a season then return to spirit, but bloodshed and cruelty are not pre-ordained, any more than war is.

I don't think 'you' can make a valid correlation. An animal is slave to its nature, or at least a carnivorous animal is. Herbivores don't kill or resort to savagery.

Humans should know better. 'We' certainly have the option of choice.
And as the whole purpose of earthly incarnation is to grow in wisdom, love and understanding, to continue in practices from Neanderthal times and before ....

Well said
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