Heaven or Reincarnation?

[theophilus]

Originally Posted by Roaring Thunder

Quick question: When we die, do we go through purgatory and then go to Heaven or do we return for yet another lifetime on Earth?

You overlooked one possibility, that of ending up in Hell. The only completely accurate source of information about the afterlife is the Bible. Jesus told a story which shows the state of those who have died.

http://www.esvbible.org/search/luke+16%3A19-31/

There is also a thread on this form about this story.

http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=20683

Originally Posted by Ahimsa

It's so hard to be definite on this one. There are infinite possibilities, really. But my version of it goes something like this:

We are spiritual beings, and incarnating as human is just one part of our experience. We really are so much more than just this one lifetime. We existed before and we will exist after. We exist above and below and all around this one incarnation. And when it is over, our souls will continue on. We are our souls- that is who we really are. Life here is something of a dream, in a way.
I believe in reincarnation- from my perspective, I know without a doubt that it happens. What we call "heaven" is a human interpretation of the blissful aspect of the divine. The "gates of heaven" refer to the the doorway into the divine that we experience through death, or through profound meditation or spiritual awakening. When I use the word "God" I am referring to what I call "the light". It's the source, it's the sum total of it all, it's loving and bright and beautiful and dynamic. I have seen this light; I know it is there. There are beings that operate within it, to it and from it, as messengers and guides. These beings are the angels. They are not human, and they can be very helpful. They are radiant. I have seen one of them and it was like nothing else I have ever seen.
When we die, we go through a process of spiritual transcendence of the body. We shed the body and return to our more pure form, which is the soul. In doing this, we go through a series of stages. In one or more of these stages, we process the life left behind. This is the process we call "purgatory". It is called this name because here the soul is essentially purged of its earthly life. We process and release all of our deeds, and we experience the truth about ourselves. It can be very painful, but we need to do this in order to release from the body and the lifetime. Failure to transcend through this stage can result in an earthbound state, which creates ghosts.
We can and often do go through stages of this "life review" process while we are alive. In truth, death is simply a magnification of what occurs in life. If we work on ourselves and face our truth, though it may be scary, we will do the same in death and we will pass through the stages and go straight into the light of the divine. If we run away from ourselves and fail to face our truth, it will be particularly difficult for us to in death to purge and move on.
My experience has taught me that there is a realm in which beings who shun the light of the divine tend to cluster. This realm is shut away from the light because the beings who cluster there have no wish to be near the light. There are some powerfully negative beings there, and there is a conscious effort of some sort to maintain a boundary which wards off the light. The beings in this place are often in a state of great pain and suffering. I have seen some of them, and I call them demons. There are dark entities there which do try to reach out and encourage vulnerable souls to join them. One way they do this is by taking advantage of compromised individuals and coercing them to do things that are destructive to the soul, such as suicide. Many extremely suicidal people report hearing voices telling them to kill themselves. These voices belong to the dark entities from this realm.
God is all loving, and there is always a sense of unconditional compassion and forgiveness emanating from the light for everyone- including the dark entities. The divine light is made of love, and beings who enter into this light are at once immersed in a sea of love, the most profound and glorious love we as humans could ever possibly imagine. Its vastness is almost imperceptible to us. To comprehend it our minds have to strain, and they sometimes break in the effort.
There are so many questions to be answered which touch on the realm of the soul. There are answers, but they strain the boundaries of our human consciousness. Some things we are not meant to comprehend in this life.

Excellent explanation.
Deepsea

[Amilius777]

Astral Heavens/Hells-
When we die we usually go to a higher astral plane or a lower one. The higher ones are the heavens that many organized religions speak about. The lower levels are "astral hells". Horrible souls with some really really bad karma go to the lower astral spheres. They go there not just to be punished for their karma but also to learn from their mistakes. Some spirits go through nightmarish experiences in those hells. But it is not eternal. Eventually the soul gets out of those astral hells and goes back into the astral heavens.

From Earth to Heaven and back to the Earth-
Once the soul after death has gone to the astral heavens, or astral hell and back to the astral heavens for cleansing the soul reincarnates. It is different for everybody. Some people stay up there for 100 years, some 1000 years some for eons of time! That is why some people say- "I feel like a new soul!" That is probably because you were hanging out in the astral for so many hundreds of years or millennium. From what I gather the astral plane feels longer than the Earth time,

Expelled Entities-
But there are spirits or souls which are prevented for eons to reincarnate because of their states of mind. Or they are sent to other solar systems that equal their vibration. These dark entities are called "demons or devils" and lived human lifetimes of murder, pedophilia, treachery, malevolent tyrants and such. Its like being expelled from one school and having to go to another because you were that awful. You have heard of Jesus casting out "Beelzebub, or Belial" or Buddha facing Mara's demons, or whatever religions. These souls or entities have been expelled from the Earth School and have to go to another one that fits their mental state. But nobody stays in darkness forever.

Actually all Roaring Thunder asked were two simple questions to which there are two simple answers. I gave 'em.

Some of the other stuff looks more like personal opinion and/or beliefs....

[Fresco]

Originally Posted by Amilius777

Astral Heavens/Hells-
When we die we usually go to a higher astral plane or a lower one. The higher ones are the heavens that many organized religions speak about. The lower levels are "astral hells". Horrible souls with some really really bad karma go to the lower astral spheres. They go there not just to be punished for their karma but also to learn from their mistakes. Some spirits go through nightmarish experiences in those hells. But it is not eternal. Eventually the soul gets out of those astral hells and goes back into the astral heavens

That is absolutely spot on.

The modern Christian teaching of an "eternal hell" is false, souls are not tormented for eternity in hell.
This will come as a huge disappointment to some "Christians" who had hoped their enemies would be tortured forever.

Thats not to say that hell (lower astral planes) will be a pleasant place, in contrary it will feel like a long, scary nightmare to the damned

It doesnt matter what you think or what your beliefs are, the truth doesnt change. Of course we reincarnate. Its the only logical explanation. We have all incarnated on this earth many many times. If we just lived once we wouldnt have to learn anything. Earth is sort of a place where we put into practice what we have learned from the previous incarnations. One life heaven or hell, its just rediculous.

It is neccissary to return to earth until you have learned all that you need. Even if you dont want to return, you must in order to complete the solar cycle. Once you have done this you can then move on to other systems, but still able to come back to teach others.

[theophilus]

Originally Posted by GGpeace

If we just lived once we wouldnt have to learn anything. Earth is sort of a place where we put into practice what we have learned from the previous incarnations.

But we all begin life without any memory of previous incarnations. If reincarnation is true then it is impossible to make any progress. On the other hand heaven is a place where we can go on learning and making progress for all eternity because we will always retain the memories of what we have already learned.

[quote=theophilus]But we all begin life without any memory of previous incarnations. If reincarnation is true then it is impossible to make any progress. On the other hand heaven is a place where we can go on learning and making progress for all eternity because we will always retain the memories of what we have already learned.[/quote

May be that is the point of it.

if we had memories of a former life,we would make sure we didn't repeat our mistakes again.
Too easy!

We have to learn the hard way.

Originally Posted by theophilus

But we all begin life without any memory of previous incarnations. If reincarnation is true then it is impossible to make any progress. On the other hand heaven is a place where we can go on learning and making progress for all eternity because we will always retain the memories of what we have already learned.

The memories of previous lives are always with you. They are located in your subconscious mind and can be accessed through hypnosis, meditation, and sometimes dreams. Inhibiting the memory of past lives is necessary for progression. Who can progress forward if they are stuck in the past? If you were born into a family who were devout Catholics, spreading the Word of God and abhorring all things 'evil', and you remembered being a homosexual, prostitute, and/or a serial killer in past lives, it would most likely drive you insane. If that happened, you wouldn't be in much of a condition to accomplish anything in this life.

that unknown is what terrifies me.

I want to know that when i die (if my partner has died before me) that i will be reunited with him upon entering the afterlife. It petrifies me not knowing if i would.to me love is forever, not bound upon just the earth experience