Spiritual Forums

Home


Donate!


Articles


CHAT!


Shop


 
Welcome to Spiritual Forums!.

We created this community for people from all backgrounds to discuss Spiritual, Paranormal, Metaphysical, Philosophical, Supernatural, and Esoteric subjects. From Astral Projection to Zen, all topics are welcome. We hope you enjoy your visits.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest, which gives you limited access to most discussions and articles. By joining our free community you will be able to post messages, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload your own photos, and gain access to our Chat Rooms, Registration is fast, simple, and free, so please, join our community today! !

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, check our FAQs before contacting support. Please read our forum rules, since they are enforced by our volunteer staff. This will help you avoid any infractions and issues.

Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > Spirituality

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 25-01-2020, 11:17 AM
Siemens Siemens is offline
Knower
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 202
 
Why Do Souls Exist?

Many of you have already realized that you are more than just a biological body consisting of atoms. Most of you have realized that there is something more behind your human existence, namely a probably endless existing part that gives rise to your conscious experience and outlives your physical death: the human soul.
But taking this as our premise: Why is it actually that (supernatural, non-atomic) souls exist? If a soul is capable of reincarnating, a soul must be a very complex entity. It has to have the ability to connect with matter in a very purposeful and complex way. It has to have the ability to connect to the most complex physical machine we know: the human brain. And it hast to be able to use a human body for the purpose of making worldly experiences.
I also think that when we are dead, i.e. in the beyond, we still have all the skills and abilities we currently have as humans: We, as souls in the beyond, can feel, perceive and think and act - just as we do on earth.

But why do our souls exist? Souls obviously have complex skills and therefore must have complex mechanisms inside themselves - or, in other words, souls must be complex mechanisms. For a complex mechanism to exist one out of two things is required: either a creator or a process of evolution. How could something complex else exist?
The fist explanation involves a problem: If god or “a creator” created souls, he himself had to be a very complex entity what would beg the question why he exists. So, all god-theories have no explanatory power but are circular reasoning instead.

This is why I prefer the second explanation: namely that our souls exist because there’s a kind of soul-evolution in the beyond thanks to which we, as souls, exist. Although the idea of a creator has no explanatory power I don’t rule out that there have been other souls (older souls evolved through soul-evolution) that once helped my soul to form. As well as we, as souls, might help younger souls (or diffuse clouds of energy) to come into existence. What do you think?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 25-01-2020, 01:05 PM
Altair Altair is offline
Master
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Everywhere... and Nowhere
Posts: 6,631
  Altair's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Siemens
But why do our souls exist? Souls obviously have complex skills and therefore must have complex mechanisms inside themselves - or, in other words, souls must be complex mechanisms. For a complex mechanism to exist one out of two things is required: either a creator or a process of evolution. How could something complex else exist?
The fist explanation involves a problem: If god or “a creator” created souls, he himself had to be a very complex entity what would beg the question why he exists. So, all god-theories have no explanatory power but are circular reasoning instead.

This is why I prefer the second explanation: namely that our souls exist because there’s a kind of soul-evolution in the beyond thanks to which we, as souls, exist. Although the idea of a creator has no explanatory power I don’t rule out that there have been other souls (older souls evolved through soul-evolution) that once helped my soul to form. As well as we, as souls, might help younger souls (or diffuse clouds of energy) to come into existence. What do you think?

I think soul evolution leads to the same question: Why does it exist? Why do souls have to evolve? If they are *whole* then why be here? If it's due to past life, then we're left with circular reasoning too, it's just past life ad infinitum as an explanation. If there is a cycle of death and rebirth than what is the origin of that? If there is no origin than nobody can be responsible. If there is an origin it means there was a 'Fall'. Why fall in a cycle if we were whole?

Maybe instead it's just one grand experiment and we aren't really in control. That's my take on this..
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 25-01-2020, 02:24 PM
Lorelyen
Posts: n/a
 
Souls relate us to the cosmos and contain two major areas - the universal and the part that pertains to you individually, connected via a plethora of conduits. Why we need this/why it works that way is beyond comprehension. We can only speculate. These are just my beliefs, though, shared by a few, while others try to explain soul and meaning differently.

What's interesting is those who believe in past lives (that assumes continuity of souls). For them in their terms, they're lucky. New souls are created all the time. In 1950 the population of the world was 3 billion. Now it's almost 8 billion.
.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 25-01-2020, 03:12 PM
Miss Hepburn Miss Hepburn is offline
Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Southwest, USA
Posts: 24,943
  Miss Hepburn's Avatar
Color

This is my story and I'm stickin' to it.

.....................................

God is love. And Love must love. And to love there must be a Beloved.
But since God is Existence infinite and eternal there is no one for Him to love but Himself.
And in order to love Himself, He must imagine Himself as the Beloved whom He
as the lover imagines He loves.

Beloved and lover implies separation.
And separation creates longing; and longing causes search.
And the wider and the more intense the search, the greater the separation and
the more terrible the longing.

When longing is at its most intense, separation is complete, and the purpose of separation,
which was that love might experience itself as lover and Beloved,
is fulfilled; and union follows.

And when union is attained, the lover knows that he himself was all along the Beloved, whom he loved
and desired union with;

and that all the impossible situations that he overcame were obstacles which he himself had placed
in the path to himself.

To attain union is so impossibly difficult because it is impossible to become what you already are!


~ Meher Baba
__________________

.
*I'll text in Navy Blue when I'm speaking as a Mod. :)


Prepare yourself for the coming astral journey of death by daily riding in the balloon of God-perception.
Through delusion you are perceiving yourself as a bundle of flesh and bones, which at best is a nest of troubles.
Meditate unceasingly, that you may quickly behold yourself as the Infinite Essence, free from every form of misery. ~Paramahansa's Guru's Guru
.


Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 25-01-2020, 03:30 PM
ketzer
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Siemens
Many of you have already realized that you are more than just a biological body consisting of atoms. Most of you have realized that there is something more behind your human existence, namely a probably endless existing part that gives rise to your conscious experience and outlives your physical death: the human soul.
But taking this as our premise: Why is it actually that (supernatural, non-atomic) souls exist? If a soul is capable of reincarnating, a soul must be a very complex entity. It has to have the ability to connect with matter in a very purposeful and complex way. It has to have the ability to connect to the most complex physical machine we know: the human brain. And it hast to be able to use a human body for the purpose of making worldly experiences.
I also think that when we are dead, i.e. in the beyond, we still have all the skills and abilities we currently have as humans: We, as souls in the beyond, can feel, perceive and think and act - just as we do on earth.

But why do our souls exist? Souls obviously have complex skills and therefore must have complex mechanisms inside themselves - or, in other words, souls must be complex mechanisms. For a complex mechanism to exist one out of two things is required: either a creator or a process of evolution. How could something complex else exist?
The fist explanation involves a problem: If god or “a creator” created souls, he himself had to be a very complex entity what would beg the question why he exists. So, all god-theories have no explanatory power but are circular reasoning instead.

This is why I prefer the second explanation: namely that our souls exist because there’s a kind of soul-evolution in the beyond thanks to which we, as souls, exist. Although the idea of a creator has no explanatory power I don’t rule out that there have been other souls (older souls evolved through soul-evolution) that once helped my soul to form. As well as we, as souls, might help younger souls (or diffuse clouds of energy) to come into existence. What do you think?
Atoms are made of still smaller particles and so on until we reach the fundamental particles, which don't exist as physical particle outside of consciousnesses. In fact nothing exists outside of consciousness. The moon is not there when we are not looking at it. Only the information of how to construct the moon in all its variations and permutations exits, should the soul care to look. To look at the moon, the soul must first create it. And so it is with everything physical. All these things you mention the soul connecting to it must first create within (just as the human mind must do so). The soul does not incarnate into the physical world, it creates the world within itself and experiences it there (just as the human mind does).
Both God and a process of soul evolution are complex, I don't see an inherent advantage in either. I tend to see the soul similar to the cell. It is one part of a whole that it itself, though it carries within it the genes to create the whole, can never by itself become the whole. The whole is that which is the gestalt, the product of the parts that is greater then the sum. The soul is like one eye of a God that has infinity many eyes, infinity many points of view with which to observe its own creation, its own self. Taken individually, each eye is limited in its view, but sees up close and personal. Taken together, the view of all of the eyes is infinite, sees everything at once as one.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 25-01-2020, 03:49 PM
BigJohn BigJohn is offline
Master
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: अनुगृहितोऽस्म
Posts: 16,046
  BigJohn's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Siemens
Many of you have already realized that you are more than just a biological body consisting of atoms. Most of you have realized that there is something more behind your human existence, namely a probably endless existing part that gives rise to your conscious experience and outlives your physical death: the human soul.
But taking this as our premise: Why is it actually that (supernatural, non-atomic) souls exist? If a soul is capable of reincarnating, a soul must be a very complex entity. It has to have the ability to connect with matter in a very purposeful and complex way. It has to have the ability to connect to the most complex physical machine we know: the human brain. And it hast to be able to use a human body for the purpose of making worldly experiences.
I also think that when we are dead, i.e. in the beyond, we still have all the skills and abilities we currently have as humans: We, as souls in the beyond, can feel, perceive and think and act - just as we do on earth.

But why do our souls exist? Souls obviously have complex skills and therefore must have complex mechanisms inside themselves - or, in other words, souls must be complex mechanisms. For a complex mechanism to exist one out of two things is required: either a creator or a process of evolution. How could something complex else exist?
The fist explanation involves a problem: If god or “a creator” created souls, he himself had to be a very complex entity what would beg the question why he exists. So, all god-theories have no explanatory power but are circular reasoning instead.

This is why I prefer the second explanation: namely that our souls exist because there’s a kind of soul-evolution in the beyond thanks to which we, as souls, exist. Although the idea of a creator has no explanatory power I don’t rule out that there have been other souls (older souls evolved through soul-evolution) that once helped my soul to form. As well as we, as souls, might help younger souls (or diffuse clouds of energy) to come into existence. What do you think?

The word 'Soul' is a word that has a questionable definition. Like many of our words, it can mean something different depending on who you are talking to.

Go to the Buddhist forum here and you will discover that most of the Buddhist claim they have no soul.
__________________


 
   ⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜ ⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜

        Happiness is the result of an enlightened mind whereas suffering is caused by a distorted mind.
   ⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜ ⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜


Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 25-01-2020, 06:44 PM
iamthat iamthat is offline
Master
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Golden Bay, New Zealand
Posts: 3,580
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorelyen
What's interesting is those who believe in past lives (that assumes continuity of souls). For them in their terms, they're lucky. New souls are created all the time. In 1950 the population of the world was 3 billion. Now it's almost 8 billion.

Or perhaps it is not a question of new souls being created all the time. If we consider the Earth scheme as a whole, then perhaps there are 20 billion souls either in incarnation or out of incarnation. This figure of 20 billion is a completely arbitrary random guess. So in 1950 3 billion of these souls were incarnate with 17 billion out of incarnation. Now nearly 8 billion are incarnate, and just over 12 billion are out of incarnation. So there is no need for new souls to be continually created.

Peace
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 25-01-2020, 07:06 PM
iamthat iamthat is offline
Master
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Golden Bay, New Zealand
Posts: 3,580
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Siemens
Many of you have already realized that you are more than just a biological body consisting of atoms. Most of you have realized that there is something more behind your human existence, namely a probably endless existing part that gives rise to your conscious experience and outlives your physical death: the human soul.
But taking this as our premise: Why is it actually that (supernatural, non-atomic) souls exist? If a soul is capable of reincarnating, a soul must be a very complex entity. It has to have the ability to connect with matter in a very purposeful and complex way. It has to have the ability to connect to the most complex physical machine we know: the human brain. And it hast to be able to use a human body for the purpose of making worldly experiences.
I also think that when we are dead, i.e. in the beyond, we still have all the skills and abilities we currently have as humans: We, as souls in the beyond, can feel, perceive and think and act - just as we do on earth.

But why do our souls exist? Souls obviously have complex skills and therefore must have complex mechanisms inside themselves - or, in other words, souls must be complex mechanisms. For a complex mechanism to exist one out of two things is required: either a creator or a process of evolution. How could something complex else exist?
The fist explanation involves a problem: If god or “a creator” created souls, he himself had to be a very complex entity what would beg the question why he exists. So, all god-theories have no explanatory power but are circular reasoning instead.

This is why I prefer the second explanation: namely that our souls exist because there’s a kind of soul-evolution in the beyond thanks to which we, as souls, exist. Although the idea of a creator has no explanatory power I don’t rule out that there have been other souls (older souls evolved through soul-evolution) that once helped my soul to form. As well as we, as souls, might help younger souls (or diffuse clouds of energy) to come into existence. What do you think?

Another perspective is that there are great Cosmic Beings which contain multitudes of smaller Beings, and these smaller Beings in their turn contain multitudes of yet smaller beings, and so on. Each Being on whatever level expresses through consciousness, and on a human level we call this consciousness the Soul.

So regarding Humanity as a whole, there is a Soul for all Humanity which contains smaller Soul groups which themselves contain yet smaller Soul groups. Therefore we each belong to our particular Soul group and we incarnate with other members of our Soul group in continually changing relationships.

And as we evolve individually then so does our Soul group evolve to the point where our Soul group can function consciously within its larger Soul group. Eventually all the Soul groups which make up Humanity will function together as an expression of the Soul of Humanity.

Just a possibility.

Peace
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 25-01-2020, 08:27 PM
inavalan inavalan is offline
Master
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 5,089
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Siemens
Many of you have already realized that you are more than just a biological body consisting of atoms. Most of you have realized that there is something more behind your human existence, namely a probably endless existing part that gives rise to your conscious experience and outlives your physical death: the human soul.
But taking this as our premise: Why is it actually that (supernatural, non-atomic) souls exist? If a soul is capable of reincarnating, a soul must be a very complex entity. It has to have the ability to connect with matter in a very purposeful and complex way. It has to have the ability to connect to the most complex physical machine we know: the human brain. And it hast to be able to use a human body for the purpose of making worldly experiences.
I also think that when we are dead, i.e. in the beyond, we still have all the skills and abilities we currently have as humans: We, as souls in the beyond, can feel, perceive and think and act - just as we do on earth.

But why do our souls exist? Souls obviously have complex skills and therefore must have complex mechanisms inside themselves - or, in other words, souls must be complex mechanisms. For a complex mechanism to exist one out of two things is required: either a creator or a process of evolution. How could something complex else exist?
The fist explanation involves a problem: If god or “a creator” created souls, he himself had to be a very complex entity what would beg the question why he exists. So, all god-theories have no explanatory power but are circular reasoning instead.

This is why I prefer the second explanation: namely that our souls exist because there’s a kind of soul-evolution in the beyond thanks to which we, as souls, exist. Although the idea of a creator has no explanatory power I don’t rule out that there have been other souls (older souls evolved through soul-evolution) that once helped my soul to form. As well as we, as souls, might help younger souls (or diffuse clouds of energy) to come into existence. What do you think?

You can't reason such subjects, so I believe it is a waste of time to try it. We don't have neither the data, nor the intellect, nor the intuition to figure out such subjects. That's why they exist under the faith umbrella.

Your title question should be turned around 180 degrees to: why do humans exists? Isn't it? The soul temporarily materializes, and not the human temporarily sublimates ...

It is like you-in-your-dream would your question: why does @Siemens exist?
__________________
Everything expressed here is what I believe. Keep that in mind when you read my post, as I kept it in mind when I wrote it. I don't parrot others. Most of my spiritual beliefs come from direct channeling guidance. I have no interest in arguing whose belief is right, and whose is wrong. I'm here just to express my opinions, and read about others'.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 26-01-2020, 10:36 AM
Altair Altair is offline
Master
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Everywhere... and Nowhere
Posts: 6,631
  Altair's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorelyen
Souls relate us to the cosmos and contain two major areas - the universal and the part that pertains to you individually, connected via a plethora of conduits. Why we need this/why it works that way is beyond comprehension. We can only speculate. These are just my beliefs, though, shared by a few, while others try to explain soul and meaning differently.
Seems so, yes..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorelyen
What's interesting is those who believe in past lives (that assumes continuity of souls). For them in their terms, they're lucky. New souls are created all the time. In 1950 the population of the world was 3 billion. Now it's almost 8 billion.
.
Hmm, but there could be millions of planets out there with life on it so perhaps numbers aren't that important.
Does it matter in the grand picture of the universe if there are 3 or 8 billion humans here??
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 04:56 PM.


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
(c) Spiritual Forums