Can you do Pagan Rituals and not be Pagan ?

I really think you are confused maybe?
I am not picking a fight I am simply giving you information on Paganism.
Telling me to go away will not help you to understand how this is plain fact.
I have studied Theology and Occult practices for over 20 yrs. Again if you scroll up and really read what I said instead and stop being defensive you will see me say "even though I don't like web information I will link this.
So you have a better understanding. I am positive you are a bright funny intelligent person everyone cannot know everything. This forum was built to educate people and help people grow. Not to tell people to stop talking.
I admire your opinions on things I admire everyone's opinions.
If you dont like mine feel free to prove me wrong.

[norseman]

Rewinding to the original question
"Can you do Pagan Rituals and not be Pagan ?"

Pagan is a word like "dog" - a generic word. Just as there are zillions of breeds of dog, likewise with pagan.
Consider history. America was founded by fundamental christians and never had a pagan heritage [yes, I know - what about the native Americans ? Their spirituality was under attack from day one]
Europe in general has a long pagan heritage but,again, you cannot address Europe generically. Southern Europe fell under the influence of Rome early on, while Northern Europe remained pagan for many centuries.
Britain is the peculiarity. As I indicated previously, Britain was influenced by what I call the pagan christianity of the Celtic Church and early conversions were only apparent in the ruling elite, the masses [being Celts] remained pagan. Two influxes from Northern Europe [ Saxon and Norse ] strengthened the root paganism which exists right up to current day. It can be argued that Britain has never been christian and has always had a pagan heart. Proof ? - look to church attendances, currently about 6% and still falling with the General Synod of the Anglican Church predicting the demise of the Anglican Church as an organisation in less than 20 years.
So, I would like to reverse the original question to read "Can you be Christian without being pagan ?"

Originally Posted by Occultist

I really think you are confused maybe?
I am not picking a fight I am simply giving you information on Paganism.

What you posted is not information on paganism. It's a Christian polemic against perceived pagan practices present in many modern sects, and uses pseudo-scholarship in an attempt to validate their bias.

Telling me to go away will not help you to understand how this is plain fact.
I have studied Theology and Occult practices for over 20 yrs. Again if you scroll up and really read what I said instead and stop being defensive you will see me say "even though I don't like web information I will link this.
So you have a better understanding. I am positive you are a bright funny intelligent person everyone cannot know everything. This forum was built to educate people and help people grow. Not to tell people to stop talking.
I admire your opinions on things I admire everyone's opinions.
If you dont like mine feel free to prove me wrong.

You're right. I came off as a little invective. I apologize.

But you, see, what you linked is easily disproved by basic knowledge of linguistics and Akkadian mythology. They mention Ba'al; which Ba'al? It was an epithet for lots of gods, and even used in a secular capacity and simply meant 'lord'. They assert that Ishtar was pronounced "easter"; sources? They cite nothing to support their views, and some people are gullible enough to take them on good faith. It's that kind of attitude that's set back the modern neo-pagan movement because so many cling to the idea of great mother goddesses, matriarchal societies, underground witch-cults, and other shoddy scholarship as being historically correct & it only severs us further from our ancestral beliefs. Making a fantasy world isn't going to help us recover and revive pagan customs and traditions.

Here is an interesting picture...It may have some bearing on the subject matter that this thread appears to have adopted...or not,

http://www.lastrefuge.co.uk/images-d...ton-henge1.jpg

Though for me personally it illustrates very well how for the purposes of converting Pagans , without too much upheaval and disruption to pre existing ways the early Christians went about revising the old way.

The Picture is of Knowlton Henge incidentally.

[norseman]

Neville, that one photo sums up the subject perfectly.

At least once a month I do a meditation in what is regarded as the finest Norman Cathedral in Europe solely because there is an ancient pagan holy place in the foundations, part of the Bronze/Iron Age hill fort [later a Roman Army camp ]
Also, we might like to consider the very old churches in Britain, mostly Saxon, which have carvings of pagan gods in their structure.
As I said earlier, in Britain, pagan and christian are closely interwoven.

Animus27 everyone is intitled to the own opinion. Like Norse pointed out the word Paganism has a broad spectrum. I admire your passion and you knowledge on the subject matter. I never posted any Christian Views I simply dont have any I was not raised Christian nor is anyone in my family Christian. I respect there views and ethics just like everyone else that simply is not mine though. I respect your views although they are not mine.
You seem to have a knee jerk reaction and seem to be comparing Christianity and Paganism. I do not compare those I was simply saying that Christians do alot of Pagan rituals that they are not even aware of. The resurrection of Jesus Christ simply can be celebrated anyway those people feel but dying eggs and waiting on the Easter bunny is no way guided towards the resurrection. It is and will ever be a Pagan practise I am sorry this confuses you.

I never denied the fact that the Easter bunny, dyeing eggs and gifting baskets and eat peeps weren't Christian in origin. But the problem is that we don't know whether dyeing eggs and telling kids about the Easter bunny are even present in pre-Christian Europe. The Easter bunny itself isn't even really known until the 19th century. Simply stating that "they're pagan" doesn't help broaden understanding.

I never posted any Christian Views I simply dont have any I was not raised Christian nor is anyone in my family Christian.

uh... Did you even pay attention to the site you linked with all of the "information on paganism"?

Please read the URL before you click, and take notice that this is clearly not a scholarly resource and wouldn't likely know a hymn to Ishtar if it bit them in the face: http://www.lasttrumpetministries.org/

Originally Posted by Endless_Love_2_you

Hi I know this my sound funny but I like some of the rituals Pagans do but Im a die- hard christian. But reading this book made me think of all the rituals pagans do and it seem pretty intresting ,nice and down right fun. I would kinda want that in my life but not hurt my faith. I hope I dont offend anybody hear I respect this religion. I was also wondering what kinds of seramonies and rituals are out there I kinda know about the halloween one / Samhain. That intrests me alot thanks !!

I find this post to be very sweet.

I began practicing PaganRituals as a Christian--who never found her niche.

My Rituals had heavy Christian overtones and (at first) did not even recognize the Mother.

Over-time--my practiced progressed and (after 4 years) I dedicated myself to the Goddess.

Start with Ann Moura's "GreenWitchcraft" vol. 1--it will outline the Wheel-of-the-Year for you and many other things. She is all-inclusive and you can use the the Holy Masculine Trinity--if that is what your prefer.

Peace and Love on your path to discovering the Mysteries...

Blessed be...

Ostara, Goddess of Spring and the Dawn (Oestre / Eastre)

Easter is named for a Saxon goddess who was known by the names of Oestre or Eastre, and in Germany by the name of Ostara. She is a goddess of the dawn and the spring, and her name derives from words for dawn, the shining light arising from the east. Our words for the "female hormone" estrogen derives from her name.

Ostara was, of course, a fertility goddess. Bringing in the end of winter, with the days brighter and growing longer after the vernal equinox, Ostara had a passion for new life. Her presence was felt in the flowering of plants and the birth of babies, both animal and human. The rabbit (well known for its propensity for rapid reproduction) was her sacred animal.

Easter eggs and the Easter Bunny both featured in the spring festivals of Ostara, which were initially held during the feasts of the goddess Ishtar | Inanna. Eggs are an obvious symbol of fertility, and the newborn chicks an adorable representation of new growth. Brightly colored eggs, chicks, and bunnies were all used at festival time to express appreciation for Ostara's gift of abundance. The history of Easter Eggs as a symbol of new life should come as no surprise. The notion that the Earth itself was hatched from an egg was once widespread and appears in creation stories ranging from Asian to Ireland.

Eggs, in ancient times in Northern Europe, were a potent symbol of fertility and often used in rituals to guarantee a woman's ability to bear children. To this day rural "grannywomen" (lay midwives/healers in the Appalachian mountains) still use eggs to predict, with uncanny accuracy, the sex of an unborn child by watching the rotation of an egg as it is suspended by a string over the abdomen of a pregnant woman.
Eggs.
Dyed eggs are given as gifts in many cultures. Decorated eggs bring with them a wish for the prosperity of the abundance during the coming year.
Easter Candy
Folklore suggests that Easter egg hunts arose in Europe during "the Burning Times", when the rise of Christianity led to the shunning (and persecution) of the followers of the "Old Religion". Instead of giving the eggs as gifts the adults made a game of hiding them, gathering the children together and encouraging them to find the eggs. Some believe that the authorities seeking to find the "heathens" would follow or bribe the children to reveal where they found the eggs so that the property owner could be brought to justice.

Easter is 100% Pagan I dont know what more you want? Or we you seem tense against me.

Easter is 100% Pagan I dont know what more you want? Or we you seem tense against me.

Did you read any of my post? Any at all?

Eggs and the easter bunny have nothing to do with the actual holiday of Easter. If you go to an Ethiopian church, or ask a christian in Spain, or Israel what an Easter egg is, you'd get a resounding "Huh?" unless the person is familiar with folk traditions of Americans and parts of Northern Europe.

Then there's the issue that all of your claims are only half truths at best. Like I mentioned before, we know nothing of Eostre besides what Bede said, and even then, we cannot be 100% sure if he invented her, excluding discoveries that support a cult of Eostre in pre-conversion A-S England.
"Ostara" is a reconstructed name. There's no actual attributes assigned to her historically, because the name is invented by linguists. It's totally fine if you see her as a goddess of springtime, the dawn and fertility, lots of neo-pagans do, and even I am personally inclined to, much of the time. But it's not historical. You cannot cite Germanic goddesses as the origin of Easter when Easter was already a set holiday by the time the Church began converting the Germanic peoples.

You can believe in whatever you want. People do it all the time. But you can't deny simple facts about the way Paschal (Easter) originated. Regardless of some perceived "pagan" influences in the christian church.