Taking refuge

[Gem]

Originally Posted by muffin

Good afternoon Gem

No, just being nosy Sorry all gobbledygook to me, forever looking up words and meanings etc.

Yes. It's often a lot of semantics , so I'll keep that in mind.

[muffin]

Originally Posted by Gem

Yes. It's often a lot of semantics , so I'll keep that in mind.

Thanks, there is know need, others will understand you just fine.
I was pointed into another direction other than Buddhism. Just pop over here now and again to see what others are up too.

[Gem]

Originally Posted by muffin

Thanks, there is know need, others will understand you just fine.
I was pointed into another direction other than Buddhism. Just pop over here now and again to see what others are up too.

Most readers have some general interest, so there's probably no point getting overly technical, so in the OP I didn't go into 'what refuge is' (Sky kindly provided a good explanation, though). I did take refuge and I made the vows of morality in the formal way, so I guess I could say quite a lot, but it's irrelevant to anyone who isn't going to take refuge - the vast majority of readers here.

I'm trying to talk about it, 'taking refuge', in the broader sense, in a way that's pertinent to us thread participants. Is it safe here? How do we make sure it is safe? What shouldn't we do? What qualities combine to make something worthy of being called 'a refuge'? You know, we can read Sky's post and know what it is, but then, in a day or two from now, the drama will start, and we can tell that we don't actually understand it, even though we 'know' what it is from Sky's excellent post.

Then it becomes relevant ourselves, in our ethics, conduct, speech, intents and so on, which is a more meaningful introspection.

[sky]

Originally Posted by Ground

"Monks, be islands unto yourselves, be your own refuge, having no other; let the Dhamma be an island and a refuge to you, having no other. Those who are islands unto themselves... should investigate to the very heart of things ...


http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipit....043.wlsh.html


This is valid reliable refuge. No teacher, no sangha but rational analysis and authentic buddhist texts (= 'dhamma').
Why?
Because only if one validly knows for oneself imperturbable certainty can arise.


Most people nowadays however take refuge in each other: fearfully they flock together like a herd of sheep affirming each others ignorance or waiting for one to stand up or to appear to tell them where to go and whom they then follow blindly. Those will continually waver between belief and doubt and anxiously grasp at and defend their empty beliefs like precious diamonds but never attain imperturbable certainty. Poor sheep.

Bah...Bah....