Is there a society for enlightened people?

Originally Posted by shivatar

because I really want to be a part of that!!

I'll settle for some websites that are of questionable validity as a place to start though.

I Love it when the Universe comes back at me and in its own sweet way says "Y'know kiddo, you're not so bonkers after all." Spirituality has it back-to-front -
"Enlightenment is man's release from his self-incurred tutelage. Tutelage is man's inability to make use of his understanding without direction from another. Self-incurred is this tutelage when its cause lies not in lack of reason but in lack of resolution and courage to use it without direction from another. Sapere aude! 'Have courage to use your own reason!'- that is the motto of enlightenment."
Immanuel Kant

Originally Posted by Gem

What we say it is doesn't necessarily represent what it is, unless in is actually arbitrary, which makes no sense at all - then there is the issue of exclusiveness of such a society, and how to define the membership criteria teehee.

I've never seen anything from any of the gurus where they declare themselves 'enlightened', they might talk about it and how to achieve it but it always seems more of a letting go than an 'adding on'. Then again sometimes Spirituality doesn't make sense, but then God made man and man made belief systems.

Oh, and if there are no floppy hats and flowery dresses the membership cards aren't going to make a difference.

Originally Posted by jonesboy

I would have to disagree with this.

If one was to take the time to learn what is meant in the various traditions we would know that it isn't just what anyone thinks it is but a true state of being beyond local mind.

I picked up a brilliant maxim the other day, one of those ones that are so damned simple yet so damned profound. "Words create worlds." In this case it goes nicely with "Your reality is defined by your perceptions, your perceptions are defined by your beliefs and your beliefs are defined by your definitions." When we're enlightened as to what reality we're actually creating for ourselves perhaps we'll have good ground to stand on.

Originally Posted by MicroMacro

:)

How enlightened is the person who says to another "You think you're WHAT?!"

Enlightenment includes inclusivity - an arena for growth. It's welcoming. Like a hug.

I was working through something in my mind one day and tying myself in knots. Then my Guide popped in and said "It is encompassing." When we can encompass another's 'non-enlightenment'?

Originally Posted by shivatar

There are more enlightened people than the gurus and monks in caves. In other words the expectation of what enlightenment was or wasn't was blocking me from being able to realize enlightened beings in all their varying degrees.

What does enlightenment mean to you personally, or did you just grab that definition on the way past because it's Spiritual? What are your own definitions? What criteria do you judge against in defining someone - including yourself - as enlightened or not?

Are you enlightened as to how your definitions create your reality?

Everyone and everything is potentially something we can gain enlightenment from. And to be honest, I'd go back to your OP because I reckon there's something there that will shed some light on all of this.

Originally Posted by jonesboy

I tend to think when we are ready an opportunity will arise. Then it is up to us to take it.

"When the pupil is ready the teacher will come," the 'real' Law of Attraction. The Universe is a reflection of us.

[Gem]

Originally Posted by Greenslade

I've never seen anything from any of the gurus where they declare themselves 'enlightened', they might talk about it and how to achieve it but it always seems more of a letting go than an 'adding on'. Then again sometimes Spirituality doesn't make sense, but then God made man and man made belief systems.

Oh, and if there are no floppy hats and flowery dresses the membership cards aren't going to make a difference.

I saw zen koan the other day which was something like - "The monk has meditated for 10 years, so why is he not yet enlightened?" (I can't even remember the rest of it).

Yes there is said to be a letting go aspect and a direct discovery aspect, but in either case, a 'non-self', an 'anatta', seems to be the core of nirvana, and it perhaps the greatest irony when the discovery of self is the absence thereof. Yep. Makes no sense! I wonder what implies regarding the answer to koans.

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by Gem

I saw zen koan the other day which was something like - "The monk has meditated for 10 years, so why is he not yet enlightened?" (I can't even remember the rest of it).

Yes there is said to be a letting go aspect and a direct discovery aspect, but in either case, a 'non-self', an 'anatta', seems to be the core of nirvana, and it perhaps the greatest irony when the discovery of self is the absence thereof. Yep. Makes no sense! I wonder what implies regarding the answer to koans.

The goose is out!

[linen53]

Quite honestly I would think "enlightenment" means different things to different people. And I also believe there are levels of enlightenment, i.e., stage, one, stage two, stage three, etc.

Enlightenment to me means to have figured it all out. No more questions to ask; that's the final stage on the earth plane. But once you go to the next phase of your journey (off planet, figuratively speaking) you start all over again. Stage, one, stage two, stage three, etc.

Originally Posted by Gem

I saw zen koan the other day which was something like - "The monk has meditated for 10 years, so why is he not yet enlightened?" (I can't even remember the rest of it).

Yes there is said to be a letting go aspect and a direct discovery aspect, but in either case, a 'non-self', an 'anatta', seems to be the core of nirvana, and it perhaps the greatest irony when the discovery of self is the absence thereof. Yep. Makes no sense! I wonder what implies regarding the answer to koans.

It's just my own perceptions, no Universal Truths are implied or intended but sometimes talking to Spiritual people feels like walking through treacle, in the way Treebear the Ent thought walking south felt like walking down hill. It's as though they're carrying the weight of all that Spirituality inside them and they have to maintain this high-vibrational state of existence. I've met some really 'vibrationally light', non-Spiritual people and there's this beautiful energetic glow surrounding them. Gimme that glow every time. Is this what en-light-ened really means, playing on words?

Enlightenment doesn't come to those that seek it, because in seeking it we tell ourselves that we are lacking or missing something; that we are not enough. That is out of harmony with a Universe that tells you something completely different - that we are enough. When your head isn't filled with chasing what you think you lack the Universe can show you that you already are that which you seek.