Experienced Meditation Practioner: Empty minds during meditation: How Realistic?

[modene1]

Hello,

I'm new to these forums. I've practiced meditation on and off over the years. Recently I've been able to manage a 20 min meditation each morning, focusing on my breathing.

I find, as do many, that it's nigh impossible to switch off the constant flow of thoughts. Even when I try to simply observe them and let them fly by, I find myself getting caught up in them.

It's worth noting that I suffer from excessive anxiety, so when meditating the most common ideas are problems that stress me out and are begging for some form of resolution.

Luckily, I've twice experienced in my life a brief moment of reprieve from the constant flow. Once when learning transcendental meditation and the other in a near fatal accident. The states were simply bliss. Complete freedom.

My question is this. Are these states realistic in terms of attainability? I'm guessing that the notion of having a goal isn't a great way to work with meditation. It's not exactly simply *being*.

So, let's put it another way - I honestly feel I'm making no progress and in fact often feel I'm going backwards. As a teacher, I'm aware that progress is often unnoticeable by the learner, but is for sure happening.

I guess what I'm looking for is some hope. I realise the answer is probably to try to relax and just go with the flow. It's just hard.

Erg! So, what have I achieved here? lol.

Thanks for reading. Any comments welcomed.

[gerrygriz]

Hi modene. I used to have terrible struggles quieting the inside voice. Like a party with loud voices all around. I've developed some simple mental exercises to find silence, but, it was a little scary at first. Everybody else at the party shuts up and then I notice how loud I've been talking the whole time. I can't recall what my last thought was and then start noticing how quiet it is..and poof! I'm back to listening to my inside voice. I've since learned how to follow the wave of silence and can really find extended peace and quiet between my ears. It does get a little "profound" after a bit.

One of the more basic exercises is to use an imaginary foot to press a button. This takes advantage of our brains tendency to not walk and talk at the same time. The brain creates a wave of "silence" like the edge of an opaque curtain and you just let your brain follow it at a distance.

I would be glad to share the details with you if this sounds like something that would be useful. The only thing we would need is to know which is your dominant eye. There are different tests all over the internet. (I can't post links yet). This is important to the exercise so we know which foot to use and which direction the wave of silence will travel so you can follow correctly.

Take care

[Sagar]

My master says that mind can never e emptied of thoughts. The core work of mind is to think. It is near to impossible to empty the mind.

[Miss Hepburn]

I was told decades ago by a bald man in saffron robes..very sweetly...
If your mind must think...then think this:
"I know You're there. I will wait. Ha, why do You hide from me?
You are funny...alright I will sit...I will show You that I want You to come..."
And so on...

You say you focus on your breath..but why, because someone suggested it?
Or is it because you know that every living thing breathes; that this is the link from this finite world to the
spiritual world...this is what connects you to the mystical?
See the difference?

You mind thinks, but the mind has another very powerful thing it does...it focuses like a laser...
but it must have something more powerful than itself to catch it's attention...
otherwise it is like a herd of wild horses untamed.
To a mechanic it is a problem under the hood that grabs his thoughts...you can walk up to him and he is so
absorbed he doesn't hear you.

Find that 'thing' that so absorbs and attracts the mind that
your focus
is as simple as looking into the eyes of your newborn baby in your arms.

What does all this point to...your intention...make your intention be
sweet and full of love...this feeling tops much of the chatter of the silly mind.
Start the meditation session with reverence and respect and intention...
and know that you and
'your Goal' are meant to join....to find each other.

[wstein]

Originally Posted by modene1

Hello,

I'm new to these forums. I've practiced meditation on and off over the years. Recently I've been able to manage a 20 min meditation each morning, focusing on my breathing.

I find, as do many, that it's nigh impossible to switch off the constant flow of thoughts. Even when I try to simply observe them and let them fly by, I find myself getting caught up in them.

Luckily, I've twice experienced in my life a brief moment of reprieve from the constant flow. Once when learning transcendental meditation and the other in a near fatal accident. The states were simply bliss. Complete freedom.

My question is this. Are these states realistic in terms of attainability? I'm guessing that the notion of having a goal isn't a great way to work with meditation. It's not exactly simply *being*.

So, let's put it another way - I honestly feel I'm making no progress and in fact often feel I'm going backwards. As a teacher, I'm aware that progress is often unnoticeable by the learner, but is for sure happening.

Welcome to the forums.

It is entirely possible to silence the mind chatter (voices in your head) not only for brief times but for hours at a stretch. I know because I experience it daily not only during meditation but in normal life.

As to thoughts, thinking still happens. What does go away are the idle musings, commentary, incessant trying to figure things out, constant evaluations/judgements. As I experience, this also can go away for hours at a time not just in meditation, but also in daily life.

I have recently become aware that many mediation teachers get no more than brief moments of inner quiet and only during meditation even after decades of practice. If you ask them, most will tell you they don't believe it to be possible. I find that sad.

As to why you are not apparently making more progress: it takes most people a long time (5+ years) to get to the stage of more than brief moments of relief. What happens in the early stages of practice is a reduction in the number of overlapping voices/thoughts. This can be subtle and hard to notice with all that commotion going on inside (until you get down to only a few at a time).

I encourage you to preserve. It is possible for most people to get longer periods of relief at least during meditation. After all, you did get there briefly a couple of times, you can do it.

[Still_Waters]

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn

Find that 'thing' that so absorbs and attracts the mind that
your focus
is as simple as looking into the eyes of your newborn baby in your arms.

Well put.

Once one is absorbed, as you duly pointed out, meditation becomes effortless.

[Still_Waters]

Originally Posted by wstein

It is entirely possible to silence the mind chatter (voices in your head) not only for brief times but for hours at a stretch. I know because I experience it daily not only during meditation but in normal life.

Eventually, as you pointed out, silence can be sustained continuously for extended periods of time. As a matter of fact, it becomes the natural state and, at that point, one activates the mind only when "second nature" comes into play.

[Gem]

All I'd say is, be conscious of the aversions you may have toward the noisy mind, as well as the desires for it to be some other way. Breath is probably the way to go as you have already decided to go with that. You wander off , remember the breath, wander off and remember again. That's the way of it so all good.

[BlazingEssence]

Yes, it is possible.
There are many ways. Some need effort, some make you just let the things be( like observing the thoughts

I will post a simple method or send you private message if want. Else you can try your OWN...

Main & only ingredient necessary- BELIEF (that it will work)...
Your input should be- purely sincere effort & it will work. You have to love what you are doing and be 100% devoted.

[don't worry if it seem impossible, it all happens by itself when you want it to happen]