Illusion vs reality

[Belle]

This is my new awakening, it's harsh!

It started when I observed a lot of folk at work who would chit chat all day long and then spend a lot of time talking about how busy they were, and how much work they had. Five minutes of work would then be done and then more chit chat chit chat. I've never noticed people talk more ! But they so believed in their busy-ness.

And there are others - I have my illusion - one is a mantra which must roll over from a previous life "I can't afford ..." when the truth is "I can afford ..." but I truly believe i can't afford. I'm sure I have other illusions.

I had a friend staying at the weekend who moaned about a lot of things but this was interspersed with "I'm a very positive person" - it was said as a threat!

And I guess what I'm wanting to work out - is how to manage myself around the illusion and reality. And how to integrate reality into my life and wake up from illusion.

I will say - we all have a degree of illusion I believe, we all have aspects of our lives that our coloured by our biases or past lives or upbringings - and we clash with others as their realities are not our realities - as we are clouded by illusion.

I know I get flashes of reality, but it is my reality - and it is my reality - but how to deal with the clash of illusion and reality?

Well if illusion to you is a matter of believing you can afford something when you can't or vice versa, then maybe you should recheck what the 'illusion' really is. Maybe that's why you are having to deal with 'illusion vs reality'. Sometimes the things we don't want to face, the things we call 'illusions', are actually more real than ever. It's just a matter of having to face certain things about reality we didn't want to see before due to our pride and holding up walls.

Example: I find a lot of misconceptions within 'new age' doctrine that tells people to ignore reality and focus on what feels good to their body to create a better reality. And that suffering is just an illusion, there is no suffering, its all one, its all love, blah blah.. Sorry to bring up an extreme example for the PG audience here but tell that to the 3 girls that were locked in that guys basement for 10 years... That their suffering is just an illusion and they are just in a 'victim mentality'.

Maybe you should stop worrying about what other people are doing and focus on what you have in your life or 'reality'. Maybe you are wanting to distract yourself from facing difficult things in your life by focusing on what others are doing and letting petty things other people are doing bother you so much you have to come on a Spiritual forum to talk about it. Not trying to be rough, just saying reality can be a real stickler to face sometimes. Especially in a world this corrupt. A lot of people have a hard time facing the fact that there is more to reality other than fast food, sports, taxes, and Hollywood. If this didn't help at all, maybe you can describe more about what 'illusion' means to you?

[Belle]

Hi no that was not what my thought was. I have money. I believe I can't afford. There's the illusion.

And it's not about worrying about other people. It's about accepting their reality is real when it disconnects with mine so wildly. you see it creates a lot of noise in my mind. I'm bombarded with a chaos. It's part of being empathic. But it's also about other people. A friend who has marriage difficulties as her reality is different from her husband's.

And also shattering my illusions. Or integrating them. There are things in this world that are real. And things that are illusions - lies that we create to serve our ego. Suffering is not an illusion. Suffering is real.

Yes I shd focus on my path but my path is about dealing with the disconnect that occurs when I'm smacked in the face by an illusion. Even if the other person truly believes it.

[muileag]

At one point we created these illusions, though most of the time we do so unknowingly. Some of our illusions we inherit through our birth family. I'm not sure what triggers our eyes being opened so we can see them for what they are, or why it sometimes never happens to some people even when they've lived for decades. Perhaps the "veil" is stripped away for all people but some refuse to keep it off once it's removed (they just construct another illusion).

Originally Posted by Belle

Hi no that was not what my thought was. I have money. I believe I can't afford. There's the illusion.

And it's not about worrying about other people. It's about accepting their reality is real when it disconnects with mine so wildly. you see it creates a lot of noise in my mind. I'm bombarded with a chaos. It's part of being empathic. But it's also about other people. A friend who has marriage difficulties as her reality is different from her husband's.

And also shattering my illusions. Or integrating them. There are things in this world that are real. And things that are illusions - lies that we create to serve our ego. Suffering is not an illusion. Suffering is real.

Yes I shd focus on my path but my path is about dealing with the disconnect that occurs when I'm smacked in the face by an illusion. Even if the other person truly believes it.

If you have money, then why would you have a belief in the first place about not being able to afford something? Are you creating an unnecessary illusion within your thoughts just for the sake of creating an unnecessary illusion? Why would someone else's reality, not coinciding with yours, bother you when it is something as simple as hearing someone's conversation? Can you really not handle over hearing someone at work talking because you are too 'empathetic'? Are you sure you aren't just reacting and calling it 'empathy'? Since their reality is real, what is the illusion you are talking about in the first place? Their reality can not be a lie that serves your ego. That is a very egocentric thing to think... Especially to think that about someone who is just having a conversation at work that seems to bother you...

[Joe Mc]

Sounds like your thinking mind if we could call it that is general is operating and running the show. I've heard it said that, the thinking mind, rational or intellectual mind is a bad master but a good servant ?

it creates a lot of noise in my mind. I'm bombarded with a chaos.

I had that stuff going on alot in my mind, it was painful and debilitating for me if its the same type of stuff. I found Buddhist meditation and now it has gone over the years. There is something that can be nourished and awakened realised, with and beyond the thinking mind if your like. Maybe something in life is asking or inviting you to go deeper and to go beyond these apparently petty things. It sounds to me like the voice of truth is inviting you to go deeper and to find the light if might call it that beyond reason ? Thankyou.

Originally Posted by Belle

This is my new awakening, it's harsh!

It started when I observed a lot of folk at work who would chit chat all day long and then spend a lot of time talking about how busy they were, and how much work they had. Five minutes of work would then be done and then more chit chat chit chat. I've never noticed people talk more ! But they so believed in their busy-ness.

And there are others - I have my illusion - one is a mantra which must roll over from a previous life "I can't afford ..." when the truth is "I can afford ..." but I truly believe i can't afford. I'm sure I have other illusions.

I had a friend staying at the weekend who moaned about a lot of things but this was interspersed with "I'm a very positive person" - it was said as a threat!

And I guess what I'm wanting to work out - is how to manage myself around the illusion and reality. And how to integrate reality into my life and wake up from illusion.

I will say - we all have a degree of illusion I believe, we all have aspects of our lives that our coloured by our biases or past lives or upbringings - and we clash with others as their realities are not our realities - as we are clouded by illusion.

I know I get flashes of reality, but it is my reality - and it is my reality - but how to deal with the clash of illusion and reality?

Most of us are ordinary persons but there are adepts too, here and there. Both of these types are surrounded by variations of truths caused by a continual onslaught of illusion. It is true too that we share these. The constructs of emotional matter that we recognize so easily. They are real to us yet if the will is strong enough they seem to fade. This is the plight of us all, almost. The adepts among us have learned to manage them. They stand quietly in the midst of turmoil ever able to think clearly. At will these men and women leave behind their lower personality selves and shift to the higher or soul mind.

Just above I said that illusions fade. This really was not true. They remain. It is we who move away from them giving yet another illusion. The illusion of illusions fading. Through correct training and the investment of years we do this. It is a necessary part of spiritual growth. Look forward to the time and smile to yourself in confidence. One of the roles of religion is to teach their versions of these skills. A Christian will have faith and trust and it works. The student achieves. This is just an example.

For those who would learn there are schools that teach. Meditation is key. Humility and spiritual silence are the tools. The quieting of the busy mind is the result.

Blessings...

[Belle]

Lots of useful stuff about meditation - and I'm wondering if I am being blown apart because I've just started a meditation group?

At one point we created these illusions, though most of the time we do so unknowingly. Some of our illusions we inherit through our birth family. I'm not sure what triggers our eyes being opened so we can see them for what they are, or why it sometimes never happens to some people even when they've lived for decades. Perhaps the "veil" is stripped away for all people but some refuse to keep it off once it's removed (they just construct another illusion).

muileag that was beautifully put. I'm keen to move into reality and not create a new illusion and yet the transition is somewhat disorientating. It's like not having been able to see, having bought into stuff and now I can see it differently. It's about being non-judgmental and accepting that others have a different reality because illusions are often an individual reality.

[Belle]

Originally Posted by Kaythizzle

If you have money, then why would you have a belief in the first place about not being able to afford something? Are you creating an unnecessary illusion within your thoughts just for the sake of creating an unnecessary illusion? Why would someone else's reality, not coinciding with yours, bother you when it is something as simple as hearing someone's conversation? Can you really not handle over hearing someone at work talking because you are too 'empathetic'? Are you sure you aren't just reacting and calling it 'empathy'? Since their reality is real, what is the illusion you are talking about in the first place? Their reality can not be a lie that serves your ego. That is a very egocentric thing to think... Especially to think that about someone who is just having a conversation at work that seems to bother you...

I'm seeking, like many others here, and gave examples as to how things were shaping up in my search. I'm curious as to the reaction that this has caused in you.

We have to remember that we make reality within ourselves, just as we succumb to illusion (often by reading more comfortable interpretations of whatever the signs are. Sometimes the opposite where we can read something as worse that it might be if considered more rationally). Less evolved folk will make their "reality" as they choose, often oblivious of whether they're engaging with illusion. Sometimes what might seem an illusion can appear as "reality" from a different viewpoint.

It started when I observed a lot of folk at work who would chit chat all day long and then spend a lot of time talking about how busy they were, and how much work they had. Five minutes of work would then be done and then more chit chat chit chat. I've never noticed people talk more ! But they so believed in their busy-ness.

They probably hadn't evaluated their situation from an observational viewpoint who might spot reality in the social importance of the workplace, rather than whether they were busy or not. It's in the nature of people to like to be acknowledged and small-talk is often a means to achieve self-acknowledgement. So an aspect of reality is the social content of the workplace.

It's quite difficult to sort out illusion in one's life because much is tied in with our environment, the people around us, social expectation and our expectation of ourselves. We can, however, try to tell the truth to ourselves - but that presumes getting to know ourselves, the process of which is fraught with the threat of illusion.

Was I a woman dreaming that I was a butterfly or now, a butterfly dreaming that I'm a woman?