what would the world be like

[running]

Originally Posted by livingkarma

Twice as much due to technology ...
Can't go backwards only forward ...
And try our best to restore/revive the earth ...
Otherwise, it's like crying over spilled milk ...

The majority of us do our share of polluting the environment ...
Those who drive 18 wheelers/vehicles, ride buses, commuter trains as well as consumers of pre-packaged foods, household goods, garden supplies, housing, etc ...
I live near a centrally located Wal-mart to 5 pueblos ...
I can smell/taste the fumes from all the natives coming in daily for supplies including the 18 wheelers that supply the Wal-mart & surrounding stores ...
Pueblos w/out a casino still have no indoor plumbing or electricity ...
We have no burn days, water conservation during certain hours of the day, recycling centers, set days of the year for hunting, etc ...
I'm happy we're working toward a more eco-friendly society ...
I sincerely understand what you're saying at the same time I prefer to accept the now rather than think about how my life could've been had I lived in a different era - like a slave ...

when I drive it feeds the slaves to jndustrialization. I haul reefer(food)and have to work so others and i can eat. So they and i don't starve to death. Its the way it is. I accept how life is. Its not by choice. Its by necessity. Looking at our mistakes is the first thing one has to do in order to fix a problem. So one has to look at how things were before the problems were created.

So I agree with what your saying in a way. But we are all slaves already. And looking at how we became so is a good first step IMO.

Originally Posted by linen53

They were at war with each other constantly. They left their old at the edge of the village to die of exposure and hunger. The women were more servants than mates in most tribes but not all. They would permanently kick a member of the tribe out for breaking the rules. They took slaves into their tribes to live out their lives working in very hard conditions.

Female members of the tribe were married off as young children, and yes, expected to preform sex with their husbands at 10 or 12 years of age. A husband could and would "divorce" himself from a wife if he didn't like or want her anymore. And if the husband did divorce himself from a wife she might never see her children again. And she was expected to survive the best she could; a woman's survival was dependent on having a husband that could take care of her and provide her with food and shelter.

Many tribes were at the point of starvation during the winter because they did not have the tools, horses or access to the land necessary to feed their children.

No, I don't think I would like to live in this harsh environment.

Hi there. It is with utmost respect that I would like to point out that your description of Indigenous peoples way of life is not accurate. If you ever get a chance, talk to some Native American/Aboriginal peoples - especially Elders and knowledge keepers - to find out more about our people other than this very sad and rather offensive image. This portrayal sounds like it came from the vaults of 1950s Hollywood westerns and some of those ridiculous sci-fi novels written about Aboriginal peoples by non-Aboriginal people who perceive us as savages. I mean no offense or harm in this reply; I just wanted to point out to you a different - and accurate - picture of who we are as a cultural group (generally speaking, as there is so much differences between the hundreds of Indigenous cultures here on North America.)

Please allow me to share a few characteristics of our Indigenous peoples about how we lived before colonization (circa 1700s), and how more and more of us are returning to as a sacred way of living life harmoniously with All Our Relations.

Many Indigenous nations across North America were matrilineal and matriarchal - which means women were very much respected as caring and intuitive leaders and decision makers. It was actually the women who decided to divorce and could do so if their husbands were not acting like respectful partners.

Our Elders were not left to starve before the wars upon Indigenous peoples were launched. Yes, sometimes when people were fleeing the armies out to extinguish them, the old fell and pleaded to be left behind so the younger could flee to safety. But before this time (google "Trail of Tears" sometime), our Elders were lovingly tended to and were ushered into the Spirit world surrounded by their families, in the comfort and warmth of the home.

The inter-tribal wars erupted after North America got invaded by peoples coming in from other countries and the ones who saw a way to profit from this beautiful land and took way more than what was needed to live comfortably - capitalism began to spread like poison across the land and it became the dominant economy that choked out our traditional economies that were based on respect and trust and honourable agreements. People who are starving and marginalized tend to fight over the few scraps left by the greedy colonizers - it's what happens to humans when they see their loved ones die from starvation and they have no freedom to live self-sustainably any more.

Pedophilia in the form of forced marriage of children was also non-existent before colonization. In my knowledge I have never heard of this ... perhaps it happened but again it was not our traditional pre-colonization ways. Children were seen - and still are in - by our peoples as gifts from Creator and as such, are treated with much care and tenderness. Again, the tragic stories you hear about in the news are all results of colonization and ethnocide (and in some cases genocide).

If you are interested, read literature by Vine Deloria Jr., Paula Gunn Allen, fiction by Richard Wagamese and Joseph Boyden, Emma LaRocque, Beth Brant, Ruby Slipperjack, Drew Hayden Taylor - just for starters. You will find accurate information as it comes from our own people rather than those who portray us in a racist and ignorant light. Miigwetch.

Originally Posted by Thunder Bow

We live in an over populated world. As our population increases more land is taken for crop production and livestock production. That means habitat loss and extinction of more animal species.

You are so right, Thunder Bow. Dominant society has a huge death phobia, and nature is overpowered by too many humans staying alive/being born and taking way too much from the planet.

Originally Posted by knightofalbion

What has dairy got to do with horticulture?
And what? ET???? Atlantis?
Are you reading the same thread as everyone else?

You claim to be a Native American and you've never heard of the Three Sisters?
Native Americans didn't eat grains until the 1800s? It was the Native Americans who gave corn to the world. They were growing it and eating it for hundreds, even thousands of years.
http://www.iroquoismuseum.org/three_sisters.htm

@ ciquala - that's okay - one Indigenous person cannot be an expert about every Indigenous culture on the planet. That is an assumption that many non-Indigenous people make. I`m not sure why - we don`t expect every European person to know everything there is to know about every European culture.

Originally Posted by keith95843

I asked this question not to start a arguement but more to make you think about the simplicity of that life style of life. Our native brothers and sisters lived a far better life then after the white snake arrived . Sure life was tough its still tough thats what make us strong. Open your minds and see the beauty of how life once was. now we send our old to nursing homes were there is no life put me on road to die

Poor keith! You unknowingly opened a door to a highly politicized topic! That's okay - it was still a good thread starter and I respect your OP and its honest inquiry about a life of peoples who thrived way before capitalism and technology and all the corporate greed we see so much of today.

The Native people of this land have been here for over 14,000 years and it was still and amazing land of live and love and in less than 300 years it has been sucked dry who are the savages now who are the ignorant now and who now turns to the native people now for spiritual help EVERYONE

[running]

Originally Posted by keith95843

The Native people of this land have been here for over 14,000 years and it was still and amazing land of live and love and in less than 300 years it has been sucked dry who are the savages now who are the ignorant now and who now turns to the native people now for spiritual help EVERYONE

All one has to do is step outside almost anywhere. Open their eyes and see the proof. Its not debatable. The proof is literally everywhere. I personally see 48 states worth of proof.

Originally Posted by keith95843

The Native people of this land have been here for over 14,000 years and it was still and amazing land of live and love and in less than 300 years it has been sucked dry who are the savages now who are the ignorant now and who now turns to the native people now for spiritual help EVERYONE

Your post has certainly raised the issue & awareness of eco-friendliness ...

History continues to repeat itself w/regards to human abuse ...
For example, natives had slavery ....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery...nited_State s

We have modern day slavery; it is called human trafficking ...
http://www.gvnet.com/humantrafficking/USA.htm

"Back then" we simply had a better environment to suffer abuse & to war on ...

I'm surrounded by pueblos; the word pueblo is Spanish for town or village - it is associated w/native americans ...
Each pueblo annually celebrates their catholic patron saint on what is known as "Feast Days" ...
Catholicism has been part of their history & culture since the 1600's ...
I try to attend as many Feast Days as possible to see the dances & support their way of life ...
Native American spiritualities are characterized by animism or panentheism in their beautiful dances as well as artwork ...
One is left to define their religious/spiritual beliefs on their own ...
Duality of native beliefs & catholicism? An assimilation of catholicism into native beliefs? ...
Anyway, watching the dances are spiritually uplifting as w/many other things I bring into my life ...
Scroll down to religion ...
http://www.gvnet.com/humantrafficking/USA.htm

I stopped studying my Austronesian spiritual beliefs as well as those of native american; I'm now onto an interest in aborigines ...
They have been around thousands of years longer than native americans ...
The spiritual beliefs of aborigines is linked to the land & spirit world as is native americans ...
I'm interested in learning their history & their spiritual beliefs including how christianity influenced them, if any, for those who go on a walkabout ...
It's all good ...

Native spiritualism is valuable in its own right as are all others ...

[running]

Its common knowledge Catholism has had a big impact in America. Some of the missions are still around. I know the Chumash were influenced. I think the most accurate information would be from the Natives themselves. Schools and the internet I would think wouldn't be accurate. And more than likely have a political agenda behind it. So I won't mention what I remember from school. Nor can I remember much from school anyways regarding missions.

One thing undeniable is the spread of Catholism has destroyed many cultures, killed, and enslaved many people in america. With the agenda of destroying as much non catholic information as possible. Its really disgusting. There was so much knowledge gone in the blink of an eye. That again is common knowledge. Somebody with more knowledge could say a whole lot more.

[running]

Edit..Never mind.