Jesus and the Father live in me, and are separate from me.

[sky]

Originally Posted by Honza

Yes I have plenty of interest in the East. It is just that I prefer the Western version.

When your comfortable with your own version then it's sensible to stay with it.

[sky]

Originally Posted by FallingLeaves

and how does that have anything to do with the truth content of the story?

'the truth content of the story?'


The truth for one is a lie for others, that can be a little confusing for some.

[theophilus]

Originally Posted by sky123

The truth for one is a lie for others, that can be a little confusing for some.

How can that which is true for one be a lie for someone else? It is God who determines what is true and what is false and we have an obligation to learn from God what is true and what is false.

[Honza]

Originally Posted by theophilus

How can that which is true for one be a lie for someone else? It is God who determines what is true and what is false and we have an obligation to learn from God what is true and what is false.

I am inclined to agree. I would say that truth is objective and can be learned from. sky argues that truth is relative to each person's understanding. Which makes truth subjective and 'unreal' except to that person.

[sky]

Originally Posted by Honza

I am inclined to agree. I would say that truth is objective and can be learned from. sky argues that truth is relative to each person's understanding. Which makes truth subjective and 'unreal' except to that person.

You can also learn from lies Honza... I am not arguing btw, just trying to discuss different ways of looking at things, you seem to see everything as an ' Argument ', that's negative

[anthony c]

Originally Posted by django

Jesus said, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word. My Father will love him, and we will come to him and make Our home with him."

They will come and live in me, but they are not me, and I am not them. They will guide me and I will follow, but I won't guide them, and they won't follow me.

This is Christian duality. Jesus sits on the right hand side of the Father, and maintains his separateness and individuality. Jesus and the Father will come.

The Father is shown as a caring being, one highly interested in the affairs of humanity. A being with his own consciousness, who 'interferes' with human destiny, who wants us to follow him and his Son. A being who wishes for our development in a certain direction.

I see it like this: We are not separate from God cause to be separate you have to be one side and God on the other and what is beyond we and God then?? Something has to be outside God and that is impossible as God is everything imo and much more of course!!!

We are inside or part of God but that is only one aspect of God, like that is the "body of God". Light/energy/holy spirit is what is inside God so to speak.

What Jesus meant is that the other aspect of God, the Holy spirit is what God and Jesus want's to come live inside us to help us expand.The way they can also live in your heart if you think of God and Jesus in your mind and love them so much that they are within you, live in your heat. See

There is more to it i think but this is what i understand about separation and oneness.

[Baile]

Originally Posted by FallingLeaves

the truth content of the story?

Excellent, now THERE'S the real question here.

In the "conscious awareness" version of the story, Rumpelstiltskin wasn't a silly man who spun straw to gold. He is a metaphor for the shadow-self who wants to take/steal away the eternal child in each of us. He does that by utilizing mundane material tricks: "bright and sparkling" magic to distract the unconscious material-bound soul. But it's not straw transformed to gold that we need. Rather, straw represents our lower self thoughts and deeds. Those lower self "lost-child" aspects of the human being, are meant to be transformed into higher self understanding and wisdom: the sun-filled golden reunion with one's eternal child-soul.

Likewise the very same applies to story ideas like "throne" and "right hand" and "son" and "father". The truth content of the story is revealed by penetrating beyond the mundane human-material interpretation, in order to understand the eternal aspects as they relate to the ever-searching soul.

Extra-added conscious-awareness bonus, free no charge: To "name" the shadow-self -- to see and recognize it for what it is -- is to conquer and dissipate it. That is why Rumpelstiltskin flew into a rage and ripped himself in two when the Queen guessed/spoke his real name.

[Baile]

Originally Posted by django

Jesus said, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word. My Father will love him, and we will come to him and make Our home with him."

Jesus is the "every man" representative of humanity. He says "we" and "our" because he includes himself as a member of our human soul collective. Like him, our brother, we too will all sit at the "right hand" of the Source... we will understand our role as soul-spirit aspect of that Source, carrying out the will of that Source.

[django]

Originally Posted by anthony c

I see it like this: We are not separate from God cause to be separate you have to be one side and God on the other and what is beyond we and God then?? Something has to be outside God and that is impossible as God is everything imo and much more of course!!!

We are inside or part of God but that is only one aspect of God, like that is the "body of God". Light/energy/holy spirit is what is inside God so to speak.

What Jesus meant is that the other aspect of God, the Holy spirit is what God and Jesus want's to come live inside us to help us expand.The way they can also live in your heart if you think of God and Jesus in your mind and love them so much that they are within you, live in your heat. See

There is more to it i think but this is what i understand about separation and oneness.

I imagine we are separated from God to the extent that we aren't doing His will.

I don't agree he meant the Holy Spirit here, because there is another quote where he says specifically that he will send the Holy Spirit.

Jesus was always very clear about his 'Father', and I don't imagine he would have used either term loosely, 'Father' or 'Holy Spirit', or used one term to mean another.

The only alternative for me is to say the gospels aren't an authentic recording, and therefore the statement "we will come to him and make our home with him" is meaningless.

[Baile]

Originally Posted by django

The only alternative for me is to say the gospels aren't an authentic recording, and therefore the statement "we will come to him and make our home with him" is meaningless.

Heh, now that's the way all life should work: "It's all true! That is, except for the stuff that doesn't make sense... that stuff's definitely meaningless."