The Relative Universe.

[Xan]

Curious Snowflake: I personally think that there is an essential Unity beyond the dualities, rather than duality being the basic nature of existence. Duality is a manifestation, not an actuality.

Yes... but we can know this beyond thinking, beyond the Idea of unity. It's an experiential knowing of the oneness... the wholeness. And this is something that some folks have already discovered while others, not yet.

In fact, those who do experience it don't mind being reminded, because of the joy.


CS: ...so much of quantum physics blurs the line between philosophy and science. That's part of the reason it fascinates me.

Yes... There really is no line between philosophy and science... and mysticism. They are just different ways of describing the same reality.


Xan

wasnt Lynne McTaggart in what the bleep?

when reading this thread i think of Taoism. is that right? doesn’t tao come to mind for you guys?

[Gem]

Originally Posted by CuriousSnowflake

That's basically what I was trying to say, that dualities are just points of view within a unified system. Take my favorite example, temperature. Let's take an arbitrary value within that system, say 47 F. How does that fit within the dualistic framework of "hot" and "cold"? There's no way to tell without another point of context. Are we in Anchorage in January? Miami in July? The surface of the sun? Or of Pluto? Without another point to compare it to, the dualism has no meaning. But the absolute idea of temperature remains. Even the number, 47 F, means nothing without other temperatures to compare it against, but that does not mean that the experience of what we call 47 F does not exist, just the comparative concept.

So it is with everything. Our experiences are absolute, but the comparisons we make against other things are relative, and therefore arbitrary.



Funny thing; her entire introduction is basically an explanation that she is completely unqualified to write about quantum physics, since she is just a journalist. But you're absolutely right, so much of quantum physics blurs the line between philosophy and science. That's part of the reason it fascinates me.

CS

Oh well she's not quallified... so it's nothing more than pop culture. Very profitable.

I agree with the temperature example, and the relationship between is a singular 'entity' that unifies the difference between things, so there is no absolute zero to attain and no upper limit to reach, so we set finite ranges to derive a quantity having no actual extremes, just a fractional diminishment and an infinite expansion, and furthurmore any finite portion regardless of size or range is equally proportionate to the infinite whole, ie infinitesimal.

[Gem]

Originally Posted by mahakali

when reading this thread i think of Taoism. is that right? doesn’t tao come to mind for you guys?

The Tao Te Ching is so poetic and interpretable, so I love it. Here's an online version.

http://www.wright-house.com/religion...-te-ching.html

It'snice to select a verse (chapter) at random and apply it to life, so I sometimes have phases where I open it every morning as a gentle reminder, and perhaps it influences my conduct that day.

Here's a random verse just for fun:

If you want to become whole,
first let yourself become broken.
If you want to become straight,
first let yourself become twisted.
If you want to become full,
first let yourself become empty.
If you want to become new,
first let yourself become old.
Those whose desires are few get them,
those whose desires are great go astray.

For this reason the Master embraces the Tao,
as an example for the world to follow.
Because she isn't self centered,
people can see the light in her.
Because she does not boast of herself,
she becomes a shining example.
Because she does not glorify herself,
she becomes a person of merit.
Because she wants nothing from the world,
the world can not overcome her.

When the ancient Masters said,
"If you want to become whole,
then first let yourself be broken,"
they weren't using empty words.
All who do this will be made complete.

Originally Posted by mahakali

wasnt Lynne McTaggart in what the bleep?

I think so. Never seen that but I've always wanted to.

CS

[BlueSky]

Originally Posted by mahakali

James those kitties are soooo cute! I love them. I bet they are brothers. brother cats always get along so well. can you explain this part further?

man those kitties are like the tao symbol yin/yang. their just adorable!

Hi mahakali,

I love them too but I don't know anything about them except that I got the picture off a site that has different pictures that represent Yin/Yang...so your observation was right on!
Blessings.........James

[Gem]

Originally Posted by CuriousSnowflake

I think so. Never seen that but I've always wanted to.

CS

I saw what the bleep and perhaps she was in it, it was a phseudo quantum physics come LOA type thing, but don't mind me, I never could understand why these things are taken seriously.

I just have a thing where I like music that is real, and have distaste for the pop industry, and that sentiment applies to all things pop, like Tolle and all that lot. I thought McTaggart was bona fide at first too, but since found she has no expertise in physics.

Oh dear, what's the world coming to? (Has mid age nervous crisis and mental breakdown).

In essence... I think the relationship is the essence of the universe, things inter-are, and love is like the feeling of this formal interdependancy, and these human relationships are like sharing everything we are, and I heard a word the other day 'Equanimy'... yeah, thats what I'm about!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFV0EKgQyrU&feature=related

If you want to become whole,
first let yourself become broken.
If you want to become straight,
first let yourself become twisted.
If you want to become full,
first let yourself become empty.
If you want to become new,
first let yourself become old.
Those whose desires are few get them,
those whose desires are great go astray.

beautiful, thanks for sharing that! There is inner meaning as well as the whole picture.

you should definitely see what the bleep, i don’t think it really fits into a category. Its amazing, i would think that you would enjoy it. get the down the rabbit hole version. Its like 6 hrs long if you watch the full version but you can watch several different versions and has interviews from scientist and others on the backs of the disks making it 13 hrs total. I dont think this movie compares to any other movie out there not the secret not any documentary. Ive watched it at least 20 times no kidding. it goes into a lot of quantum physics and views that incorporate. A woman trans channels an entity from Atlantis. at first i thought ** but ive learned a lot from him (Ramtha) and his books are amazing.

They animate parts of the brain and nervous system that is at least entertaining. the first one is taken from the Copenhagen interpretation of quantum theory, but the second one with all the interviews goes further into it and talks about many theories. I wouldn’t say this is pop anything, the times are changing and many have become inspired by this flick. Id say it is causing more people to wake up to a universal truth that is timeless. plus just because you don’t have a degree in physics(most of the interviewees do)doesn’t mean you dont understand the implications. some of these guys are a little better at explaining it then the scientists anyways.

[Gem]

Originally Posted by mahakali

beautiful, thanks for sharing that! There is inner meaning as well as the whole picture.

you should definitely see what the bleep, i don’t think it really fits into a category. Its amazing, i would think that you would enjoy it. get the down the rabbit hole version. Its like 6 hrs long if you watch the full version but you can watch several different versions and has interviews from scientist and others on the backs of the disks making it 13 hrs total. I dont think this movie compares to any other movie out there not the secret not any documentary. Ive watched it at least 20 times no kidding. it goes into a lot of quantum physics and views that incorporate. A woman trans channels an entity from Atlantis. at first i thought ** but ive learned a lot from him (Ramtha) and his books are amazing.

I'm the kinda guy who watches Richard Feynman lectures and theoretical Physics of Krauss so when I watch The Bleep it's kinda like disney world to me. It like the difference between a Floyd concert and and Britney Spears, but I thought The bleep was pretty entertaining, good ideas.

They animate parts of the brain and nervous system that is at least entertaining. the first one is taken from the Copenhagen interpretation of quantum theory, but the second one with all the interviews goes further into it and talks about many theories. I wouldn’t say this is pop anything, the times are changing and many have become inspired by this flick. Id say it is causing more people to wake up to a universal truth that is timeless. plus just because you don’t have a degree in physics(most of the interviewees do)doesn’t mean you dont understand the implications. some of these guys are a little better at explaining it then the scientists anyways.

Yes, you're probably right... and I know I'm in the extreme minority thinking these pop theatre things and Authors like Tollle and Chopra are flakes, but while the average bloke seems to understand these things with great confidence I can't make head or tail of it, and it all seems so bells and flowers to me.

The I ching I get... I like Jiddu Krishnamurti, Thich Naht Hanh, Dalai Lama (and Bob Dylan of course) and some others. It's the artistry and poetry of them and their substantial activist roles in world peace etc.

I have some poems here actually:

Interrelationship

You are me, and I am you.
Isn't it obvious that we "inter-are"?
You cultivate the flower in yourself, so that I will be beautiful.
I transform the garbage in myself, so that you will not have to suffer.
I support you;you support me.
I am in this world to offer you peace;
you are in this world to bring me joy

1989. Written during a retreat for psychotherapists held in Colorado in response to Fritz Perls' statement, "You are you, and I am me, and if by chance we meet, that's wonderful. If not, it couldn't be helped."~Thich Nhat Hanh