What is Spiritualism ?

Originally Posted by Left Behind

They were the Fox sisters, and it was on March 31, 1848 - 164 years this very day - that they established the first known conversation with spirit in modern times.

But yes, as you say, mediumship is an ancient practice. It, sadly, fell by the wayside as time went by, until its resurgence in the mid 19th century.

Jim

I wondered what was thought of Spiritualism before the Fox sisters?

Deepsea

Originally Posted by deepsea

I wondered what was thought of Spiritualism before the Fox sisters?

Deepsea

It probably wouldn't have had that name but there likely have been mediums and seers for as long as humankind has been around in a recognisably humanoid form.

We'll never know for certain much about those times while we're in the physical because written or pictorial records don't go back very far but details about the distant history of humankind, and how spiritual progression was designed to operate in this physical dimension, can be accessed (should it still be of interest to us) after we've passed over again. Until then we can only speculate....

[Left Behind]

Originally Posted by mac

huh!

Do you know, Jim, I hadn't thought of that but I should have done because it's the birthday of our son and also the day of his death.

That sounds like more than just coincidence, Mac!

Jim

[Left Behind]

Originally Posted by mac

It probably wouldn't have had that name but there likely have been mediums and seers for as long as humankind has been around in a recognisably humanoid form.

We'll never know for certain much about those times while we're in the physical because written or pictorial records don't go back very far but details about the distant history of humankind, and how spiritual progression was designed to operate in this physical dimension, can be accessed (should it still be of interest to us) after we've passed over again. Until then we can only speculate....

We seem to have retrogressed Spiritualistically, though, just as we progressed materially and technologically: until the big resurgence in 1848.

I always say the events in that year with the Fox sisters were the first KNOWN spirit contacts in the modern era. Who's to say what was going on in private?

And I'm also being ethnocentric (as we all are, and for which I don't apologize). Who's to say what sort of Spiritualistic contacts were being made by American Indians, Asians, Africans, etc. during the early modern era, as that term is defined by the Western world?

Originally Posted by Left Behind

That sounds like more than just coincidence, Mac!

Jim

I've wondered about that in the past, Jim, but without clear evidence or even general indicators, I put the notion to one side as 'uncertain', maybe to be picked up again at some point, some day....

Originally Posted by Left Behind

We seem to have retrogressed Spiritualistically, though, just as we progressed materially and technologically: until the big resurgence in 1848.

I always say the events in that year with the Fox sisters were the first KNOWN spirit contacts in the modern era. Who's to say what was going on in private?

And I'm also being ethnocentric (as we all are, and for which I don't apologize). Who's to say what sort of Spiritualistic contacts were being made by American Indians, Asians, Africans, etc. during the early modern era, as that term is defined by the Western world?

The world is a big place with billions of inhabitants - how would one ever be able to assess whether 'the world' is/was progressing spiritually as a whole given (as you point out) that it may be happening 'behind the scenes' or in various races?

I'm always aware that as we discuss the few issues we do, there are huge disparities within countries let alone between nations - even between those nations whose primary language is nominally the same! Take, then, all the countries whose languages and social structures are greatly different from our own and what might be learn from them were we able to speak the same language? Only someone with a multi-language capability could begin to undertake such a task and then only were there communication modes as we have here with our discussion forums.

In my few years online I've heard such a divergence of views over matters that I had previously believed to be fundamental that I now have confidence only in what I say. I also know from experience that what I say will mean very different things to many of the folk I encounter, even though much of what I write is not based on my personal ideas but on the teachings of individuals who I deeply respect, who I see as highly spiritually-evolved but about whom others just don't know..

Given such a failure in my own communications on such specific subjects, how could one ever gain much of an impression about whether any spiritual changes are happening out there in the wide world?

[Left Behind]

Originally Posted by mac

The world is a big place with billions of inhabitants - how would one ever be able to assess whether 'the world' is/was progressing spiritually as a whole given (as you point out) that it may be happening 'behind the scenes' or in various races?

I'm always aware that as we discuss the few issues we do, there are huge disparities within countries let alone between nations - even between those nations whose primary language is nominally the same! Take, then, all the countries whose languages and social structures are greatly different from our own and what might be learn from them were we able to speak the same language? Only someone with a multi-language capability could begin to undertake such a task and then only were there communication modes as we have here with our discussion forums.

In my few years online I've heard such a divergence of views over matters that I had previously believed to be fundamental that I now have confidence only in what I say. I also know from experience that what I say will mean very different things to many of the folk I encounter, even though much of what I write is not based on my personal ideas but on the teachings of individuals who I deeply respect, who I see as highly spiritually-evolved but about whom others just don't know..

Given such a failure in my own communications on such specific subjects, how could one ever gain much of an impression about whether any spiritual changes are happening out there in the wide world?

But I was speaking only of Spiritualistic progress, in the Western world, during the modern (let's say, commencing around 1500 A.D. - or C.E. if you prefer) era.

I DON'T believe that I'm in error in saying that from 1500 until 1848, the Western world advanced a great deal, materially and technologically: but retrogressed (or at least, made little or no comparable progress) Spiritualistically.

SPIRITUALLY, now, who can say? That's largely in the eyes of the beholder. I daresay that a Roman Catholic with a pre-Vatican II type of spirituality could point to tremendous decline in the world over the past 50 years. A New Ager could point to just as much progress during the same time period.

Jim

Originally Posted by Left Behind

But I was speaking only of Spiritualistic progress, in the Western world, during the modern (let's say, commencing around 1500 A.D. - or C.E. if you prefer) era.

I DON'T believe that I'm in error in saying that from 1500 until 1848, the Western world advanced a great deal, materially and technologically: but retrogressed (or at least, made little or no comparable progress) Spiritualistically.

SPIRITUALLY, now, who can say? That's largely in the eyes of the beholder. I daresay that a Roman Catholic with a pre-Vatican II type of spirituality could point to tremendous decline in the world over the past 50 years. A New Ager could point to just as much progress during the same time period.

Jim

I don't know what you mean by "Spiritualistic progress" but if it's in connection with Spiritualism - which has only been termed such since the events of 1848 - I don't know what would be seen as 'Spiritualistic' before that.

The adjective 'spiritual' is so open to personal definition that it's largely valueless as an adjective.

help!

Originally Posted by mac

It probably wouldn't have had that name but there likely have been mediums and seers for as long as humankind has been around in a recognisably humanoid form.

We'll never know for certain much about those times while we're in the physical because written or pictorial records don't go back very far but details about the distant history of humankind, and how spiritual progression was designed to operate in this physical dimension, can be accessed (should it still be of interest to us) after we've passed over again. Until then we can only speculate....

My only suggestion can be is that Spiritualism showed it's face in the form of what we called 'witches' from way,way back.
They were condemned to death in those days only because it was not understood what they were trying to tell us.
Many were evil but many were very good prophets or (mediums?) in those long ago days.

[Left Behind]

Originally Posted by deepsea

My only suggestion can be is that Spiritualism showed it's face in the form of what we called 'witches' from way,way back.
They were condemned to death in those days only because it was not understood what they were trying to tell us.
Many were evil but many were very good prophets or (mediums?) in those long ago days.

Yes, that's one way, Joanie, certainly.

Mac, while the term "Spiritualism" may not have been coined till 1848, nevetheless, as you say, Spiritualistic practices have been going on since ancient times. Where did the Bible come from, if not spirit revelation? And what is spirit revelation, if not Spiritualism?

Ji m