Taoism Insubstantial

Originally Posted by pre-dawn

Wei-wu-wei, is both the Taoist practice and philosophy. Action through non-action, or action through no-effort. This means doing what needs to be done, or what one wants to do, without any excess of effort, power or strain. It does not mean no effort at all but to act with appropriate effort when the time is ripe. To work like that requires a relaxed mind and a keen awareness of what is going on inside and outside of oneself.

Thanks, pre-dawn I like this definition. But it not possible to have a relaxed mind unless one engages in some form of regular mediation; which was not done by a Taoist sect that i was associating with. In order to know what should be done and when to do it you require Divine Guidance, your own mind can certainly not guide you in this. Because we are all tied by the ropes of illusion only one who is free can untie us.

Originally Posted by I-Ching

Hi,

I was Krishna Monk for several years but at the same time using the I-Ching for Guidance. Eventually I got kicked out of the ashrama because of the I-Ching. I went to Taoist meeting (which is difficult to find since they keep it a big secret), I was surprised to find that the Taoist have no spiritual practise, no meditation, nothing, they just try to be virtuous, whatever that means (I think even Hitler thought he was a nice guy). Nor do they actually use the I-Ching. One “teacher” there then became offensive to me because I referred to them as Taoists. They seem to fanatically believe that all paths are one and therefore to refer to them as Taoists is a big sin. I agree that all paths are one but they are also different at the same time, just like the image of Taijitu(Ying & Yang).
When I read the Tao-Te-Ching I find no substantial philosophy. It doesn’t tell you who you are, why are you here, where you came from, what is the nature of this world & what happens when you die. The only message I can get from it is that you should be natural.

With Truth

My friend, you seem to have been confused and you have yet to understand the philosophy of it and fathom the very profundity of it. Your spurious observation is too little. In another post you wrote that the Dalai Lama is a hypocrite. If the Dalai Lama is a hypocrite, the rest of other spiritual leaders are hypocrites or to put it totally differently, there is nothing called pure or sacred if you look at it from your tainted glass. If the Dalai Lama is a hypocrite just because he ate meat you read Khalil Gibran's Eating and Drinking.

Then an old man, a keeper of an inn, said, "Speak to us of Eating and Drinking."
And when you crush an apple with your teeth, say to it in your heart: "Your seeds shall live in my body, And the buds of your to-morrow shall blossom in my heart, And your fragrance shall be my breath, And together we shall rejoice through all the seasons."
And in the autumn, when you gather the grapes of your vineyards for the winepress, say in your heart: "I too am a vineyard, and my fruit shall be gathered for the winepress, And like new wine I shall be kept in eternal vessels." And in winter, when you draw the wine, let there be in your heart a song for each cup; And let there be in the song a remembrance for the autumn days, and for the vineyard, and for the winepress.

In the same vein you failed to understand the Tao Path. You are looking for shallow things in Taoism, a kind of hollow philosophical propositions. Tao is the path not the philosophy. You have not taken a dip in it. Drown yourself and you will reach something that transforms you. You are an outsider and switching religious institutions, Gurus and your tours are short-lived and you did not immerse yourself in the very flow of the stream. You have been sojourned now here not there and saw the surface of them. How can an interloper see the cohesion of a family and the love that keeps them going.. You cannot visualize the bond that ties up them there. So do not try to fool us into your skin-deep understanding of that great Way

[sound]

Originally Posted by I-Ching

Thanks, pre-dawn I like this definition. But it not possible to have a relaxed mind unless one engages in some form of regular mediation; which was not done by a Taoist sect that i was associating with. In order to know what should be done and when to do it you require Divine Guidance, your own mind can certainly not guide you in this. Because we are all tied by the ropes of illusion only one who is free can untie us.

Can we not be guided by our own divinity I-Ching?

Originally Posted by supernova

If the Dalai Lama is a hypocrite, the rest of other spiritual leaders are hypocrites

This is illogical since not all spiritual leaders are flesh eaters!

Humans beings are meant to use their intelligence to discriminate truth from falsity. Before one can accept a path, you have to examine what it's philosophy is. The philosophy of any path is fundamental and hardly the "shallow things". You can't just "drown" yourself in something you don't understand, or don't agree with. I'm sure the Nazi's also had "the cohesion of a family", but that is hardly a qualification.

Originally Posted by I-Ching

This is illogical since not all spiritual leaders are flesh eaters!

Humans beings are meant to use their intelligence to discriminate truth from falsity. Before one can accept a path, you have to examine what it's philosophy is. The philosophy of any path is fundamental and hardly the "shallow things". You can't just "drown" yourself in something you don't understand, or don't agree with. I'm sure the Nazi's also had "the cohesion of a family", but that is hardly a qualification.

Hitler was a vegetarian too and do you think he was spiritual just he being a vegetarian and the Dalai Lama on nonveg means he is going astray. This is nonsense.

Do you think plants have no life. You were a Krishna Monk, I suppose in ISCON and they are vegetarians and you had that idea gathered from their ideology to think only vegetarians are sacred and the rest are profane

Many animals are vegetarian, that does make them enlightened. But the idea of an enlightened meat-eater shows a fundamental lack of understanding of what enlightenment is.

It is only common sense that if you break the leg off a dog, it will suffer more than if you break the branch off a tree.

Yes, I condemn meat-eaters, especially those who claim to be spiritual leaders.

Originally Posted by sound

Can we not be guided by our own divinity I-Ching?

If you are enlightened then you can be. But if you are controlled by the illusions of lust, greed, pride, envy then you can not guide yourself, you need the guidance of one who is free of these things. Generally to think that you can guide yourself is a sign of pride.

Greetings..

Originally Posted by I-Ching

Many animals are vegetarian, that does make them enlightened. But the idea of an enlightened meat-eater shows a fundamental lack of understanding of what enlightenment is.

It is only common sense that if you break the leg off a dog, it will suffer more than if you break the branch off a tree.

Yes, I condemn meat-eaters, especially those who claim to be spiritual leaders.

Why do you appoint yourself to self-righteous judgement of others.. your prideful self-image is your own deluded illusion.. speak your opinion as opinion, not as condemnation, condemnation is devoid of compassion..

Be well..

Condemnation was perhaps a bit harsh but I do feel strongly that meat-eating is wrong. Those that eat innocent animals are the ones that are devoid of compassion. I do condemn those that are claim to be spiritual leaders and eat meat since they should know better.

Greetings..

Originally Posted by I-Ching

Condemnation was perhaps a bit harsh but I do feel strongly that meat-eating is wrong. Those that eat innocent animals are the ones that are devoid of compassion. I do condemn those that are claim to be spiritual leaders and eat meat since they should know better.

I see.. you kinda like that word, eh? Do you think you are qualified to condemn others?

Be well..