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  #151  
Old 07-09-2018, 07:30 PM
God-Like God-Like is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemex

I think we may plan and don't even know it's done. Some say we create our (own) reality. If true, then isn't that the plan we make. I have to laugh at my blueprint cause why would I have made such a plan for myself. The plan is a journey, and journey from within, not from the outside. When I hear the question, like what, I say curves one are thrown at them by life that bump up against the plan. This journey through experience. If we make reality we make the plan as well. We drive the plan. A soul journey, not a person journey. Hard to imagine this, isn't it. Make a new plan.

Yes exactly ... the veil of forgetfulness has to be present because it will alter the effects / results of the experience .

The awakening of one's true nature won't happen if your mission entails wiping out millions of peeps .

You won't have a mission to wipe out millions of peeps unless it was planned prior to incarnation .

You need to forget otherwise you won't go through with it .


x daz x
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  #152  
Old 07-09-2018, 09:58 PM
Amanaki Amanaki is offline
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There are no permanent self so how can it be a self that thinks?

Everything is changing from moment to moment, the body does look same but within the body everything moves, the cells moves and on a microscopic level our body is full of empty space :)

Life exist only because we create it from thoughts.

This is my understanding and ofcourse i can be wrong or others see it different then i do. that is also a part of life :)
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  #153  
Old 08-09-2018, 06:42 AM
iamthat iamthat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amanaki
There are no permanent self so how can it be a self that thinks?

Everything is changing from moment to moment, the body does look same but within the body everything moves, the cells moves and on a microscopic level our body is full of empty space :)

Life exist only because we create it from thoughts.

This is my understanding and ofcourse i can be wrong or others see it different then i do. that is also a part of life :)

As you say, everything is always changing. But we can only recognise that change from a point of stillness. There has to be something constant in order to be aware of change. This is the permanent Self.

The Self does not think. Thoughts arise in the mind and the Self observes these thoughts. The act of observation tells us that we are separate from our thinking processes. Thoughts arise from nothing and return to nothing. And another thought then arises. Answers are found in the space between thoughts.

But of course, everything is relative. So even the permanent Self is only permanent in comparison with the fleeting world of form. Compared with greater states of Being, the permanent Self may be just as fleeting.

Peace.
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  #154  
Old 08-09-2018, 03:20 PM
JustBe JustBe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God-Like
This is what I have been trying to highlight .

Just because one is unaware of what is happening or why things are happening as they are doesn't mean that these happenings are spontaneous / random without any planned / destined movement behind them .

It's all about being aware of the bigger picture but it is a rarity that peeps are aware of it .

Therefore when something awful happens that pulls the heart strings we immediately think the worse instead of what lies behind the scenes .

I can't stress enough that it is all about awareness .


x daz x

It all falls back to us being aware we are just a little drop in the ocean. Also too, coming to terms aware, that everything has a season and cycle, understanding that life is full of beginnings and endings, changes and so we move with all this if we trust in every aspect of our life being revealed continuously. I suppose that is why everything we 'think' we know, has the unknown moving one with it, continuously revealing more to us, so even our thinking is temporary, transient flow. Moving as both makes more sense in the greater scheme of things as I perceive myself now. I plan and make choices, but sometimes life impedes in ways that change those plans and choices, because life reveals more ongoing. In many ways this shows that choices and movements are really only temporary aspects of myself and life in this way. Everything in this view, reveals the transient nature of myself and everything coming into the lived experience as one.

There is always more in the greater moving one with my own movements, which is why coming to terms and living more present in the 'now', allows for a life of non resistance and trust in what is. Moving as you know more, see more, feel more clarity, are more consciously aware of a greater picture beyond self alone.
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  #155  
Old 08-09-2018, 07:22 PM
God-Like God-Like is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustBe
It all falls back to us being aware we are just a little drop in the ocean. Also too, coming to terms aware, that everything has a season and cycle, understanding that life is full of beginnings and endings, changes and so we move with all this if we trust in every aspect of our life being revealed continuously. I suppose that is why everything we 'think' we know, has the unknown moving one with it, continuously revealing more to us, so even our thinking is temporary, transient flow. Moving as both makes more sense in the greater scheme of things as I perceive myself now. I plan and make choices, but sometimes life impedes in ways that change those plans and choices, because life reveals more ongoing. In many ways this shows that choices and movements are really only temporary aspects of myself and life in this way. Everything in this view, reveals the transient nature of myself and everything coming into the lived experience as one.

There is always more in the greater moving one with my own movements, which is why coming to terms and living more present in the 'now', allows for a life of non resistance and trust in what is. Moving as you know more, see more, feel more clarity, are more consciously aware of a greater picture beyond self alone.

The funny thing is when you speak about changing things as we become more aware of things could also just be what was originally planned .

It's like a game of chess and we don't know what move to make until our opponent makes his move .

We think the now moment is that moment when it's our turn to make a move but in some way we have already made it or predestined to make it .


x daz x
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  #156  
Old 08-09-2018, 08:40 PM
lemex lemex is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God-Like
The funny thing is when you speak about changing things as we become more aware of things could also just be what was originally planned .

x daz x




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  #157  
Old 08-09-2018, 09:10 PM
7luminaries 7luminaries is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemex
Though not seen it is free will. Free will is also potential. It is about realization and as was said awakening. The opportunity to awakening is the agreement. One may leave this life not awakened be the same way and act in the same manner for an entire life time. It comes down to time. This is why this place is not a one stop place, no soul is wasted like that.
Hello Lemex

Yes...I think this is, in the main, the gist of it. Where we have planned things, it is IMO typically regarding some key aspects in the broadest of strokes. Such as, agreement regarding 1) who will parent us (most often, these are not our closest soul fam but may be on occasion), and 2) a handful of key meetups and situations with some of our close soul family members and a few others, perhaps.

It is here in these two instances, I would say, where we typically have the greatest impact on one another and potentially the greatest ability to heal or harm both ourselves and others.

With parents, it is because of the universality of this...we all are born to someone and are raised by one or more, usually. The vulnerability and receptivity of childhood's formative time in our lives is also a universality.

With close soul family, it is because of the level of interbeing, which is more foundational and thus deeper, typically. More able to affect us deeply for weal or for woe, for good or for ill. To help or to harm, IOW.

Regardless, the main agreement is always to interact or be in one another's lives to provide the opportunity for awakening in authentic love. How we go about this is up to each of us. But we do not ever have to choose violence or aggression or cruelty or enslavement of others, nor must we perpetrate any other trauma. We do not ever have to carry out the plan of genocide or murder, etc.

Not if we awaken to the realisation that we truly are free to choose as we see fit in each moment. We are always free to choose lovingkindness from equanimity in each moment. We have only to realise that we have & have always had that freedom to choose -- and moreover that we are & have always been responsible for our actions (intent, though, word, and deed).

That responsibility is a gift of immeasurable beauty and worth. It is a joy beyond describing to be fully present and to take conscious choices that craft the soul and the spirit...and the body as well, for that matter.

That realisation of our freedom to choose is the flower of awakening.
Choosing consciously from that moment forward is the fruit of awakening.
In the east, these things were referred to as liberation from karma.
In the west, as living from the heart-led consciousness, with mind in heart. Also referred to as the christ consciousness.

Peace & blessings
7L
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Here we must be unafraid of what is difficult.

For all living beings in nature must unfold in their particular way

and become themselves despite all opposition.

-- Rainer Maria Rilke
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  #158  
Old 08-09-2018, 09:48 PM
7luminaries 7luminaries is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God-Like
Hey
Why do you think some agreements can be made and some cannot?

Do you believe that another can take your life without consent on some level?

Do you think Jesus could of died of leprosy prior to realizing what he did?

If there is free will and chance and good and bad luck that is involved with life experience then it really is likened to a game of russian roulette and life has no structure / order whatsoever .

Life is perfectly aligned and orchestrated to the individual .

I can't see how you see that is perhaps correct for some and not others .

x daz x
Hey there Dazzer
I think most of what I want to say is above in my response to Lemex, because I was also keeping your posts in mind.
That way you only have to read one sorta longish post, but one that has only a few key points. It was more well-honed as these longish ones go ;)

To be clear about why some and not others...here we go.

To be clear, that is not at all what I meant, actually. What I say applies to all, not just to some.

So, in everyone's life, there are a few key situations and meetups planned. Such as, your parents/those who raise you & when/where...and a few key meetups with your close soul fam...and similarly perhaps with a few others who are not. Often the latter end up being partners or spouses or else others in our lives with whom we may experience great dissonance, like a boss or an adversary of some kind. I think these are for contrast and for suffering often & that we sign on for a few key experiences with folks who have no long-term personal bond with us across lifetimes, and it's probably per requirement :P

Whereas regarding close soul fam, who do have a long-term bond and who do experience a much deeper, steadier love for you as a person and as a soul...these situations are where -- if we are lucky and all rise to their better angels -- we may experience great kindness and true love, support, and compassion for one another as people and as souls on our path toward healing and toward awakening. Bit like your mum did for you, as you've described, which sounds truly lovely. For most of us, we love our parents, often quite dearly, but they are not our close soul family and that's alright too. It stretches the soul to love more broadly, even whilst often lacking that deep resonance. The love of a mother often comes through regardless of difference, and this in itself is a foundational lesson in authentic love.

However, your mum also could have, if not awakened, treated you just as easily with cruelty or apathy and neglect, or with violence or hostility or resentment. Not because that was the plan, but simply because -- had she not been as aware -- she could have forgotten the plan. She could have simply struggled less with her demons and let them hold sway more readily, and put them onto you. She could further have said that you deserved it, or that she was teaching you a lesson, or both. The blessing is that she did not do so, and especially because if she is among your close soul family, the damage she could have done to you with cruelty, or apathy, or violence is immense. The wounds of the spirit do cross lifetimes, as does personal lovingkindess, but the wounds of the spirit can only be healed in love, forgiveness, and reconciliation. Not only in spirit only but finally also in this incarnated existence, where only by leading from the heart, mind in heart, can we make right across lifetimes what is rent and torn. By adding to the balance of love and justice in this moment. Be. Love. Now. Thus above as below.

The rest, for nearly all of us, including many partners and other bosses or adversaries, etc., are not planned but are the outcomes of random, unplanned meetings or situations. Many deaths and physical hardships are also the result unplanned events, such as accidents, gratuitous or random violence, so-called natural disasters (many of which we now realise are the outcomes of our own human impact on the environment), and so forth. One situation where death may be agreed upon is amongst close soul fam or perhaps, it is that stranger we signed on to meet up. Perhaps I agreed to be done in by my closest soul fam member. I've not directly asked about that so will do & thanks for that

But, that is not the case for the majority of deaths due to violence, accident, famine, or disease. They fall in the random and unplanned category. And much of it does happen without consent in these cases, of course. But regardless, as SGS has noted, one soul cannot ultimately obstruct or extinguish another soul. Being done in isn't held against the victim and they are free to return and reincarnate as soon as they are able to do so.

Much of the violence, abuse, cruelty, war, disease, famine, and other social hardship is also not part of the agreement as, let's be honest, it's so ubiquitous that there's really no need to sign on to it. It's going to be there at the social level in many instances, based on simple probable outcomes of incarnating into a relatively primitive human level of consciousness and spiritual/emotional awareness.

That is my awareness. TBH, a few weeks back, I asked Michael about this very same question, regarding the individual and his or her plan. In the presence of a close soul fam member and a few other guides who were hanging around. Azrael came "in person" to hear the discussion and, I got the impression, to monitor and audit, LOL. It was a bit of a shocker to my fellow soul fam member to see Azrael away from the pool...looks like a Roman bath, LOL. Michael responded with "we" and the illumination came that they too are involved in our planning with us...it is a group effort with each of us. At the level I have described.

That is, this is what he shared. Everything last thing is not planned out and nor can it be, for the purposes of this entire creation and our incarnation, both. Much of what we may see as important or consequential (an accident, a hardship, etc.), is NOT planned. Violence and abuse is NOT planned. But key things are staged, such as meeting up with your parents...rather than planned down to every detail. Certain alternate instances for exit may be planned for some. Perhaps you did make a pre-arrangement with your ex as the soul stranger you signed on with to have a relationship...OR perhaps not and you rolled with an opportunity because there are simply so many more of those possibilities in the current era than in times past.

Regardless, say she did not rise to the fullness of her humanity nor fully acknowledge yours. That trauma and hardship on your end was not in the plan. But, on the ground where things get very real (as they say), it was in fact the reality that occurred. That sort of thing is the norm, and particularly with those who are not your close soul fam, simply due to 1) the degree of dissonance and distance...this is where we have to stretch...and 2) the limits of what most of humanity can give whilst unawakened and easily misdirected to personal iniquities and addictions, to cruelty, and even to violence.

Probabilities are involved. But...so too are the possibilities. To help bend things in response to our prayers and requests, and to save lives where they can do so within their purview, the guides can and do intervene where they are able, to assist us. The most powerful combination is without doubt when we actively take conscious choices in authentic love AND engage the guides for support, insight, and assistance. They will only engage and assist for the highest good of one and all, so it's all good.

In this way, even the many random and unplanned acts, outcomes, situations, and meetups -- and all the misaligned fallout and harms -- can be 1) mitigated and sometimes avoided altogether and 2) turned to the good, through our partnership with self, with others, and with the guides. By taking conscious choices in authentic love, which actively manifests and aids the manifestation of both 1) & 2). All this was in the illumination that accompanied his statement about how "we (they and us)" contribute to our sketch of a plan, with a few key points, key folks, and key junctures agreed upon all round. The rest as they say, is in process of unfolding.

That is my understanding and experience. Sorry for the longish post

What about you? Does this resonate more now I've explained further, or do you also have different perspectives and experiences? BTW I agree very little could interfere with a Jesus (who could have cured himself of leprosy so as not to interfere with getting his message out ;)) whilst IMO much and many could have interfered with a Hitler. As you say, it's all down to awareness. With the unaware, great levels of complicity and structures of support in society need to be in place to aid or use the Hitlers to some desired end.

Peace & blessings Dazza
7L
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Bound by conventions, people tend to reach for what is easy.

Here we must be unafraid of what is difficult.

For all living beings in nature must unfold in their particular way

and become themselves despite all opposition.

-- Rainer Maria Rilke

Last edited by 7luminaries : 08-09-2018 at 11:49 PM.
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  #159  
Old 08-09-2018, 11:27 PM
davidsun davidsun is offline
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Originally Posted by God-Like
There is talk about I AM this and not that, there is talk about I AM the observer but I AM not the doer .

This could go on and on in this respect, I AM not the thinker of I AM the observer and not the doer lol .
Silliness!

If your understand the 'observations' (LOL!) in the 'field' of Quantum Mechanics, you would know that 'observing' is 'doing'!
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  #160  
Old 09-09-2018, 10:52 AM
God-Like God-Like is offline
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Originally Posted by davidsun
Silliness!

If your understand the 'observations' (LOL!) in the 'field' of Quantum Mechanics, you would know that 'observing' is 'doing'!

If observing is doing then there would be no thought of I am the observer and I am not the doer .

When there is the suggestion that one is the observer and not the doer or the thinker then it just reflects self division .


x daz x
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