If you meet the Buddha, kill him.

[django]

“If you meet the Buddha, kill him.” Zen Master Linji.

This may be similar to the need to let go of the guru. To find your own two feet. But when, nearing the end of the path, or right from the start?

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by django

“If you meet the Buddha, kill him.” Zen Master Linji.

This may be similar to the need to let go of the guru. To find your own two feet. But when, nearing the end of the path, or right from the start?

Namaste.

What that saying means, is that we must give up our own desire to become desireless or we must drop the attachment to lose all our attachment. We should not seek enlightenment for the sake of 'being enlightened'.

Often, the last step to 'buddha-hood' is the notion of 'Buddh' itself - the whole mind and our mental process.

While ever we conceive of Buddha as having 'form' we are still thinking in terms of 'form' when attempting to attain the 'formless state' in which 'Buddha' no longer exists.

This is why, when a lot of us only think we have reached Nirvana, we still have a long way to go because we haven't 'shot our Buddhas' yet.

That is, we're still attached to the whole notion of a 'relative self' of form outside consciousness.

Om Mane Padme Hum

[ajay00]

Originally Posted by django

“If you meet the Buddha, kill him.” Zen Master Linji.

This may be similar to the need to let go of the guru. To find your own two feet. But when, nearing the end of the path, or right from the start?

Just the thought of the Buddha would prevent mindfulness or awareness. This is the reason why Linji made this statement.

In Hinduism, you can see that Ramakrishna Paramahamsa was stuck on the image of the Divine Mother Kali. His intense love for Kali was beneficial in the sense that all other karmas or unconscious psychological tendencies were removed through it. However the image of Kali in mind itself was a barrier and prevented Ramakrishna from achieving enlightenment.

His guru Totapuri solved this problem by asking Ramakrishna to visualize slaying Kali with a sword in mind. After Ramakrishna did this mentally, the last barrier in the form of sankhara or thought-image was eliminated, resulting in his enlightenment.

This is the same logic which Linji uses when he made the above statement.

The thought of the Buddha and his teachings is a good peg for the novice inititally to focus his mind. However at an advanced stage, when his concentration has become strong, he will have to leave aside the thought of the Buddha as well, to be in right mindfulness.

[Serrao]

Originally Posted by django

“If you meet the Buddha, kill him.” Zen Master Linji.

This may be similar to the need to let go of the guru. To find your own two feet. But when, nearing the end of the path, or right from the start?

The Guru brings you to the door.
You have to step through the door alone.
And then say goodbye to the Guru.

An important element of Life Mastery is independence; making decisions on your own.
The main role of the Guru is to make you the master of your own life.

[Shivani Devi]

ajay: You just beat me to the punch...I just thought that exact thing and was about to post it, but in a different way, but I'll say what I was going to say anyway.

In deep states of meditation, we experience some pretty awesome and amazing things.

Some of them are so beautiful, like meeting the Buddha or meeting Shiva (I'm being bound by choice in that one...much nicer this way).

I haven't killed Shiva yet...maybe knocked Him out a few times so I could get a small glimpse of the 'great beyond'...nope, like it better where I am right now, but that looks like it could be a 'choice for later'...anyway...

It tells us not to get held up on any experiences which are transient in relation to the 'ultimate experience' because everything, even Buddha Himself isn't real...he's an illusion too in the end....usually the final one before enlightenment.

Yes re-reading your reply, I found the last sentence the most resonating one. Very nicely said!

[Jeremy Bong]

Originally Posted by Serrao

The Guru brings you to the door.
You have to step through the door alone.
And then say goodbye to the Guru.

An important element of Life Mastery is independence; making decisions on your own.
The main role of the Guru is to make you the master of your own life.

Serrao, sorry to lend and add something behind your statement,

The Guru brings you to the door, HE TELLS YOU AFTER YOU GOES INSIDE THE DOOR THERE ARE DIFFERENT ROUTE TO PURSUE.

SO you have to step through the door "alone" but HE FOLLOWS YOU INTO AND GUIDES YOU ALL THE WAY YOU GO AND FIND THE TRUTH OF LIGHT.

And then say goodbye to the Guru BUT THE GURU RETURN TO SHOW YOU MORE THAT HE JUST DISCOVERED AND AT THE END YOU NEVER WANT HIM TO LEAVE BECAUSE HE CAN THINK MUCH BETTER AND PRECISELY. THIS TECHNIQUES HE FORGETS TO TEACH.

AT THE END THE REAL TIME TO SAY GOODBYE, AFTER HE LEAVES FOR SOMETIMES HE RETURN TO YOU. THE GURU SAYS NOW YOU ARE BETTER THAN ME, YOU ARE MY GURU NOW AND THEY STILL BE TOGETHER.

AFTER SOMETIME THE GURU LEAVES YOU.SO THE STORY SEEM TO AN END NOW . BUT NOW THE GURU IS MUCH BETTER THAN YOU,HE BECOMES YOUR GURU AGAIN......

SO IT BECOMES NEVER ENDING STORY FOR TWO HAPPY GURU AND FOLLOWER.

[sky]

A Guru will teach you the way, the way THEY walked the path, Buddhism is about finding YOUR way. The Buddha himself said to use his teachings like a raft to get to the other side, then you discard it.

Some need a Teacher/Guru, some don't, I think it depends on where you are in your rebirths, some are more advanced than others.

[naturesflow]

Originally Posted by django

“If you meet the Buddha, kill him.” Zen Master Linji.

This may be similar to the need to let go of the guru. To find your own two feet. But when, nearing the end of the path, or right from the start?

I feel it points towards the understanding that even as we revere outside of ourselves or source reflections of mastery, while that continues as an external source we cannot know our own source within. Understanding that all reflections inclusive of Buddha are only temporary external reflections that must be set free in us. Kill is a strong term, so I am not sure why it is used as such. I guess it means we have to end it to death by our own hands so to speak..

Understanding that all external reflections are just a guide for inner integration of becoming and being. Knowing when its time would come naturally in process I imagine when the reflection naturally turns to meeting yourself beyond all other reflections.. Well that is how I came to break free from external reflections in myself that I was seeking outside of myself to complete me..

[Jeremy Bong]

django,

If.... ki....hm.

In a narrow explanation that is who ever is a GURU will be killed. This statement also include the person who write it because it mislead others / spread negative ideology. Others may think that is the rules of the world or GURU and followers relationship. And can or have to obey.

No one want to kill his GURU and not so simple to learn all his spiritual GURU's mana,nothing is that simple. Whatever he teaches you is not enough unless he transfers all his power to you and you will never caught up what your GURU's mana.

[django]

Buddhism supports this killing the Buddha, even encouraging us to take this action, but I've been thinking that to kill the Christ is a lot harder for a Christian.

Even though I am not a practicing Christian I was brought up Christian and I can see how deep Christianities roots are in me and how insistent they are. And though occasionally these roots make me falter in trusting myself, I'm pretty sure I will see my way through.