The 6 days of creation

[BigJohn]

Originally Posted by Uma

This is as Sri Vasudeva taught me - that the world was created in six stages not days. Below is a very very simplified version...using the King James Bible:


1st stage of creation Crown chakra - before the elements were created - pure awareness

2nd stage of creation Brow chakra - the "element" mind - the first thought or intention was to create

3rd stage of creation Throat chakra - the element space - where the thought vibration can move

4th stage of creation Heart chakra - the element air

5th stage of creation Navel chakra - the element fire (associated with sight) - energy moving in space creating air causing friction causing fire

6th stage of creation Sacral chakra - associated with water - when the air gets hot enough it creates condensation and rain falls

7th stage of creation Root chakra - solidified intention of God - we live in a world of energy that looks solid - God rested on the seventh day means a number of things but as we know Genesis goes on to talk about the "Serpent" and this is Kundalini the Power of God that did all this creating now sleeping at the base of the spine - the spine of the Universe (YOU-niverse) - the spine or "Tree of Life". (It's the Tree of Knowledge when we think we're just the body focused on the material things but turn it upside down and go back up the tree and it becomes the Tree of Life when we strive to attain that spiritual consciousness again and realize our Divinity as a soul in a human experience reaching for the Father - God.)

All the ancient cultures have some version of this story. From the point of view of mysticism it's all an internal process. Whenever the "serpent" is demonized, that's just another cultural "scandalizing" the one that came before it. I suppose this is hard to accept by hard core Christians but actually the universal mysticism is imbedded in the Bible too.

INTERESTING.

Yesterday, my thoughts were on "what major beliefs might be different today if the Bible was not written from the perspective of the Kingdom of Judea but instead was written from the Northern Kingdom of Israel's perspective?"

My thoughts were more profound then what you just mentioned.

[Dan_SF]

The timeless time:

It is human thinking, the human-monkey-mind, which wants you to believe in time.

The time does not exists. The past, does not exist, but as a part of Human consciousness or human memory.

I can not convince you that time does not exist. But, i can show you few indications that time does not exist.
It is solely up to you, to see it. But you have to do each, many times.

There are few parts which you should DO, whenever you like, and the one will explain the other, in your understanding:

1:
If you look at the Analog Clock, which is spinning around, then you can understand that the Movement is happening, at the edges of the Clock needle.
But look: In the Middle, there is no movement at all. If you place yourself there, you will see that movement is happening around it, and you may turn
to catch the movement, but the center is always at the same position.


2: Have you ever noticed, that when you say "ill do this or that tomorrow" or "when tomorrow comes", in your experience, it was always NOW.
There is no point in time, no event, nothing which you have not experienced as in NOW.

a: Yes, the water had to change the state from cold, to hot, to boiling, so that you may enjoy a tasty tea, but at each point, it was now, when it happened.

b: The earth is moving, there is no question that it is not changing the position. And what you call tomorrow, is only a spinning of the earth (if you imagine that it exists) around its path.
You had time to rest, to sleep, to regain power and to change the mood, to change place and the environment, light contrast, but, whenever this future point came, it was always experienced as in the NOW.

The same counts for the seasons, it does not indicate that time exists, only that change is happening.

3: Thoughts

You will surely notice that you have countless thoughts. (or for those who meditate: less thoughts)
For example, you may say that the now is forever changing, from now into now, for e.g say or think: "now" , "now", "now", "now"," now".

But look closely, it is your mind, which looks on the first "now" from the 2nd's "now" position, and looking back, it says: "yes the 1st now has happened and is gone, therefore time exists".
And because the mind can not keep the first now, it creates a memory of it, compares the difference and so time is made up, because this is how it feels comfortable.
To look at the unchanging now is the moving (monkey's) mind's enemy, because for it, being a moving part,in "now" nothing exists (which is exciting).
It thinks of the "now" as evil, because it see's there only a stagnation, and it wants to move.
That is why it wants you to convince you of TIME.

In truth, only the now exists, unchanged. The sounds, which happen, when you say "now now now" come and go, but that does not change the truth that time does not exists.
This is a bit of tricky part, but if i got it, then everyone can get it.


These are few of the examples which i have gathered till now, and only individuals can convince themselves that it is so.

Originally Posted by Dan_SF

The timeless time:

It is human thinking, the human-monkey-mind, which wants you to believe in time.

The time does not exists. The past, does not exist, but as a part of Human consciousness or human memory.

I can not convince you that time does not exist. But, i can show you few indications that time does not exist.
It is solely up to you, to see it. But you have to do each, many times.

There are few parts which you should DO, whenever you like, and the one will explain the other, in your understanding:

1:
If you look at the Analog Clock, which is spinning around, then you can understand that the Movement is happening, at the edges of the Clock needle.
But look: In the Middle, there is no movement at all. If you place yourself there, you will see that movement is happening around it, and you may turn
to catch the movement, but the center is always at the same position.


2: Have you ever noticed, that when you say "ill do this or that tomorrow" or "when tomorrow comes", in your experience, it was always NOW.
There is no point in time, no event, nothing which you have not experienced as in NOW.

a: Yes, the water had to change the state from cold, to hot, to boiling, so that you may enjoy a tasty tea, but at each point, it was now, when it happened.

b: The earth is moving, there is no question that it is not changing the position. And what you call tomorrow, is only a spinning of the earth (if you imagine that it exists) around its path.
You had time to rest, to sleep, to regain power and to change the mood, to change place and the environment, light contrast, but, whenever this future point came, it was always experienced as in the NOW.

The same counts for the seasons, it does not indicate that time exists, only that change is happening.

3: Thoughts

You will surely notice that you have countless thoughts. (or for those who meditate: less thoughts)
For example, you may say that the now is forever changing, from now into now, for e.g say or think: "now" , "now", "now", "now"," now".

But look closely, it is your mind, which looks on the first "now" from the 2nd's "now" position, and looking back, it says: "yes the 1st now has happened and is gone, therefore time exists".
And because the mind can not keep the first now, it creates a memory of it, compares the difference and so time is made up, because this is how it feels comfortable.
To look at the unchanging now is the moving (monkey's) mind's enemy, because for it, being a moving part,in "now" nothing exists (which is exciting).
It thinks of the "now" as evil, because it see's there only a stagnation, and it wants to move.
That is why it wants you to convince you of TIME.

In truth, only the now exists, unchanged. The sounds, which happen, when you say "now now now" come and go, but that does not change the truth that time does not exists.
This is a bit of tricky part, but if i got it, then everyone can get it.


These are few of the examples which i have gathered till now, and only individuals can convince themselves that it is so.

Yes agreed

Jl

[inavalan]

Originally Posted by janielee

Yes agreed

Jl

There are many honest efforts of making sense of the idea of "simultaneous time", "no time", "eternal now", ... Some people come with pseudo-scientific hypotheses, others with eastern religious interpretations, still others with higher-beings' channeled information.

I have mine too ...

[BigJohn]

Originally Posted by BigJohn

I do not look at the creation account as a myth.

If you look at the 2 creation accounts, the 2 flood accounts, etc., it does not take long to realize more then one person is writing the accounts especially if you look at it in Hebrew.

If you look at the Talmud, people do not have issues with the Talmud. People realize it is a depository of opinions. I suspect Genesis, with its various opinions, is very similar to the Talmud in writing style. The difference is that the Talmud appears to be a more refined writing style that lets the reader to realize it is dealing with opinions whereas Genesis lacks that refinement.

Put this in a different perspective, the 2 creation accounts might possibly be the first metaphysical writings!

[Molearner]

Originally Posted by BigJohn

Put this in a different perspective, the 2 creation accounts might possibly be the first metaphysical writings!

BigJohn,

Mentioning metaphysical induced me to go over the 2 creation accounts. In a posting on a different thread, I shared a Lurianic kabbalah theory concerning tzimtzum. Briefly it postulates that God created a void within himself in order to create the world we inhabit. This was necessary to give man freedom otherwise God would determine everything and man would be nothing more than robotic.

The two creation stories could be explained by this and both are valid. So I would not necessarily believe that multiple authors were involved. In the first creation story we read about the creation of 'living' things and 'living creatures'. In the Bible 'living' denotes form and blood. Every 'soul' has body and soul. The creation of the animals first are a first indication of the possibility of evolution.....:) Now in the first creation account(Gen. 1:26-27) God created man in his image and likeness. Note also that he created male and female at the same time......no separate creation for man and female as is in the second creation account. Also note that nowhere does it state that man is a living being. Man at this time is only in the image and likeness of God....meaning that at this time man was solely a spiritual being(without form or blood). The difference for animals is that they were given the breath of live(vs. 30). The breath of life means they were given blood which signifies life.

Now in the second creation story(Genesis 2:7)…."the Lord God formed man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life , and the man became a living being." It is at this time that man becomes a living being and at this time has body, soul, and spirit(still like God in that way). Man, however, was soon doomed to lose his spirit....this was to come with the expulsion from the Garden. Also, in the immediately following verses there are geographical descriptions(Tigris, Euphrates, etc.) which are known in the world we live in. This is to demonstrate that is the earthly creation(back to the void theory of tzimtzum that I mentioned). Note also, that man was formed from the dust.(dust to dust, etc.) Man was formed from the dust....something that had died. Link this with sin brings death so we can see that man, in a sense, came from sin. Perhaps this is some rationale for original sin ? Now note that Eve was created from Adam who was created from dust. In the first creation story man and female were created simultaneously...….in this creation story they were separately created. And Eve was created from flesh, not dust. So she shared the same DNA from Adam who was created from dust.

Enough for now......these are just speculations....corroborated by no one that I know of or have read of. But I am sure someone has speculated on this. Anyhow with my understanding I can accept both creation stories as being valid instead of being contradictory. I could write much more on this but I hate long postings....:) Besides I want to give others the opportunity to totally eviscerate this....hahahaha...!!!

[BigJohn]

Originally Posted by Molhttp://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/images/editor/underline.gifearner

BigJohn,....................

Enough for now......these are just speculations....corroborated by no one that I know of or have read of. But I am sure someone has speculated on this. Anyhow with my understanding I can accept both creation stories as being valid instead of being contradictory. I could write much more on this but I hate long postings....:) Besides I want to give others the opportunity to totally eviscerate this....hahahaha...!!!

I look at the 2 creation accounts as independent accounts put forth as if somebody had asked 2 diverse groups their opinion on how creation came about. This is supported in the writing style used in each account. For example, the first account has Elohim, and only Elohim, involved with the creation.

I suspect the 2 creation accounts were written in a style that preceded the styles used in the Talmuds. If this is valid, then the creation accounts are opinions plus the 2 creation accounts might be one of the first, if not first, metaphysical documents.

[Molearner]

Originally Posted by BigJohn

I look at the 2 creation accounts as independent accounts put forth as if somebody had asked 2 diverse groups their opinion on how creation came about. This is supported in the writing style used in each account. For example, the first account has Elohim, and only Elohim, involved with the creation.

I suspect the 2 creation accounts were written in a style that preceded the styles used in the Talmuds. If this is valid, then the creation accounts are opinions plus the 2 creation accounts might be one of the first, if not first, metaphysical documents.

BigJohn,

I can accept two authors with reservations. Unfortunately for me, I am a Christian so I cannot accept that these are 'opinions'. At this time there is no room in my belief system to accept that the Bible is a book of opinions. If that is the case then the entirety of the Bible should be viewed with suspicion. I will stick to my premise that these speak of two separate creations for some of the reasons I presented. Like so many things regarding the Bible I have attempted to ignore things that I was unable to reconcile. But time has given me the opportunity to view many things through a different lens and I continue to gain understanding of things I once thought unfathomable.

[BigJohn]

Originally Posted by Molearner

BigJohn,

I can accept two authors with reservations. Unfortunately for me, I am a Christian so I cannot accept that these are 'opinions'. At this time there is no room in my belief system to accept that the Bible is a book of opinions. If that is the case then the entirety of the Bible should be viewed with suspicion. I will stick to my premise that these speak of two separate creations for some of the reasons I presented. Like so many things regarding the Bible I have attempted to ignore things that I was unable to reconcile. But time has given me the opportunity to view many things through a different lens and I continue to gain understanding of things I once thought unfathomable.

People accept the Bible, but when they look at it in Hebrew and Greek, it takes on a new meaning. For example, the first creation claims it was 'Elohim' who did the creation. In the second account, Yahweh gets introduced. Virtually all English Bibles ignore these major points.

In the first account, man was made in the image of Elohim.
In the second account, man was made by Yahweh Elohim.

In the first account, Yahweh is not mentioned.

[Morpheus]

I understand that the Kabbalah speaks of days as ages.

What of time though? It doesn't occur to people that time is part of Creation, since the universe has a beginning and space and motion and gravity are all connected?

You're not reading among the many NDE accounts that
"There was no time", or, that "Time is different", apart from the physical?
What is all of time in comparison with the eternal? The infinite, and timeless?
You haven't heard that time stops at the speed of light?
What dod Einstein say about time?

So, compared with a greater reality and truth, the Spirit involving the eternal, time is insignificant.
The material world and universe resides in time.