Why don't bad people ascend?

[iamthat]

Originally Posted by traceyacey12

I know this first hand. I'm not perfect, I've done some bad stuff but I'm undergoing Ascension. Could you explain vibration please? And how do you define developed?

Everything in Creation has a vibration or a particular energy frequency. This vibration may be the overall expression of lesser vibrations, just as the various instruments in an orchestra combine to produce one note.

So the physical body has a vibration which is determined by many factors - our lifestyle choices, the food we eat, etc.

Our emotional body has a vibration which depends on the emotions we choose to identify with and express - eg the lower vibrations of anger, jealousy, etc or the higher vibrations of love and kindness.

The same with the mental body - are our thoughts small and selfish or are they lofty and selfless? Such things determine our mental vibration.

The consciousness of the Soul is always spiritual, but to what extent can this consciousness express through the human personality? This is our spiritual vibration.

All these different vibrations combine to produce our overall vibration, or the particular note we sound within the symphony which is humanity.

The whole process of human development is one of raising our vibration on every level so that we express a higher finer energy frequency. This development happens through learning through experience.

So to get back to your original question, someone who is truly "bad" and who habitually mistreats others can be assumed to have a fairly low vibration. If the universe suddenly makes that person ascend then they have bypassed all the learning experience. This does not make sense.

But for most of us, we have all done things in this life which we may now regret. This does not make us bad people, it simply shows our earlier ignorance. All we can do is forgive ourselves, just as we forgive those who may have mistreated us. In the end we realise that nothing bad ever happened and there is nothing to forgive. Perhaps the highest vibration for a human being is that of true forgiveness and compassion.

Peace.

[Ghost_Rider_1970]

Originally Posted by traceyacey12

Why don't bad people ascend? What I mean by bad people are ones that do bad things unto people (seek to hurt etc). Couldn't these people be so bad that the universe deems it necessary for them to need Ascension and for them to go through the Ascension process? Thanks :)

I think the key question is what is meant by ‘Ascension’. To me this is knowing who we are at the spiritual and universal level. In essence, our ‘Awakening ‘ to who we are. So, in my view, ‘Ascension’ generally eludes ‘bad people’ (and those who are good but are happy living in blissful ignorance with this being their Free Will). So the ones who cause conflict are typically those that feel they they are isolated individuals or alien to this world rather than feeing they are the patten of life itself. In effect those who are typically lost from their true self and governed by ego. Consequently being any other way may never even cross their mind unless something happens that enables them to consider the very nature of who they are.

Originally Posted by Ghost_Rider_1970

I think the key question is what is meant by ‘Ascension’. To me this is knowing who we are at the spiritual and universal level. In essence, our ‘Awakening ‘ to who we are. So, in my view, ‘Ascension’ generally eludes ‘bad people’ (and those who are good but are happy living in blissful ignorance with this being their Free Will). So the ones who cause conflict are typically those that feel they they are isolated individuals or alien to this world rather than feeing they are the patten of life itself. In effect those who are typically lost from their true self and governed by ego. Consequently being any other way may never even cross their mind unless something happens that enables them to consider the very nature of who they are.

thanks. I agree with this definition. why does finding out who you really are cause ascension symptoms?

[lemex]

Originally Posted by traceyacey12

what I described are the manifestations of physical ascending no? like what are the effects of physically ascending for you?

Yes, I get that. Really not relevant but in case you don't know. We all know the story of Jesus. Effects of physically ascending would be something like this. So if I had to label it, it would be related to death. Ascension is (spiritually) moving forward into a new plane physically while still alive, ie; one doesn't have to die but move from here to a new form. Normally one has to die to move on. Elijah is another example of one said to have ascended. Moses I think ascended as well. All examples. Other's may feel they can ascend and leave. In the ascension process the person literally doesn't remain here. When one becomes enlightened they can do it. There might even be other examples of ascension. Really unimportant, what important is using the word as you do which I never have. We're talking about guru's and such and can say they are ascended and don't have the baggage and blockages on mind. They are at a different level. Just have to add, all people can change and therefore ascend, so they do.

[Shivani Devi]

First off, I must point out that many subscribe to the theory that there are no 'bad people' and only 'bad behaviours' which could simply be any behaviour which hasn't been conditionally 'approved' by society and of course, this can range from murder, to being a bit too 'self assured' to having a selective attention span, thus showing ignorance or apathy as far as their fellow beings are concerned and to the morally upright, a 'bad person' could just about include anyone according to some scriptural or even an unwritten 'law' of acceptable social etiquette.

However, and for all intents and purposes relevant to this conversation, 'bad people' can ascend! Hitler was one...Crowley another, for the attributes of the ascension process is powerful charisma, unstoppable determination and great leadership skills...but it's how they are put to use, which really defines the 'bad person'...because, face it...unless a bad person was also a person of power or influence, their 'bad qualities' would go hitherto unnoticed and they would just get lumped in the crate along with all of the other 'bad apples' and hitherto ignored, so as not to encourage or condone their self depreciating habits.

However and that being said, I am proof that a 'bad person' can ascend, as I do not have any compassion or empathy despite the process.

[lemex]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

owever, and for all intents and purposes relevant to this conversation, 'bad people' can ascend! Hitler was one...Crowley another, for the attributes of the ascension process is powerful charisma, unstoppable determination and great leadership skills...but it's how they are put to use, which really defines the 'bad person'...because, face it...unless a bad person was also a person of power or influence, their 'bad qualities' would go hitherto unnoticed and they would just get lumped in the crate along with all of the other 'bad apples' and hitherto ignored, so as not to encourage or condone their self depreciating habits.

Reincarnation? Is this what you mean. What about the followers and can followers be just as bad and those who turned a blind eye. So often it's about others saying I didn't know. Obviously it's not just about being bad. Are there things we're suppose to be doing and this is what ascended people know. What if a person today lived back then, would they act differently then today and is that important.

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by lemex

Reincarnation? Is this what you mean.

Not precisely, although karma can also have a lot to do with it.

What I am getting at, is that what is 'bad' can be a subjective inference only, wholly dependent upon the moral conditioning of the individual, which bears no relevance to the ascension process.

For example, when God sends natural disasters, plagues and such - God is seen as being 'bad' or 'evil' for wiping out large sections of the human race...when God punishes the unjust, the unjust will be the first to cry 'foul' as their agendas and plans are thus being thwarted for the sake of a much greater cosmic harmony.

What is 'good' and what is 'bad' are still two sides of the whole notion of duality, and in the ascension process, all notions of dual existence are thus transcended, in that what another thinks or believes is no longer relevant.

There exists a rather unrealistic 'stereotype' of what a spiritual being is and how they behave, and what they do that makes them 'spiritual' when there are also many 'good people' by definition who have not ascended either and so, it is only logical to think that 'enlightenment' or 'ascension' isn't limited to or dependent upon whether one is 'good' or 'bad' and that's it, in a nutshell.

Originally Posted by lemex

Yes, I get that. Really not relevant but in case you don't know. We all know the story of Jesus. Effects of physically ascending would be something like this. So if I had to label it, it would be related to death. Ascension is (spiritually) moving forward into a new plane physically while still alive, ie; one doesn't have to die but move from here to a new form. Normally one has to die to move on. Elijah is another example of one said to have ascended. Moses I think ascended as well. All examples. Other's may feel they can ascend and leave. In the ascension process the person literally doesn't remain here. When one becomes enlightened they can do it. There might even be other examples of ascension. Really unimportant, what important is using the word as you do which I never have. We're talking about guru's and such and can say they are ascended and don't have the baggage and blockages on mind. They are at a different level. Just have to add, all people can change and therefore ascend, so they do.

speaking from experience, I have undergone a sort of death where I gave up m job and everything and went through a dark night of the soul and then had subsequent ascension symptoms... or maybe its more like I had continuing ascension symptoms that were occurring before I gave up my job and was at an overall very dark place. I wonder if this qualifies as ascension?

[Rah nam]

Originally Posted by traceyacey12

So how is Ascension typically defined?

In my definition Ascension is the transition from third or fourth density to the fifth density. This can be from a non physical state as well as from a physical state. Meaning, wile we are incarnated or out if incarnation.
It is more difficult in the state of incarnation, since it involves the transformation of the physical body into a less physical body or should I say a higher form of energy. It always takes the assistance of an entity or being from at least the fifth density. They have to provide the energy for the transformation as well as "keeping the door open" meaning creating an opening between the densities.

[God-Like]

posted on wrong thread ..

My bad :(



x daz x