When the Ego hinders the spirit

[HealerW]

In hindsight, I should have posted this thread in meditation and named it: "When Ego hinders meditation"...

But I'll add a thought or two to try to make more clear the main point of it, which is to clear the debris from one's mind so that proper meditation can occur, or at least, you've made a start to have the right environment.

I said that thoughts are the words of the language(s) that you speak. I mean by this that fundamentally, your thoughts were learned. I love the example of a newborn baby. I have a 2 week old girl. She is lying fast asleep next to me at this moment.

A few minutes ago, she was looking at me and making, as you might imagine, some adorable faces.

When I talk about the concept of thought, I mean those things that come into the mind and vie for your attention as an individual "I". Babies don't "think" in this way. They simply are. They are the love, awareness, and bliss that we all strive to achieve through our meditative practices. They have no concept of an individual I. In fact, when my daughter and I look at each other, eye to eye, I understand a separateness that she doesn't. To her, she and I are one. To her, there is no "out there". At two weeks old, she is all there is.

She knows no language, so she cannot formulate thoughts. She knows no separateness, so she has not encountered her ego.

She is as close to oneness in meditation as she will ever be in her life. This doesn't mean there aren't categories of influences like instincts and reflexes that cause her "sorrows" now and again. But this is the best way I know how to describe the major players (and complications) on meditation.

You and I simple were before thoughts came into our mind by the ego. When Jesus says, I Am, this is what he means. We all are. We just don't realize it because the ego brings separateness.

On a more philosophical level, I believe the ego separates us on planes much higher than the physical. The individual ego gets its start on the fifth plane (four above the physical plane). This is a topic for another thread.

Originally Posted by Cherrish

It does indeed - not that one needs to cultivate ego. IMO, the real problem is when the ego thinks it is in charge. That, to me, is what the OP is really about.

Things really begin to click when ego is put in service of Spirit, IME.

Yes. Which is the realm of those still spiritually asleep, have yet to discover that it isn't the only "layer" of their being.

...

[shiningstars]

Originally Posted by HealerW

The Ego is a specific thought: "I", "me". Whenever you use the word I, you're introducing your ego.

Not completely true.

Originally Posted by HealerW

The Ego is in a war with the Self, which is the real substance of who you are.

No it is not.

Originally Posted by HealerW

Try this: when you wake up, ask yourself who is there first. The awakened presence is the Self. But the moment thoughts start going through your head, the Ego is at his dirty business.

Personifying ignorance and delusion.

I think that no-one needs to imagine the ego is a big, bad, dirty word or plot. It is merely the veil of ignorance each person has over their own internal vision. Through sincerity and practices such as meditation, chanting, prayer, and other practices taught in spiritual traditions, this veil lifts naturally - without war or terror.


shiningstars

[shiningstars]

Originally Posted by HealerW

I have a 2 week old girl. She is lying fast asleep next to me at this moment.

Congratulations, HealerW - beautiful indeed and many blessings to you and your loved ones.

shiningstars

[Dan_SF]

The Ego is at war with your self, but your self is not at war with the Ego.

The Ego attacks, but your self does not respond.

To which extent you are identified with the ego, to that extent you will see war.

In eternity, the ego does not exists. Your self exists in eternity only, and the ego can not reach him, but it appears to fight yourself in time, which is an illusion.

Originally Posted by shiningstars

No it is not.

So both statement are True from the perspectives of the each,but only one is Right in Truth.

[shiningstars]

Originally Posted by Dan_SF

The Ego is at war with your self, but your self is not at war with the Ego.

The Ego attacks, but your self does not respond.

To which extent you are identified with the ego, to that extent you will see war.

In eternity, the ego does not exists. Your self exists in eternity only, and the ego can not reach him, but it appears to fight yourself in time, which is an illusion.


So both statement are True from the perspectives of the each,but only one is Right in Truth.

No....

shiningstars

[shiningstars]

Ramana Maharshi

"Just see it for what it really is, that will be enough. It is the ego itself which makes an effort to get rid of itself, so how can it die? If the ego is to go, then something else must kill it. Will it ever consent to commit suicide? So first realise what the true nature of the ego is and it will go of its own accord. Examine the nature of the ego: that is the process of realisation. If one sees what one's real nature is, that itself will get rid of the ego. Until then is it just like chasing one's own shadow; the more one advances the more distant is the shadow. If we leave our own Self, then the ego will manifest itself. If we seek our true nature, then ego dies. If we are in our own Reality, then we need not trouble about the ego."

[HealerW]

Originally Posted by shiningstars

No....

shiningstars

Truth is multi-faceted. I'm not sure what you're hoping to communicate by just telling me (and others) I'm incorrect. My truth Is revealed according to our vantage point.

[shiningstars]

Originally Posted by HealerW

Truth is multi-faceted. I'm not sure what you're hoping to communicate by just telling me (and others) I'm incorrect. My truth Is revealed according to our vantage point.

I mean no disrespect to you, HealerW.

However, "truth is multi-faceted" has its limits, in my opinion.

For example, a carrot is a protein is also not accurate.

For clarity, I don't agreement with this statement: "The Ego is in a war with the Self, which is the real substance of who you are." I'm partial to the Ramana quote above as a different explanation.

Please understand I mean no offence.

shiningstars

[django]

When we fully realise the ego is illusory we will let the ego structure fall, but before this is fully realised ego still exists in 1000+ different disguises. It's as if it is real, and to discount it as illusory prematurely is just one more ego disguise.

It is a challenge for all of us to realise the nature of ego, the best way to do this that I have found is to examine the emotions and the mind, ego will then be revealed more easily.