MIND+ONENESS

[Iamit]

We know from our own experience what mind does. It imagines and can bring (through movement of organisms) what it imagines into the appearance of solidity, and all other forms of manifestation.

Our own experience, for example is when we imagine a light bulb or the wheel and hey presto there they appear to be, so why not a universal mind imagining and manifesting the appearance of a tree or mouse, imbuing each with its mind interacting with all other minds resulting in what appears?

Mind manifests all in this way so MIND=ONENESS so just what are we trying to subdue when we believe we have to attempt to subdue mind?

An impossible task. Good luck with it!

[slash112]

I agree.

Example, we hear all over the place, the term "Ego Death". But what is Ego? It is "conscious mind". Left-brain makes up most of the conscious mind. The rest being unconscious/subconscious mind. Are they saying we're best off just shutting down half our brain? No... at least, they should not.

I understand that Ego death isn't actually the removal of Ego. It's the taming of it, and putting it in its place. We are so much more than conscious mind.
It's also the removal of "fabrications" which Ego creates.

Subduing the mind is indeed an impossible task. But attempting to do so does actually help with the removal of fabrications. It even helps discover some truths.

But I prefer to see the whole thing as "taming the mind". It should not be ignored, it should be tended to.

Ego is an idea that forms every moment based on past memories. Seeing it for what it is. (a non existent useful idea) one can broaden his or her perspective. With a broadened perspective the ego isn't identified with so closely and thus dies..

There's nothing to subdue, because there was nothing there in the first place..

With Love
Eelco

[Iamit]

Originally Posted by slash112

I agree.

Example, we hear all over the place, the term "Ego Death". But what is Ego? It is "conscious mind". Left-brain makes up most of the conscious mind. The rest being unconscious/subconscious mind. Are they saying we're best off just shutting down half our brain? No... at least, they should not.

I understand that Ego death isn't actually the removal of Ego. It's the taming of it, and putting it in its place. We are so much more than conscious mind.
It's also the removal of "fabrications" which Ego creates.

Subduing the mind is indeed an impossible task. But attempting to do so does actually help with the removal of fabrications. It even helps discover some truths.

But I prefer to see the whole thing as "taming the mind". It should not be ignored, it should be tended to.

There are various definitions of ego. For me it is the made up character designed and constructed by mind in response to, and to protect us from, rejection. Mental hospitals are full of people whose ego has disintegrated. We undermine it at our peril.

Once it is seen for what it is, there is no longer any need to dismantle it. As with mind, it can just be left to do its job. Neither are in any way obstacles to ending the feeling of disconnection for both are simply Oneness manifesting as those protections for us. Ironically it is only when mind is persuaded by certain arguments that it is an enemy, that it appears to turn on itself as an enemy. A most dangerous state of affairs.

[slash112]

You are both right, actually.

I've been spending a fair amount of time speaking about spirituality in terms of psychology, so I've been immersed in the psychology definition of Ego, recently.

Thank you both for reminding me about this definition. It was the only definition I recognized as true for like a year. It's important for me to distinguish between the two definitions. I'm a bridge-builder (I keep using this term, but it's true). In the end I want all these different sectors to be understood by each other.

Mental hospitals are full of people whose ego has disintegrated.

Lol this happened to me.
There was a few things that happened in my "episode", but one thing was my ego was (pretty much?) gone. The police found it extremely difficult to communicate with me because of that, when they found me sitting on a roundabout talking rubbish and waving to everyone that passed in cars. Took me to the hospital :P

It took two weeks of reforming my ego before I got released. But most of it felt like an act. It was super weird, to say the least.

Before then, I fought my ego. I now dance with my ego. I have a made up character that wants to go through life spreading love and wisdom.

[Iamit]

Originally Posted by catsquotl

Ego is an idea that forms every moment based on past memories. Seeing it for what it is. (a non existent useful idea) one can broaden his or her perspective. With a broadened perspective the ego isn't identified with so closely and thus dies..

There's nothing to subdue, because there was nothing there in the first place..

With Love
Eelco

There is nothing anywhere! All we are dealing with here, from a nondual perspective, is the very convincing appearance of difference where there is no difference whatsoever. Ego is no more or less here than anything else.

Within that appearance the idea of nonduality can be encountered which can end the feeling of disconnection subject to a matching of frequencies/vibrations between that idea and the mind. The mind has the capability to resonate with that idea if there is that match.

True, but if I were to stick a fork in your upper thigh during dinner.
I wonder if you will feel nothing.. So there may be some nuances to be taken into consideration. At least so long as we seem to be here....

With Love
Eelco

[Iamit]

Originally Posted by catsquotl

True, but if I were to stick a fork in your upper thigh during dinner.
I wonder if you will feel nothing.. So there may be some nuances to be taken into consideration. At least so long as we seem to be here....

With Love
Eelco

There is no question that the manifestation feels as though it is here. Its like a hologram operating on all the senses not just vision which our minds are conditioned to believe. Conditioning can apparently be reversed with special training. Unfortunately mine has not been completed yet so sticking a fork in me would be painful:)

The point being made is that no one aspect of the manifestion is more or less here than any other. So to speak of Ego as though its more or less here than any other aspect is misleading. Either way its not an obstacle to ending the feeling of disconnection for it is already Oneness manifest so can just be left to get on with its job of protecting us from rejection. Its why we present different character aspects in varying situations depending on how we percieve whats going on, and threat levels. A helpful tool to have which we discard at our peril.

I agree..That it is no obstacle.
And the pain from a fork like any phenomenon arises, stays a while and passes.

Not sure about the oneness though.
One man's Oneness is another mans Nothingness.

The fact that the eye can not see itself does not convince me that it must be there when I become conscious of seeing.

Likewise I can experience phenomenon arising and passing.. I haven't found an underlying Oneness that experiences it all (Yet)

With Love
Eelco

[Iamit]

Originally Posted by catsquotl

I agree..That it is no obstacle.
And the pain from a fork like any phenomenon arises, stays a while and passes.

Not sure about the oneness though.
One man's Oneness is another mans Nothingness.

The fact that the eye can not see itself does not convince me that it must be there when I become conscious of seeing.

Likewise I can experience phenomenon arising and passing.. I haven't found an underlying Oneness that experiences it all (Yet)

With Love
Eelco

When I use the term it is not meant ti indicate some sort of entity but simply that despite the appearance of difference, All is One. Oneness is an idea, its not presented as a truth for which we have evidence (although Quantum Physics may argue with that) because there may always be something hidden that comes to light which contradicts our evidence.

Nevertheless it may resonate to end the feeling of disconnection if frequencies match. From a nondual perspective it should also be mentioned that it must already be Oneness manifesting as feeling disconnected so that feeling itself is not disconnected :)