How do Hindus explain the nastiness of life?

[Jainarayan]

Originally Posted by Honza

In many ways Hinduism is just as severe as Christianity with all it's talk of hell.

Can you point to a source that leads you to that conclusion? Is it strictly a comparison of Hell and punishment in both religions, because there certainly is no comparison or similarity. Or is it that each one has its own severe teachings? I'm confused about what you mean.

[Honza]

Originally Posted by Jainarayan

Or is it that each one has its own severe teachings?

This. There is no hell in Hinduism but instead they have the Kali Yuga. Plus the principle of Karma teaches us that we are 100% responsible for our misery....which of course is difficult to prove.

[Jainarayan]

Originally Posted by Honza

This. There is no hell in Hinduism but instead they have the Kali Yuga. Plus the principle of Karma teaches us that we are 100% responsible for our misery....which of course is difficult to prove.

Kali yuga is not in any way analogous to Hell, and we don't look at it that way. In fact, this is the first time I've heard of the comparison. It's an age of the world, the decline of righteousness and other virtues, but to this point we're not devoid of them. There's still a lot of good in the world done by, for and to others. We generally don't think we're suffering.

Karmic effects do not always cause misery, nor are they always of our own doing. Karma has ripple effects... collateral damage, you might say. I don't believe for a moment that if I get a sunburn, get hit by a hailstone, get a kidney stone, trip on a street curb and break my ankle that those are all karmic effects. There are also people who live very blessed, successful and happy lives.

Paraphrasing something Lord Rāma said to Lakshmana "If you're going to ask 'why did this misery or ill-fortune happen to me?' you must also ask yourself 'why did this good fortune or blessings come to me?'"

[Altair]

Originally Posted by Honza

This. There is no hell in Hinduism but instead they have the Kali Yuga. Plus the principle of Karma teaches us that we are 100% responsible for our misery....which of course is difficult to prove.

Hmm... again this will probably depend on whom you ask, but there are Hindu scriptures mentioning hellish realms. The difference with the popular Christian view is that evildoers are in these hellish realms not for an eternity, but only for a very long time..

More: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hell#Eastern_religions

[linen53]

Originally Posted by Honza

In the West it is explained as a 'fall from grace'. What is it in the East?

I might point out all Westerners do not hold to this belief. The last poll taken was in 2015 that said 75% of Americans adhere to the Christian religion. I would suggest that small towns are more Christian than larger metropolitan cities. Think rural and raised in the 'church' with little outside influence to compare with. And I would further suggest that those percentages have dropped more than it was in 2015.

I think Americans have gotten tired of being told the same jargon for centuries. We are tired of being judged, sentenced, and convicted to go to hell if we step one tiny toe over the line. So we decided to do our own research outside the sanction of the Christian religion and read material that, if anything, goes against the teachings of the Christian religion.

And low and behold, we found truths. We found that our God is a loving Creator who accepts us unconditionally. And that if we fail miserably that we just pick ourselves up and try again. No harm done. It's all a learning experience anyway. We learned that life isn't black and white but rather contains many shades of gray in between.

That's a far cry from the vengeful and spiteful god of the Christian religion. Who destroys entire civilizations and dams those to hell for the least infraction.

It's all really just common sense. As above so below. What is the one thing any and all of us want: to be loved unconditionally. But the god of the Christian religion does not do that. He judges and sentences his followers to hell for eternal torture. What?

It's a matter of individually educating ourselves as to our own truths. If some want to believe in a vengeful god, so be it. As for me, I will hold dear the Creator that I have found that is full of loving kindness and only wants me to succeed in my lessons I came here to learn.

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

Mine or theirs?

I wouldn't phrase it like that, so I can't answer you.

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

You can't expect me to remain true to myself and NOT tell the truth, no matter how "intimidating" it is because, my dear friend, this is who I AM...and I have held it inside and held it back for WAY too long, because my "Authentic Self" has the habit of scaring the pants off others...which is not my bad.

Sorry I've offended you; it was just a thought but you're right this is the Kali Yuga time period and it feels like it at times. And as Jainarayan says there is a lot of goodness still; probably just mixed in with a lot of misinformation and obstacles at times.

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

We are done here. I wish you all the best on your journey and may God bless you with happiness and prosperity.

Aum Batuk Bhairavaye Namah

Likewise to you SD.

JL

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

Now, Janielee...in as much as I don't like saying this, you are in the Hindu Forum here and playing in my "Ball Park" telling me how hard to hit the ball when you know nothing about baseball and this particularly annoys me.

It was just a suggestion, Shivani Devi; not a demand, and also just an idea. You didn't like it, and I see in retrospect perhaps it was inappropriate. I've apologized.

I certainly don't know much about Hinduism and am happy to step outside of your domain if this is what this area is - I also don't do watered down versions, but maybe the areas I am interested in are simpler. My consideration was not for myself either.

JL

Originally Posted by Honza

I would not worry janielee, I would rather be told the truth of the matter than have it obscured. My intimidation needs to be addressed so that I can accept 'truth'...

Got it, thanks Honza.

JL

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by janielee

It was just a suggestion, Shivani Devi; not a demand, and also just an idea. You didn't like it, and I see in retrospect perhaps it was inappropriate. I've apologized.

I certainly don't know much about Hinduism and am happy to step outside of your domain if this is what this area is - I also don't do watered down versions, but maybe the areas I am interested in are simpler. My consideration was not for myself either.

JL

I understand and I also apologise. The frustration and intolerance is showing... but this needs to stop and I am not talking about you, but about me...about this!

I am glad I have most of my friends and supporters on SF here, in this thread, because I have some news.

The next two days will be my last two days on SF for quite some time. I won't say indefinitely, but in the foreseeable future anyway.

It starts with a camping trip this weekend for three days...out where mobile phone reception does not exist.

Then, I am going to the Shanti Mission Ashram for a week of healing and Yoga...The woman who runs it and myself have a mutual friend (a rich friend) who has arranged for me to spend some time there, in return for giving a few lectures on Tibetan Buddhism. I will be very busy for that week... spending most of it in total mouna (silence).

After this, I shall be enrolling in a local Buddhist University (Nan Tien Institute) studying Mindfulness, Eastern Medicine and Psychology for three months, before going off on another retreat for a week.

When I get back from that, I will be working on getting my IYTA (Yoga Teachers Accreditation) which I had many years ago but it lapsed and saving up my pennies to spend a year traveling around South East Asia.

I need to put my focus and time elsewhere now because I feel that being here has served its purpose and now it is only holding me back from achieving my goals and dreams.

I will still check in from time to time...once every few months or so until I get established, after I find a life outside this forum and can come back and post here on my own terms.

I still have two days to tie up loose ends...do a few things online that I need to do and then I am off.

I will miss you all and wish you all only love, peace and happiness for the future.

Aum Namah Shivaya

[linen53]

Shivani, I will truly miss you! I wish you a mountain of blessings on your journey and hope someday you will come back. If not, I'll reserve a reminder when I get to the other side that we should connect and sit and talk of our adventures we each had on this side. Much love from me. Deb