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  #21  
Old 19-02-2014, 12:02 AM
Moonglow Moonglow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God-Like
Absolutely Moonie ... In this respect no-one can be enlightened or should I say it is no-one that is, there is just no-one to know of it lols .. If that makes sense ..

x daz x

Hi daz,

Oh the ol' no-one there dance.

In this physical form of being to me there is someone and this someone gets enlightened by others and life.

Now, the question may be posed is there enlightenment beyond this physical being or in ones essence?

Which at the moment would say enlightenment is an idea or goal created to obtain,IMO. But it may be viewed as long as one is seeking it, it will continue to be something. When one stops the seeking, may see it is already of us.

So perhaps, no-one ( if seen meaning our essence) has no need to know of it because it is all ready it. So, the whole idea dissolves.

At least that is what you present brings to me.
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  #22  
Old 19-02-2014, 01:36 AM
Keeya
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Very interesting thread! :)
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  #23  
Old 19-02-2014, 02:02 AM
revolver revolver is offline
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Originally Posted by Moonglow
Hi revolver,

Can agree those that may be "enlightened" or just kind and loving don't go around bragging about, they just act in such manner(s).

When I see or in the presence of someone who is loving and kind or accepting, I feel this from the person without he/she doing anything more then being who they are.

I get what you are saying. Have another view to this. People have their identities (I do not exclude myself here) and with in these will express accordingly, IMO. Don't think it makes one unenlightened, just perhaps having another way of seeing. At times such views different from my own find to be very enlightening.

Yes even the so called enlightened still have their identity, that is as the mind body organism that has been conditioned, the only difference is the enlightened know that the ego isn't who they are, so why even bother to rectify it. Of course there will be more so called love expressed but also one could express anger, and at the same time realize that the anger doesn't belong to them. No the enlightened are not do gooders or saints, they are who they are, but at the same time awake. Never judge an enlightened person by how they act, that's your judgment and expectations.
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  #24  
Old 19-02-2014, 08:23 AM
God-Like God-Like is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonglow
Hi daz,

Oh the ol' no-one there dance.

In this physical form of being to me there is someone and this someone gets enlightened by others and life.

Now, the question may be posed is there enlightenment beyond this physical being or in ones essence?

Which at the moment would say enlightenment is an idea or goal created to obtain,IMO. But it may be viewed as long as one is seeking it, it will continue to be something. When one stops the seeking, may see it is already of us.

So perhaps, no-one ( if seen meaning our essence) has no need to know of it because it is all ready it. So, the whole idea dissolves.

At least that is what you present brings to me.

Hi Moonie,


I like the layers of the onion analogy where each layer peeled back reveals another aspect of self, be it a finer or more transparent aspect each time . When self awareness reaches the core so to speak there is only awareness of self and yet nothing is left, nothing is there .. There is only what you are that isn't compared to with anything else ..

There are no quiet thoughts of 'I am' enlightened and no beatings of the chest saying out loud 'I am' enlightened either ... One has left the 'I am' at the door step .

I agree with your line of thought that one is already it and one already knows it (within mind) but doesn't remember, the so called journey leads one to the realization or the rememberance of that eventually, but one can only remember in mind and one can only relate to a self that remembers in mind .

The ego self in mind can only function in a physical reality in so much as one is aware of an experience happening .

I think there is however a very fine line between being aware of an experience and not being aware of someone having it .


spooky music playing in the background .


x daz x
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  #25  
Old 19-02-2014, 05:49 PM
Mr Interesting Mr Interesting is offline
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I very much enjoyed a video I found on youtube a while back where this himalayan Yogi explained enlightenment to a bunch of twenty somethings all sitting around him grinning their heads off... I wonder if I should put a link in here?

And what I found especially interesting was the mixture of what felt like truth with semantic fantasical cliches... like joking around added in to keep everyone guessing, but in and around the verbal joking I could feel that pull on my heartstrings to be there, the rememberance acknowledging itself, and the kinship building slowly but with patience and kindness.

There was one bit especially and it was when all desire to be with God had burnt itself out and one is just peace and calm... no more, no less, then the Earth mother, who is unable to enter the heavens, recognises the shining soul and plucks it away from it's waiting and sends it on to bliss.. even now my eyes tear up at the beauty of such.

And what that kinda comes to me as that when we have completely stopped pulling towards this that we shall be pushed into it...

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  #26  
Old 19-02-2014, 09:20 PM
Moonglow Moonglow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by revolver
Yes even the so called enlightened still have their identity, that is as the mind body organism that has been conditioned, the only difference is the enlightened know that the ego isn't who they are, so why even bother to rectify it. Of course there will be more so called love expressed but also one could express anger, and at the same time realize that the anger doesn't belong to them. No the enlightened are not do gooders or saints, they are who they are, but at the same time awake. Never judge an enlightened person by how they act, that's your judgment and expectations.

Hi revolver,

I understand as one becomes aware and as one may deepen in awareness this does not negate our human aspects, which include our emotions.

The point I was presenting is that to me there are no enlightened and unenlightened. There are those that may have and do have a deeper awareness and what may be seen as wisdom then another may have, but this does not negate or lower the other or what he/she may bring into this life and mine. I was using love and kindness as examples and can see how this may be taken as implying this is what it is to be enlightened.

I don't see one who may be seen as enlightened as anything supernatural or superhuman. I don't relate to others this way being this or that, just who and the way he/she is being.

When someone brings something to me that furthers my awareness or inspires me, then to me, that person is being enlightening.

To me, it is not categorizing it to be one way or the other, for it is being and being encompasses all, IMO.

Yes can understand the thinking that may lead one to hold onto or believe it is one way or another and the practice one may use to see through this.
Even this can lead into just another way of thinking what it is.

For me and what I have experienced and insight gained seem to just come.
Sometimes get right away, other times it takes a while before it settles.

Thank you for showing me how my words may be interpreted, which shows me perhaps there is more for me to see.
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  #27  
Old 19-02-2014, 09:44 PM
Moonglow Moonglow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God-Like
Hi Moonie,


I like the layers of the onion analogy where each layer peeled back reveals another aspect of self, be it a finer or more transparent aspect each time . When self awareness reaches the core so to speak there is only awareness of self and yet nothing is left, nothing is there .. There is only what you are that isn't compared to with anything else ..

There are no quiet thoughts of 'I am' enlightened and no beatings of the chest saying out loud 'I am' enlightened either ... One has left the 'I am' at the door step .

I agree with your line of thought that one is already it and one already knows it (within mind) but doesn't remember, the so called journey leads one to the realization or the rememberance of that eventually, but one can only remember in mind and one can only relate to a self that remembers in mind .

The ego self in mind can only function in a physical reality in so much as one is aware of an experience happening .

I think there is however a very fine line between being aware of an experience and not being aware of someone having it .


spooky music playing in the background .


x daz x

Hi daz,

Sure I can be unaware of someone else having an experience and not saying I am free of my own evaluations and view points. I can be aware of things existing, but not experienced those things first hand. There is hear say, then there is living it.

The whole idea I get about enlightenment is the freeing of oneself of his/her thinking. Seeing things as they are and allowing such to be.
Which to me includes our thoughts. Suppose sounds contradicting, but feel it is how these are applied. With force or just recognizing them as there and letting them come and go. Working through both aspects seems to be what I experience in life.

Have let go of many needs to hold things, still some things I do, but I am aware that I do and some things I just like having around at the moment.
While other things are brought to my attention and then go about whether I wish to work through them or not.

The whole nothing there thing, still open to this. It's no big deal for me. Find it intriguing though. For at the core there is only what I am or essence, then yes in this sense can see where the self would dissolve, but the essence is still there. (just a thought on this). May seem like nothing because the mind no longer has anything to grasp.(?) So this is more in regards to the mind?
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  #28  
Old 19-02-2014, 09:47 PM
St.Stephen
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Enlightenment is bull****. It's just another thing that people seek to make themselves feel different then what they are feeling.
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  #29  
Old 19-02-2014, 09:54 PM
revolver revolver is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by St.Stephen
Enlightenment is bull****. It's just another thing that people seek to make themselves feel different then what they are feeling.

That can be true in most cases, but you will never really know until you truly know.
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  #30  
Old 19-02-2014, 10:16 PM
Gem Gem is offline
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Enlightenment is a word that invokes an imaginary state of being which is other than the current state... it's something I will be in the future. That implies how I am now in the current state is somehow inadequate. In deed if I were content as I am now, I'd not feel compelled to persue an alternative state. This means that the current state is inadequate in comparison with the imagined enlightened state. If indeed I was truely content with my current state I'd have no desire to persue enlightenment.
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