purpose of religion

[Timothy]

In civilizing the "great unwashed" there is control. The various Masters have their requirements.

[Baile]

Originally Posted by Timothy

In civilizing the "great unwashed" there is control. The various Masters have their requirements.

Yes, I see that too. Which is why I do not accept quiet submission. New-Age submission belief can be as dysfunctional as your average enabler-abuser relationship.

[knightofalbion]

Originally Posted by Baile

Jesus entered the temple courts and drove out all who were buying and selling there. He overturned the tables of the money changers and the benches of those selling doves.

If indignation at wrong action and behavior is improper; if it is spiritually incorrect to loudly condemn the wrong behavior of those whose behavior is wrong; if being a person of service means sumissively accepting the actions of those who manipulate and take advantage; why then Matthew 21:12? And I think we can all agree that Jesus was the epitome of a person of selfless service.

They were selling birds and animals for blood sacrifice in the temple of God! That is why Jesus got angry.


That is a little different in context to what we are talking about though. It's important to do the right thing, not in the expectation of reward or praise, but because it is the right thing.
And if one suffers ridicule and mockery, so be it.
What others do, that's for them. It's what 'you' do that matters.

[Baile]

Originally Posted by knightofalbion

They were selling birds and animals for blood sacrifice in the temple of God! That is why Jesus got angry.


That is a little different in context to what we are talking about though. It's important to do the right thing, not in the expectation of reward or praise, but because it is the right thing.
And if one suffers ridicule and mockery, so be it.
What others do, that's for them. It's what 'you' do that matters.

I appreciate the reply, I see what you're saying, but I have to say I don't agree. I don't see the difference, why Jesus' response and actions are any different. Very simply, service to others is not unconditional. There are people who, as a result of their actions and behavior, do not deserve unconditional acceptance, do not deserve my service. Look as well at the message of Christianity itself. If you are not a worthy soul, you will not receive the blessing and service of heaven, so to speak. It's right there in the tenets of the religion, maybe not the exact words but certainly the spirit of the idea.

[Thunder Bow]

Originally Posted by Baile

Timothy tried to converse and have an exchange of ideas, and you replied by making a personal accusation, accusing Timothy of judging you. I then tried to converse and have an exchange of ideas, and you replied to me with another personal accusation, accusing me of judging you. That's all that happened here, nothing more or less. Carry on Thunder Bow, I done responding.

Read the full discussion I had with Timothy, and you will see it was due to trying to read a oral tradition language (Navajo) that was written. I never accused Timothy of judging me. I just said:" I am not a witch" You read to much into this to foster your accusations on me. Your accusations on me have been reported to the administration.

[Baile]

Thunder Bow, we stopped with the arguing two pages ago, we're having a discussion here now.

[WabiSabi]

I believe that religion was originally an institution brought about by the wise in order to teach/guide the ignorant towards realizing the connection they have with their true self.

On that note, things change. Many religions fell to corruption and their teachings were pruned, standardized, and oft utilized by those in power to control populations. Despite such corruption, the original wisdom still resounds throughout the teachings of these religions.

[Thunder Bow]

Originally Posted by Baile

Every belief system, including yours and mine, are nothing other than a reflection of our current understanding. That understanding changes from year to year, from lifetime to lifetime. People are where they are at in their understanding, because that's what they need. Some people may need social order and control. Also, religion for many is about learning to love. So religion isn't a bad thing for many.

You talk about judgment and say someone is judging you, but then your judge religion with this incredibly harsh and one-sided perspective. I agree religion has many serious faults, and I am the first to point them out in an open discussion. But the OP is asking a very simple question and making a very loving statement about religion. In cases like that I feel it is appropriate to honor the spirit of the inquiry; in this case, add something equally positive while confirming that which is good in religion.

I am not trying to tell you what to post, just suggesting there are human dynamics to take into account with any question, including assessing the spirit of the inquiry.

So you call this a "discussion"? Buy bring me personally into it? You are that one that started this in response to:

"Religion is all about social order and control. You can have character, without being subservient to a "Master". This my original post on page one.

[Lynn]

Hello Members

This thread has turned into what we do not want here on SF "religion is about control" and while I admit that some of us have issues around being in a faith or religion that has given us pain and we are battered by that maybe. We most times have the free will to move past that and to see the 'growth' that might have been there in that life path.

We from day one are under some forms of control we just have to accept that as the way we learn I feel. We go to school and are expected to act a certain way, we go out in public as a child and we are expected to behave a certain way. So on some levels that is 'control.'

With anything that is organized social clubs, religion, sports teams ext ext there is that 'control' in the rules that are put forth. So religion is no different there is a protocal to it but that does not mean its all wrong for us on our path of learning.

I used to think I was born into the wrong family ,and to the wrong faith, and that I was hurt by that. What I now know is that without those foundations put in place for me from birth I would have not become whom I am, and I honestly would not be here on SF.

Going forwards I do not want to see any member "bashing and that mean everyone in this thread. Or I will close it.

Lynn
SF Admin

[Thunder Bow]

Originally Posted by jimrich

For me, religion is a way to remember the higher/nobler values in life such as: Do unto others and love thy neighbor and love/respect Spirit and other high/lovable stuff that ordinary life either ignores or laughs at.
Unfortunately, religion can also encourage very bad and ugly things such as: FEAR, Jihad, the Crusades, the Inquisition, Imperialism, Plunder, fighting between most religious groups and members, hate, jealousy, vengeance, pedophile priests, greed, graft, violence and POLITICAL POWER in the hands of very evil people.
Just like most things in life, Religion contains both positive and negative features/energy so, take your pick...........positive religion or negative religion - it's your life.

I think this post sums it up the best. I strongly agree with this.