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  #41  
Old Yesterday, 04:29 AM
Gem Gem is offline
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  #42  
Old Yesterday, 04:31 AM
Gem Gem is offline
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Yes, I speak of the underlying aspects of mindfulness, and I was saying the practice is conscious awareness with equanimity.

This is going to get more difficult to follow, as I articulate the intricacies uncovered in my own practice. The grasping mind can't comprehend it, because it can't be understood theoretically. One has to look to see of themselves what meaning there might be in all this. I am of the view that all listening should be like that, but I make mention of it specifically here because the meditation isn't going to be learned here and practiced later on. It has to be practiced here and now.

As this is a dialogue, it is mainly centred on the practice of 'right speech'. All the aspects of the 8 path, including 'right speech', require mindfulness, and mindfulness is primarily self-awareness - conscious awareness of what is going on with you. We have to have self awareness, be conscious of our thoughts and feelings, because this whole project is about becoming conscious of what used to be unconscious of. That is what insight is - to realise things - and that's the 'path to wisdom'.

I'm sure we have all met people who are highly knowldgable who behave most foolishly, and met people who don't know much about anything who are wise in their ways. I stress this because the path isn't the competition of what I know against those who know better. It's the path that opens up to the 'spirit' with it's qualities of care and compassion. We often see the knowledge game being played in these spiritual talks, and with that game we see a deterioration of compassion. Lately in the Non-Dual threads that is the arising of angst, and this has been characteristic of the Buddhist section in the past also, but we can't see deeply, listen well, speak respectfully when the mind is reacting so wildly.

In this case we have to be alert, so we are conscious of the slightest stirrings of personal reactivity, because once it becomes pronounced the mind is too gross to perceive it, and people become caught up in the cycle - which many become lost in. This is a Buddhist section, and the topic is mindfulness, so this is where such cycles are interrupted.

I spoke too long, but I hope I'm not being a bore.
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  #43  
Old Yesterday, 10:41 AM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gem
Yes, I speak of the underlying aspects of mindfulness, and I was saying the practice is conscious awareness with equanimity.

This is going to get more difficult to follow, as I articulate the intricacies uncovered in my own practice. The grasping mind can't comprehend it, because it can't be understood theoretically. One has to look to see of themselves what meaning there might be in all this. I am of the view that all listening should be like that, but I make mention of it specifically here because the meditation isn't going to be learned here and practiced later on. It has to be practiced here and now.

As this is a dialogue, it is mainly centred on the practice of 'right speech'. All the aspects of the 8 path, including 'right speech', require mindfulness, and mindfulness is primarily self-awareness - conscious awareness of what is going on with you. We have to have self awareness, be conscious of our thoughts and feelings, because this whole project is about becoming conscious of what used to be unconscious of. That is what insight is - to realise things - and that's the 'path to wisdom'.

I'm sure we have all met people who are highly knowldgable who behave most foolishly, and met people who don't know much about anything who are wise in their ways. I stress this because the path isn't the competition of what I know against those who know better. It's the path that opens up to the 'spirit' with it's qualities of care and compassion. We often see the knowledge game being played in these spiritual talks, and with that game we see a deterioration of compassion. Lately in the Non-Dual threads that is the arising of angst, and this has been characteristic of the Buddhist section in the past also, but we can't see deeply, listen well, speak respectfully when the mind is reacting so wildly.

In this case we have to be alert, so we are conscious of the slightest stirrings of personal reactivity, because once it becomes pronounced the mind is too gross to perceive it, and people become caught up in the cycle - which many become lost in. This is a Buddhist section, and the topic is mindfulness, so this is where such cycles are interrupted.

I spoke too long, but I hope I'm not being a bore.

Hello Gem, don't let your mind believe your a bore or speak too long..hehe


Personal reactivity can be so subtle and slight that sometimes we don't even notice ourselves being in this way.

I have been in some deeper discussions lately with a friend who has studied Buddhism over many many years, yet I find her to be one of the most "stuck in her mind" people. I suppose I find it odd that people reach these points within themselves and cut themselves off, all the while aware of the process of themselves, the knowledge and awareness of how to be, yet??? I guess pain and entering into the fullness of your pain or what you are as a more complete person, is not about knowledge and understanding, but the willingness to look more directly at yourself as the experience of all that in your being, open to it all.

In my own work with others most are over rampant in their heads, wondering why they cannot see the light, feel their peace and move more mindful and effortlessly...Such is the nature of life at times..
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  #44  
Old Today, 03:25 AM
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Originally Posted by naturesflow
Hello Gem, don't let your mind believe your a bore or speak too long..hehe


Personal reactivity can be so subtle and slight that sometimes we don't even notice ourselves being in this way.

True.

Quote:
I have been in some deeper discussions lately with a friend who has studied Buddhism over many many years, yet I find her to be one of the most "stuck in her mind" people.

I suppose I find it odd that people reach these points within themselves and cut themselves off, all the while aware of the process of themselves, the knowledge and awareness of how to be, yet???

I think people get caught up in the knowledge and from what I have seen, that leads to an acrimonious vibe, snide remarks and so forth, so we lose the feel, and from there it's all in the head.

I generally try to steer away from the teachings themselves because I think teachings become an authoritative knowledge system which people check against, and it's better to check against yourself, because that means one is seeing for themselves rather than affirming 'what they know'.

For example, when I talk about being truthful, no one has a theory of that. There is no story about it which forms as knowledge and I don't have any idea what it is.

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I guess pain and entering into the fullness of your pain or what you are as a more complete person, is not about knowledge and understanding, but the willingness to look more directly at yourself as the experience of all that in your being, open to it all.

Exactly. And in the mindfulness there isn't a paradigm of pleasure and pain in terms of desire and aversion respectively. In my serious long sittings there is a lot of discomfort, so I'm not here to say mindfulness is about wonderful experiences, though of course there are both wonderful and terrible experiences, as this is true to life. The mindful practice is regardless of the experience any individual is having, as it is an unconditional peace of mind.

It's improbable that we people participating this thread are completely free of mental disturbances. We probably can keep that even keel up to a point, but when the experience becomes extreme, like severe pain or full on rush in energy, the resistance kicks in at some point. Hence all life is the mindful practice to strengthen or stablise the equanimity, and thus prepare for the greater extremes. I have found this to be essential to the purification process, be that ones own or in serving others.

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In my own work with others most are over rampant in their heads, wondering why they cannot see the light, feel their peace and move more mindful and effortlessly...Such is the nature of life at times..

That's right, so you are are the still space it arises within, and as you yourself are not affected, it gives the torment space to move, and there is an art in creating that space.

To me there is a skill in being able to step back and just watch, but there's also necessity to be completely immersed in whatever you do. I remember when I was a performing musician, the show started with my very careful listening, a huge effort of calm concentration to get every note just right, which gets me to a place where it just clicks, and I'm within it. Then I don't 'know' what it sounds like. I'm aware of everything I do; I'm still listening in intricate detail, but my mind doesn't register anything of it.
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  #45  
Old Today, 03:39 AM
catsquotl catsquotl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gem
I generally try to steer away from the teachings themselves because I think teachings become an authoritative knowledge system which people check against, and it's better to check against yourself, because that means one is seeing for themselves rather than affirming 'what they know'.

I'll bow out of this conversation then.
My tendency to include the teachings themselves is take them as a base to establish a common vocabulary. Not hit anyone over the head with them or confuse them..

I realize that what I receive from the texts, The conformation of what I know in them. Differs from what others think they perceive and know..

Sorry to have butted in like this.

With Love
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  #46  
Old Today, 04:11 AM
Gem Gem is offline
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Originally Posted by catsquotl
I'll bow out of this conversation then.
My tendency to include the teachings themselves is take them as a base to establish a common vocabulary. Not hit anyone over the head with them or confuse them..

I realize that what I receive from the texts, The conformation of what I know in them. Differs from what others think they perceive and know..

Sorry to have butted in like this.

With Love

The thing about this thread and the threads I start in this section, is the meditation is current with the discourse, so it's not so much 'about' the practice as it is the fostering of practice itself. It's not to come here and learn things, but to be mindful here and now. Otherwise it's just a debate which is ruled over by being right, as opposed to a discussion founded in 'right' as that word is used in the 8 path.
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