Ending capitalism is possible...

[Podshell]

Thats the thing if we consider the global market place , the poor are suffering really bad in order to provide many luxuries for the west, we are getting some karmic rebound for this, forget so called 'developement' it is a con to suck more goods from the poor nations at a cheaper cost, the investors got their fingers burnt and now the lowest paid and those on benefit here are having to foot the bill via price rises, benefit cuts etc.

The Tories cuts are beginning to show here (northern England) ...If we only had a labour party that was as harsh with the rich as the Tories have been with the poor then things would be better.

[Podshell]

Wonder why we ignore systems that are already in existence that provide for all are good for the environment and where most have some job to do,? this happens in properly run temple systems, kibbitz, communes etc, even in animal hunting packs and even communal insects. Why don't we learn from these physical practical examples?

Originally Posted by Chrysaetos

You call property unhealthy? Well my friend that's what a communist would say.

Democracy is still the best option we have (it recognizes differences). As for the few that control the many, If you live your life with the attitude then you won't get far. In our western world you have the means to achieve a successful life. If we want to blame it all on the government or ''the rich'' then we don't really propose a new system, we're just lining up with socialists and communists... blaming our lack of motivation on those who don't lack it.

Why should hard working, educated people pay for the attitudes of the lazy in the western world? I've seen poverty in Africa and Asia, people who lack welfare.
When I go home I see people willingly living on the dole and people who didn't pay attention back in school, and then they blame society..

And whose society do they blame ?

Democracy and the Criminal Ruling Elite -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sr8l1o1QCHU

[Tezorian]

Originally Posted by Chrysaetos

You call property unhealthy? Well my friend that's what a communist would say.

You're not reading my words, but your interpretation of them. There is a big difference.

Not sure where democracy came into play, but that's not what this is about.

Originally Posted by Chrysaetos

Why should hard working, educated people pay for the attitudes of the lazy in the western world? I've seen poverty in Africa and Asia, people who lack welfare.
When I go home I see people willingly living on the dole and people who didn't pay attention back in school, and then they blame society..

All i get from this is a feeling of resentment. And again, what i said before, you're reading your own interpretation of my words. If you please, read my text again and don't read what you think i'm saying, but what i am saying.

[Chrysaetos]

Hi,

It was in post #1, third part...

It's time to get back into shape. To cast out the unhealthy habits. Quantity, property, loneliness, heartless, careless, depression and what not. It's not going to be easy, since even the governments are acting like kids.

Indulge me..

Originally Posted by Tezorian

All i get from this is a feeling of resentment. And again, what i said before, you're reading your own interpretation of my words. If you please, read my text again and don't read what you think i'm saying, but what i am saying.

There is no valid alternative for capitalism, nor is it desirable. Innovation and progress will deteriorate.

[Podshell]

I think innovation and progress will rapidly increase under a better system, take the patenting of inventions and getting them up and going into society for the benefit of all, the present system is based on selfishness and competition, money fame and fortune, the opposite of what it should be.

[Tezorian]

Originally Posted by Chrysaetos

Hi,

It was in post #1, third part...

Indulge me.. There is no valid alternative for capitalism, nor is it desirable. Innovation and progress will deteriorate.

You take one out of all. But to make things clear, hopefully, property as in more is better. "More" to be happier, gratified, fulfilled, yet with each purchase, you only want more. It's never enough.

Would you be willing to explain why there is no valid alternative for capitalism. This is nothing more than the "You're wrong! End of discussion!" comment. It does not contribute to this thread.

As far as it not being desirable, the reason why you would react this way has already been addressed.

Originally Posted by Wisa'ka

Advanced capitalism has proven to be neither earth or people friendly. No big surprise those who are seduced by such a way will defend it to the hilt.

As far as the last statement... Money is ancient and has never been innovated, improved or even stayed the same. It has become a tool of supression basically, instead of a means of trade.

[Blue Tiger]

On one level, your proposal is interesting to say the least. It does seem reminiscent of communism and socialism, though, which have both experienced quite a few difficulties when theory meets real world. Perhaps by studying those systems, yours can be refined and avoid the issues they have difficulty with.

The biggest obstacle I see with your proposal is precisely the "lack of money." On an individual basis a monthly guaranteed income is fine, but how would anyone save money to build businesses, buy equipment, and create jobs?

What incentive would a company have to build products, if there were no "cash" profit? What incentive would individuals have to put out their optimal effort, if their pay is the same regardless as long as they hold a job?

Also, give a thought to the number of citizens who would be put out of jobs, if there were no money. Banks would close. Retailers would shut down. Mortgage lenders, Wall Street, real estate agents, car salesmen... When everyone has enough but no way to get more, very few will have any means of acquiring "luxury" items like big-screen tvs. Factories making big-screen tvs and stainless steel refrigerators would essentially shut down, or switch to building only basic/low-end models.

Capitalism is VERY far from perfect. I certainly appreciate the thought you've given this topic. Can you refine it, to address some of the issues I and others have brought up?

[vicky3619]

I think it’s very rough sketch,but continue to search you will eventually find something,even if it’s just a piece of the big changements.I don’t agree with ALL but the main line I agree.

As someone said on TV a long time ago, "You'll get pill 1 to get rid of the rash. Pill 1 has a nasty side effect and you get to take pill 2 for that. Pill 2 has a side-effect too and for that you get pill 3. The combination of pill 1 and 3 could possible give you a headache. To make sure it doesn't happen, you get pill 4 and so on and so on. You end up taking 12 pills who cost $50 a bottle or more, which you have to take 3 times a day for just a rash."

THIS is so true.
Our modern healthcare system is not good.And here I talk of first hands experiences as you know it.

They talk about having a heart, yet they don't care about the homeless. The more they have, the smaller their heart is. The more they have, the less they give. The ones who have the least, give the most. Shouldn't every single cell deserve the same treatment and attention? Shouldn't every cell have a heart of the same size? Doesn't every cell deserve to be shaken up, so they can wake up? So they can see what it is they desire? What it is they need? Isn't healthier much better than being saturated with all the stuff that kills you? Isn't it time to finally start to work as one entire organ? Isn't it time to step into the young adult stage?

Agree.

Podshell,

I am in a lot of agreement with you, I am somewhat amazed that the occupy movement was demonized to the extent it was in certain quarters.

Imagine that, people protesting about transparent social injustice and being treated like criminals for it.