The Lords Prayer

[Honza]

Where does this prayer originate from? Sorry to be so ignorant but I don't even know if it is in the Bible.

I take it has Jewish origins. Or is it of Christian origin?

The prayer which goes like this;

"Our Father who art in heaven,
Hallowed be thy name,
Thy Kingdom come,
Thy will be done,
On earth as it is in heaven,
Give us this day our daily bread,
And forgive us our tresspasses,
As we forgive those who tresspass against us,
Save us from Evil,
And lead us not into temptation,
For thine is the Kingdom,
The power and the glory,
Forever and ever,
Amen."

Is that how it goes, or have I missed anything?

Thankyou for any information about "The Lords Prayer".

[Silver]

Our father who art in heaven
hallowed be thy name
thy kingdom come
thy will be done
on earth as it is in heaven
give us this day our daily bread
and forgive us our trespasses
as we forgive those who trespass against us
and lead us not into temptation
but deliver us from evil
for thine is the kingdom and the power and the glory
forever and ever
amen

That's how the one goes I was raised with.
Idk the other answers to your questions.

[Honza]

Thats it Silvergirl. I thought I muddled it up somewhere.

"...and lead us not into temptation
but deliver us from Evil...."

is where I got muddled up.

Thanks.

Originally Posted by Honza

Thats it Silvergirl. I thought I muddled it up somewhere.

"...and lead us not into temptation
but deliver us from Evil...."

is where I got muddled up.

Thanks.

Exactly, Honza. This sentence does not make sense, does it? Why should God lead people into temptation when everyone "knows" that it is Satan/Devil.

I do not know the origin of the Lord's Prayer but do not think it originated with Judaism.

Originally Posted by Bluegreen

Exactly, Honza. This sentence does not make sense, does it? Why should God lead people into temptation when everyone "knows" that it is Satan/Devil.

I do not know the origin of the Lord's Prayer but do not think it originated with Judaism.

Some thoughts upon the delicate subject of Theodicy. Or something like that.

Satan is a function of God. In Job, ha-satan, 'the adversary' is a member of the Lord's divine council and plays, well... devil's advocate
It's only in the New Testament and some apocrypha, that satan becomes a Satan in the proper, and turns into a more duelistic figure. Some scholars have suggested it might be due to Jewish contact to Zoroastrianism during the Achaemenid Empire's overrule. Asking God to deliver oneself from temptation makes sense, when one remembers scenes of God testing people through the Scriptures, effectively 'tempting' them on several occasions; tempting choices that tend to lead to 'evil' results.

As for the originality of the Lord's Prayer - it's ideas are expressed all throughout the Hebrew Bible, but it's only recorded as we know it through the lips of Jesus, making it a Christian prayer, pretty much.

Originally Posted by Animus27

Some thoughts upon the delicate subject of Theodicy. Or something like that.

Satan is a function of God. In Job, ha-satan, 'the adversary' is a member of the Lord's divine council and plays, well... devil's advocate
It's only in the New Testament and some apocrypha, that satan becomes a Satan in the proper, and turns into a more duelistic figure. Some scholars have suggested it might be due to Jewish contact to Zoroastrianism during the Achaemenid Empire's overrule. Asking God to deliver oneself from temptation makes sense, when one remembers scenes of God testing people through the Scriptures, effectively 'tempting' them on several occasions; tempting choices that tend to lead to 'evil' results.

As for the originality of the Lord's Prayer - it's ideas are expressed all throughout the Hebrew Bible, but it's only recorded as we know it through the lips of Jesus, making it a Christian prayer, pretty much.

Anumus27, What I said is not what I believe.

The book by Manly P. Hall, Masonic Hermetic Qabbalistic & Rosicrucian Symbolical Philosophy, has a beautiful allegory about Adam and the Serpent, the Adversary. Adam banished from the Garden of Eden represents man philosophically exiled from the sphere of Truth. After many attempts to enter into his Father's house which he was always prevented from doing by a cherubim, finally heard a voice saying "He who is aware, IS! Behold!" and he finds himself in a radiant place, "in the midst of which stands a tree with flasing jewels for fruit and entwined about its trunk a flaming, winged serpent crowned with a diadem of stars. It was the serpent who had spoken."

Adam asked the creature who he was.

"I," the serpent answers, "am Satan who was stoned; I am the Adversary--the Lord who is against you, ...I have led you into temptation...I am the guardian of the Tree of Knowledge and I have sworn that none whom I can lead astray shall partake of its fruits."

Adam replies that he will no longer tempted by the serpent "There is no happiness, no peace, no good, no future in the doctrines of selfhishness, hate" etc.

And the serpent answers: "Behold, O Adam, the nature of thy Adversary!"

The serpent disappears and in its place stands an angel with scarlet wings that spread from one corner of the heavens to the other. It says:

"I am the Lord who is against thee and thus accomplishes thy salvation," ... Thou hast hated me, but through the ages yet to be thou shalt bless me, for...I have turned thee against the illusion of worldliness...I have awakened in thy soul the immortality of which I myself partake..."

[Silver]

No problem, glad to help.

Jesus was an itenerant teacher/preacher, going around telling large groups of people parables intended to show them a more loving way of living. One of his disciples followed him up a hillside one day and asked him to teach him how to pray to God as he did himself. Jesus shared a format for prayer, not some dogma that should be followed exactly by every group every time they get together for more than 2,000 years. So many people forget to think for themselves, eh?

Yes, it's in the bible, Matthew 6: 9-13. Also Luke 11: 2-4.

[Silver]

Right. What seems to have become the habit is to say the Lord's Prayer and then tack on whatever we feel the need to speak to him about. Growing up, my mom taught us to say the lord's prayer and then God bless and then name all of our family members. Then of course, tack on our own personal private stuff...

Hnoza,

There are similar things in the Lord's prayer that are found in the OT. It isn't word for word, now rather that is because of translation or not I do not know. Hope this helps some.

Elements of the Lord's Prayer can be found in the Pentateuch, the first five books of the Hebrew Scriptures. Lancelot Andrews (1555-1626), an Anglican writer, paraphrased the Lord's Prayer from Old Testament passages:

"Let thy name be called upon of us. (Genesis 4:26). Be thou our shield and our exceeding great reward (Genesis 15:1). What word so ever proceedeth from thee, Let it not be in us to speak aught against it, whether good or bad, (Numbers 24:13). Give us bread to eat and raiment to put on. (Genesis 2:8-20). And now pardon the iniquity and the unrighteousness of thy servants. (Numbers 14:19). And, O Lord, let us not think anxiously in our hearts all the day long. (Deuteronomy 28:32). And let no evils take hold of us, (Deuteronomy 31:17)" 1 http://www.religioustolerance.org/prayer_4.htm

nightowl