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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > Spirituality

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  #11  
Old 21-09-2012, 06:31 PM
silent whisper
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteShaman
So if the guru is right and if everyone is not real, then neither is he and neither are you and there is no one to go into oneness and no one to feel alone.
Problem solved...........don't give it another thought.

Gee you know how to cut short life...as we know it...
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  #12  
Old 21-09-2012, 07:28 PM
Papa Bear Papa Bear is offline
Master
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,186
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThoughtBroadcaster
i am working with a guru but i want to know if it is true that everyone is not real? that they are just reflections of myself? in a way i fear going into oneness because i will be all alone and that there will be no other. i hope someone will be able to tell me this is not true. i know now why people say ignorance is bliss.

Hi ThoughtBroadcaster;
Oneness is comparable to the `whole` in harmony, but the `whole` is also the `sum of its parts` and as they `must` be as real as the whole they produce in entirety, nothing can be unreal or the whole is unreal.

Differing natures perceive each other in difference, I do not perceive the `cells` of my body universe, but I would be foolish to declare them illusions because my `whole` body is my reality.

Reality is defined by the nature of where it is perceived from, so if everyone is `not real` then neither are you, so do you perceive yourself to be `not real`?

The question of oneness starts with the nature of your life and its surrounding nature, so if we are not harmonized in oneness with human life`s nature, how can we presume to be more `real` harmonized within a Spiritual nature.

We are as real as we are real to each other in reflection, in all natures we may harmonize with.
__________________
Peace be with you
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  #13  
Old 21-09-2012, 07:48 PM
Mountain-Goat
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThoughtBroadcaster
anyone ever experienced oneness?
Often, when riding my MTB as one example.
There are moments while riding when i am in harmony with the bike, that my mind percieves/senses/feels that my bike is my body.
That the bike is simply an extention of my body that i am so accustomed to.
I am fully aware the bike is metal and mechanical, different from my body, separate,
but at the same time, in those moments when i percieve/sense/conclude
that me and bike are in synchronous movement/action/purpose,
it is no longer me (my body and mind) on top of a bike riding through a bush trail, instead,
it is me that has a frame and wheels and i am rolling on the trail instead of walking.
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  #14  
Old 21-09-2012, 08:17 PM
arive nan
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
i am working with a guru but i want to know if it is true that everyone is not real? that they are just reflections of myself? in a way i fear going into oneness because i will be all alone and that there will be no other. i hope someone will be able to tell me this is not true. i know now why people say ignorance is bliss.

I have had this experience. But I would not say that everyone is not real. That is not how I would put it. Things/people/etc exist... but the way they seem to exist while in a dual state of awareness is very different from the way they seem to exist in the nondual state of awareness.

In the nondual/oneness state of awareness, the separations between people and objects that normally seemed so real your whole life suddenly seem like an illusion. The separation is what doesn't seem real anymore. We are all different parts, POVs, sets of memories, and etc. of the same being. That one being has consciousness. The individuals that are part of it have consciousness and individual POVs, but their consciousness is part of the consciousness of the one being we are all a part of. Individuals can change or expand their awareness until they experience that one being consciousness and then retain some memory of the experience. And then they can go on with their lives as individuals with individual POVs, but with the memory that the world/reality is not really as it seems to be. Generally, this is a positive thing that helps people to cope with life's difficulties and discover more insights and etc.

During the experience itself, most people find it feels very blissful. Many feel that this oneness is full of a feeling that seems like a unique kind of love. At least, of all the human feelings that we can look to for comparison, the feeling that we know of as "love" comes the closest. But it is not precisely the same thing, because it is all encompassing. During this awareness of being one with everything and awareness of an all encompassing love within this everything, that includes the stuff that in a "normal" dual state of awareness is considered bad, very bad, evil, and etc. It doesn't mean that the individual now loves things that are generally considered horribly evil. It just means that this is a different kind of love. You can still be able to recognise after the experience that some things are very unhealthy/immoral from a human perspective and respond to them accordingly.
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  #15  
Old 21-09-2012, 08:42 PM
TzuJanLi
Posts: n/a
 
Greetings..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Papa Bear
Hi ThoughtBroadcaster;
Oneness is comparable to the `whole` in harmony, but the `whole` is also the `sum of its parts` and as they `must` be as real as the whole they produce in entirety, nothing can be unreal or the whole is unreal.

Differing natures perceive each other in difference, I do not perceive the `cells` of my body universe, but I would be foolish to declare them illusions because my `whole` body is my reality.

Reality is defined by the nature of where it is perceived from, so if everyone is `not real` then neither are you, so do you perceive yourself to be `not real`?

The question of oneness starts with the nature of your life and its surrounding nature, so if we are not harmonized in oneness with human life`s nature, how can we presume to be more `real` harmonized within a Spiritual nature.

We are as real as we are real to each other in reflection, in all natures we may harmonize with.
Hi PB: That feels like an experienced state of clarity.. may i ask about the 'reflection' statement? is it intended to illustrate how our relationships with others reveal perspectives of ourselves? One of my mentors used to say, "what you see in others is a 'reflection' of the energy you are projecting", is this consistent with your use of 'reflection'?

Be well..
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  #16  
Old 21-09-2012, 09:40 PM
TzuJanLi
Posts: n/a
 
Greetings,,

Quote:
Originally Posted by arive nan
I have had this experience. But I would not say that everyone is not real. That is not how I would put it. Things/people/etc exist... but the way they seem to exist while in a dual state of awareness is very different from the way they seem to exist in the nondual state of awareness.

In the nondual/oneness state of awareness, the separations between people and objects that normally seemed so real your whole life suddenly seem like an illusion. The separation is what doesn't seem real anymore. We are all different parts, POVs, sets of memories, and etc. of the same being. That one being has consciousness. The individuals that are part of it have consciousness and individual POVs, but their consciousness is part of the consciousness of the one being we are all a part of. Individuals can change or expand their awareness until they experience that one being consciousness and then retain some memory of the experience. And then they can go on with their lives as individuals with individual POVs, but with the memory that the world/reality is not really as it seems to be. Generally, this is a positive thing that helps people to cope with life's difficulties and discover more insights and etc.

During the experience itself, most people find it feels very blissful. Many feel that this oneness is full of a feeling that seems like a unique kind of love. At least, of all the human feelings that we can look to for comparison, the feeling that we know of as "love" comes the closest. But it is not precisely the same thing, because it is all encompassing. During this awareness of being one with everything and awareness of an all encompassing love within this everything, that includes the stuff that in a "normal" dual state of awareness is considered bad, very bad, evil, and etc. It doesn't mean that the individual now loves things that are generally considered horribly evil. It just means that this is a different kind of love. You can still be able to recognise after the experience that some things are very unhealthy/immoral from a human perspective and respond to them accordingly.
Hi arive nan: The highlighted portion of your post is really nicely stated, and is very similar to my own experience and understanding.. in contrast to the 'feeling' being one of 'love', though.. i can best describe the feeling as immeasurable exhilaration and elation, awe and wonder.. the urge to explode into the 'whole' of it, and the trepidation of leaving physical Life 'unfinished', as it would be easy 'let go' into the whole.. i experience this feeling at the 'gate', at the transition from predominantly physical awareness to awareness as the 'whole'.. the sudden surge of a universe of sensations, a symphony of individual vibrations combining into a deep resonant tangible 'sound', or.. possibly realizing a 'source' vibration, Om or Aum as the Hindu Ancients understood it, a 'source' from which all that is, 'is'.. The Origin.

Sure, i could use 'love' or 'bliss', or some other 'word' as shorthand for this amazing experience, but.. i find it very useful to use the richness of language to express the depth and scope of this experience.. i am surprised at how willing people are to reduce the expansiveness into shorthand references, but that's just my personal whim..

Then, there is the shift into a soft ecstasy, when i, as the 'whole', find the space between the manifestations of my 'isness' and feel that space expand beyond what 'is', and into what 'is'.. here, 'we' are actually Whole, feeling all that ever has been unfolding into what 'is' through the miracle of 'experience', where we return to the individual manifestation of our Wholeness, ecstatically aware of the Whole in every singular manifestation of its Wholeness..

Well heck, i had no idea i would choose this time to reveal this much, but.. there you have it.. thanks for the inspiration..

Be well..
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  #17  
Old 21-09-2012, 10:24 PM
Xan Xan is offline
Master
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: here... now...
Posts: 11,896
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Well said, arive nan...

In knowing oneness we still exist and love is still love, but differently... in a way that can't be described.


Xan
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Go within, beloveds. Go deep within to the Heart of your Being.
The Truth is found there and nowhere else.-Sananda

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  #18  
Old 21-09-2012, 11:27 PM
Mathew
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThoughtBroadcaster
i am working with a guru but i want to know if it is true that everyone is not real? that they are just reflections of myself? in a way i fear going into oneness because i will be all alone and that there will be no other. i hope someone will be able to tell me this is not true. i know now why people say ignorance is bliss.

If it vibrates it's real in what ever form it takes, even thought vibrates so this takes us into something quite different to what we believe in being real.

It depends in what reality & cycle of time within that reality you are in I suppose if it's real or not, in the cave man days science didn't exist until man had enough conscious understanding to develop his brain to make deductive reasoning thus science became real through a higher conscious thought.

Your not alone in that fear of being alone once one becomes one with all, what is happening here is a very real feeling of separation from this reality but you are never alone no matter what you do it just feels that way because it's different.

Personally I love my human ignorance because it keeps me in this realty which I came here in the first place to experience.

Love
Mathew
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  #19  
Old 21-09-2012, 11:31 PM
Mathew
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteShaman
So if the guru is right and if everyone is not real, then neither is he and neither are you and there is no one to go into oneness and no one to feel alone.
Problem solved...........don't give it another thought.

Good point WS......even if everything was real your still not alone!!!...so it really doesn't matter what you think your still not alone!!

Love
Mathew
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  #20  
Old 21-09-2012, 11:35 PM
Mathew
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Papa Bear
Hi ThoughtBroadcaster;
Oneness is comparable to the `whole` in harmony, but the `whole` is also the `sum of its parts` and as they `must` be as real as the whole they produce in entirety, nothing can be unreal or the whole is unreal.

Differing natures perceive each other in difference, I do not perceive the `cells` of my body universe, but I would be foolish to declare them illusions because my `whole` body is my reality.

Reality is defined by the nature of where it is perceived from, so if everyone is `not real` then neither are you, so do you perceive yourself to be `not real`?

The question of oneness starts with the nature of your life and its surrounding nature, so if we are not harmonized in oneness with human life`s nature, how can we presume to be more `real` harmonized within a Spiritual nature.

We are as real as we are real to each other in reflection, in all natures we may harmonize with.

I've never seen it stated so well before TB....yes of course it's real!!

Love
Mathew
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