Self-transformation

[marekmjvc]

Hello everyone

I would like to ask you about this topic which is still considered basically prohibited to talk about. Any yes.. my title self-transformation is referring to suicide. But I don't like this word it carries so much anxiety and deep sadness in it that's why I used this other term that I made up and this is what I would like to discuss with you.

What do you think about consciously leaving this experience behind when you understand that you just limited yourself for the purpose of learning, maybe being an example for other souls, other people?.. Leaving it but with the smile on your face because nothing ever went wrong you understand it and you're happy to be unlimited again and looking forward to see and be the whole.

Do you see it like I do? That it's not a bad thing when you truly desire to drop limitations even though you know that if you would stay you would just learn more.. So it's not running away from the experience you fear it's just not being interested in processes here.

Can you state your opinion onto this topic?

[Swami Chihuahuananda]

I understand where I think you're coming from. I understand my perspective about it , in my way, and I have no real problem with going that route, if, at some time in the future, it feels like the right choice. I do not feel burdened by society's taboos, or any cultural, or spirituality-based idealisms about the sanctity of life . I feel that's it's completely a personal decision, and that everyone has the sovereign right of choice of how and when they wish to leave the body behind.

[Ellusivepoet]

Each of us were set upon a journey when we were given the breath of life. How can you complete a journey, when to stop it in the middle? With so much to learn see and do, the boundaries are limitless if you choose to see it. In druidical lore we are taught that 'walking the path and taking the journey is what we must do, should we stop by our own hand then we will only have to do it again and again until we understand it.' limits apply only to the mind and body not what is truly you, the spirit. If you walk through life in-tune with your spirit there is no limit.
To me I feel it is wrong to cheat myself of this journey by taking my life,nor would I consider doing so.

[Shivani Devi]

If this is meant to be an objective view of the subject (suicide) and in no way represents any personal situation anywhere, then I'll share my deep feelings on this subject.

Always remember you were put here for a reason and purpose, it's just that at times, that seems unclear and obscure to you...but be patient, my child all will be revealed in time and you'll understand. There's a time and a place for everything. There's someone who still believes in you even when you don't believe in yourself anymore...you can choose whatever name you want to attach to Him, but He is real!

Life is a precious gift, but it also comes with a curse. Those who end it prematurely will only get the 'Groundhog Day effect' in another dimension until they get it right.

Even if you don't believe in yourself, I believe in you (for what that is worth), just think how sad you are going to make your family, friends and those who love you (you'll find them if you look around)? If you had any love in your heart left for them, you'd let them help you, or at least give you a 'starting point' to help yourself.

Nobody has any power over you unless you let them and taking your own life (instead of taking it back), is just the 'easy way out' when something more beautiful than you can ever imagine in your life just waits around the corner.

As my 'spirit box friends' like to say (their favourite saying) "Chin up, buttercup!"

Aum Namah Shivaya

[Swami Chihuahuananda]

I don't buy all the idealistic rhetoric about this, sorry. I'm thinking of people in situations where disease has their bodies near the end , and they choose not to remain in a pain-filled shell that no longer functions ,or when people actually have "fulfilled their purpose" and have the awareness of their next step being to leave this life , and simply taking that step . I'm not going to be convinced that choosing to leave isn't between me and my own Spirit, should I feel that it is the appropriate choice at some point , just because so-and-so says we're "supposed to wait till the very end" . I no longer believe in the standard re-incarnation , where we are victims of a merit system and have no conscious choice about returning or not . There's already too much awareness of self in other realms to believe what I used to believe what I read out of books . That's just how I feel about it : if someone feels like they're ready to make the leap , then maybe they actually are ready , and it's not always because they hate life or themselves . I don't see why it can't be a conscious, loving, deliberate step.

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by Swami Chihuahuananda

I don't buy all the idealistic rhetoric about this, sorry. I'm thinking of people in situations where disease has their bodies near the end , and they choose not to remain in a pain-filled shell that no longer functions ,or when people actually have "fulfilled their purpose" and have the awareness of their next step being to leave this life , and simply taking that step . I'm not going to be convinced that choosing to leave isn't between me and my own Spirit, should I feel that it is the appropriate choice at some point , just because so-and-so says we're "supposed to wait till the very end" . I no longer believe in the standard re-incarnation , where we are victims of a merit system and have no conscious choice about returning or not . There's already too much awareness of self in other realms to believe what I used to believe what I read out of books . That's just how I feel about it : if someone feels like they're ready to make the leap , then maybe they actually are ready , and it's not always because they hate life or themselves . I don't see why it can't be a conscious, loving, deliberate step.

I am sorry if you felt my previous reply was just 'idealistic rhetoric'.

In your above situation where it's more a case of Euthanasia, 'Living Will' and 'Right to Die' my compassion leads me down a totally different path.

I am watching a relative of mine go through cancer right now and she only has 3 months to live...not a pretty sight.

I don't know what I would do if I found myself dependent on tubes, machines and doctors 24/7 to gain my next breath - although I fully understand that self-realisation can be obtained in one breath!

I'd probably want to 'make peace with my maker' and try and get as close to that feeling as possible then ask Him if he wouldn't mind it if somebody out there just 'put me out of my misery' because I doubt, being a 'loving God' he'd want to see me suffer like that.

Aum Namah Shivaya

There is, if one adheres to the concept of reincarnation, a door open for "self-transformation" that isn't open to some, or at least not opened as easily. It used to be, in certain tribal communities, particularly nomadic ones, where ir was perfectly acceptable to end one life to begin another if one felt that they could not properly serve the tribe. Any number of things could have created this situation. A hunter might have lost a limb during a hunt and feels that he is more a burden than a help. Sometimes it was the elderly or handicapped or dis-eased. My own feeling about it is indifference. Some folks choose it, others don't. I don't. Easy peasy. If I knew someone who did it I wouldn't be angry or worry that they were burning in hell or some such since whatever the afterlife holds for them is none of my business.
For me it isn't really so much that my viewpoint about suicide (self-transformation) isn't in line with generally held concepts about it, it is that my viewpoint of death itself is different.

[kris]

Originally Posted by marekmjvc

So it's not running away from the experience you fear it's just not being interested in processes here.

Can you state your opinion onto this topic?

Personally I think, you're here because you are, or were at some point, interested in the 'processes' here. If you have now lost interest in the 'processes' here, think of the possibility that you might again gain interest in the 'processes' here. If that happens, you will likely find find yourself right back here - back to square one!

[CrystalSong]

Having Choice is good, even if we choose not to use it. :)

[engellstein]

Abraham Hicks says "If you knew how much trouble you went to to get into these bodies you wouldn't spend so much time thinking about how to get out of them."

What you say makes sense on a level, but I guess a question to ask is "What now?" Like, what more can I accomplish now that I've come this far? How much further can I push the expansion of myself?