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  #11  
Old 16-06-2012, 02:42 PM
shadedragon shadedragon is offline
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Then stop searching. Let it come to you. Stop saying when, and say it is, now. Be what you want to be, here and now. That's the first step. By learning you become enilightened. You never stop learning. Set yourself op for success, don't just strive for it. Be it. It's not when I'm finished with school, it's I am finished with school,what can I do with this knowledge that I have. Everyone can still have problems, but it's letting them get to you is what one should try to avoid. Being at peace with them, then facing them off, allows you to be the bigger person, sets you up for success. I recommend that one stops thinking about "Me "and starts thinking about "We" and what is It that you seek?
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all things in our reality are there because they are a reflection of us, as for the time in thiers, we are a reflection of them.
the moment you try to find self is the begning of a journey to discover it doesn't exist


Project Spirit has set up a energy channel for anyone who needs it. We have it touch down in each country, and net outwards in them. You can access energy from this channel simply by intending to tap into it. Pm me if you'd like more info.

http://www.kindspring.org/
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  #12  
Old 16-06-2012, 03:21 PM
Dr.Truth
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by shadedragon
Then stop searching. Let it come to you. Stop saying when, and say it is, now. Be what you want to be, here and now. That's the first step. By learning you become enilightened. You never stop learning. Set yourself op for success, don't just strive for it. Be it. It's not when I'm finished with school, it's I am finished with school,what can I do with this knowledge that I have. Everyone can still have problems, but it's letting them get to you is what one should try to avoid. Being at peace with them, then facing them off, allows you to be the bigger person, sets you up for success. I recommend that one stops thinking about "Me "and starts thinking about "We" and what is It that you seek?

"Enlightenment" has been replaced with "it is what it is". Life has its ups and downs. There is no escaping that.

You say "stop saying when, and say it is, now". Okay, in a sense we could say I already am enlightened. My "enlightenment" is simply realising that there isn't any enlightenment. I simply accept what shows up and continue to try my best. What else is there to do?

Quote:
I recommend that one stops thinking about "Me "and starts thinking about "We" and what is It that you seek?

I can't change other people. I don't have that kind of power. What do I seek? Lots of things. Thats what life is all about: seeking. I understand that no amount of seeking (or finding for that matter) is ever really the answer - but thats the point you see - there is no answer... at least not in the ultimate sense... we may be able to improve our lives but we can't expect some perfect life where it is all sunshine/bliss/rainbows.
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  #13  
Old 16-06-2012, 04:11 PM
shadedragon shadedragon is offline
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how kind of enlightenment to tell you that :).
Have you ever ap'ed? That's one step. Then realizing you have more then one body is another. Then seeing that all are connected and all are One , moving onto all information being within our grasp. Try zooming out and taking a look yourself. You can affect what happen to others, you can change people. But they can change back, instantly or over time. I recall once a young girl standing out in a road while a car was coming. I was doomed out and observing this. To change the outcome, I made her eyes more attuned, put a thought in her mind asking herself to look both ways, and increased the loudness of the car while changing its speed. I also put a shield around her, and stimulated a need to move off the road. She got off right in time. You can change what happens to others, you can affect it directly or indirectly. But to do this, you have to realize that you can in the first place, aka a step in what you've been calling enlightenment. You can change the world, one step at a time, but you must be the change you want to see, you must act upon it, work within it.
__________________
all things in our reality are there because they are a reflection of us, as for the time in thiers, we are a reflection of them.
the moment you try to find self is the begning of a journey to discover it doesn't exist


Project Spirit has set up a energy channel for anyone who needs it. We have it touch down in each country, and net outwards in them. You can access energy from this channel simply by intending to tap into it. Pm me if you'd like more info.

http://www.kindspring.org/
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  #14  
Old 16-06-2012, 04:16 PM
Racer X
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.Truth
Okay, now in my opinion this is a very important question as it gives us some sort a vision to strive for.

Now, I've read ALOT of info from various gurus as to what enlightenment actually is and there seem to be 3 things which always come up. These are:

1. No "me". Apparently the feeling of a separate "me" is dissolved and is replaced by a feeling of wholeness/unity/emptiness.

Yes...... it is like this~ but "you" don't do it, you don't achieve it.... IT comes to YOU of its own accord.

2. A non-identification with mind. So one identifies themselves only as "consciousness" or "being" and thoughts are not enough to distract them from that peace of beingness. And some even take it a step further and claim that after a while thoughts and thinking STOP ALLTOGETHER!!!

It is the Holy INSTANT, yes it feels as all has stopped yet not because it stopped but that it never was! The moment just prior to "no-thought" is an Awareness of just how preposterous the idea of a "body" moving in space and time is.

3. The end of "seeking".

Yes....but that does not mean an end to learning and growth.


But I don't think enlightenment has anything to do with the above.

Wrong , the reasoning mind cannot comprehend the transcendent experience...... Enlightenment is a process of the old conditioned mind dissolving while at the same time the Divine Truth is growing and resolving.
The term "Enlightenment" needs to be cast aside as well...... because you cannot achieve a state of Enlightenment...... IT comes as a Mystery. Do you try? Yes....but you do not reach it by trying. Do you study? Yes, but you do not get a certificate in Enlightenment. Do you give up? Yes, after you have exhausted all your resistance....this often comes as a brush with death experience.

In fact I don't think there is even such a thing as enlightenment or the end of suffering.

Also wrong. The "thought" that there is not such a thing is a wall you cannot cross or see through. This will be your greatest stumbling block and you will find many willing to support your idea because they unconsciously do not want you to be free while they are bound. Bound by what? Bound by the attachment to there precious ideas.

Its just that after deep meditation one can feel certain things like "silence" or "peace" but the mind always creeps back in. It has to in order for one to live their life.

This is the little me(EGO) speaking. "My story" does not want to die and so it creeps back in. This is not "wrong" , it simply is a part of the process.


And so what I'm proposing is that the most we can hope for is just the ability to meditate really deeply and be able to do it often so we can feel that nice feeling of bliss/oneness in everyday life.

This will lead no where.

Or am I missing something?

Yes, the reasoning MIND cannot GET IT. You as the Energy field , the subtle Life Force which precedes the limited 5 senses .......... is what your Awareness needs to MOVE into. Thus the term "Centered" ~

Could there be such a thing as a "realization" so profound that one can be thrust into a permanent "enlightenment" that doesn't require any maintanence?

Yes.... but for most it will come in waves and will require greater efforts and a certain growing until all which stands in the way dissolves. The "profound" Realizations will come as one is sincere and pure enough in heart to receive them~ Not perfect but in the process of reaching its prior state of perfection , yet now with an added dimension of experience.



Lol... I even recall one guru claiming that he operated in "samadhi" 24/7, 365 days a year.

Yes.... that is the permanent state. I had no idea what any of this meant until after.......after what? ...... just after. IT washes over you when the old conceptual self begins to dissolve. In my case ..... just after losing most of my blood and closing in on bodily death. I called the state "Grace" and operated in it for the next 30 days. It left as those around were unable to handle it , and I was not yet ready to leave. It returned and stayed for a year after much effort........ and then departed again. Yet it did not depart! The final stages of the old conditioned self is simply dissolving and thus a certain type of growing understanding comes along with this which feels somewhat discomforting at times..... but that is why the Holy Spirit is called "The Comforter" !


Ha ha ha yeah right.


Your EGO laughs because it has control of you and believes it can keep you from success.

Yet, you show a certain amount of "presence"//.... Pre-sense ...... and that is the beginning stage of EGOS dissolution. What remains to be seen is whether you will gather enough inner courage to overcome the weakness of EGO which wheres a Mask of strength. Will You?
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  #15  
Old 16-06-2012, 05:27 PM
Xan Xan is offline
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1. No "me". Apparently the feeling of a separate "me" is dissolved and is replaced by a feeling of wholeness/unity/emptiness.

2. A non-identification with mind. So one identifies themselves only as "consciousness" or "being" and thoughts are not enough to distract them from that peace of beingness. And some even take it a step further and claim that after a while thoughts and thinking STOP ALLTOGETHER!!!


3. The end of "seeking".


But I don't think enlightenment has anything to do with the above. In fact I don't think there is even such a thing as enlightenment or the end of suffering.



Dr. Truth, you have listed some side effects of enlightenment, which is simply becoming aware in your true nature... whole awareness, empty of thought yet full of silent presence and love itself.

Yes this inner discovery, and the gradual dissolving of the mind that suffers, is Real... speaking from my own experience.


Xan
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Go within, beloveds. Go deep within to the Heart of your Being.
The Truth is found there and nowhere else.-Sananda


Last edited by Xan : 16-06-2012 at 08:23 PM.
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  #16  
Old 16-06-2012, 05:40 PM
shadedragon shadedragon is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: New Jersey, USA
Posts: 1,604
 
I'd consider sitting down with your ego for a little chat :) either that or talk to your mind (not your brain) and it will tell you how it is. Or you can channel one of the many plants, spirits, creatures, or animals around you. They know it too.
__________________
all things in our reality are there because they are a reflection of us, as for the time in thiers, we are a reflection of them.
the moment you try to find self is the begning of a journey to discover it doesn't exist


Project Spirit has set up a energy channel for anyone who needs it. We have it touch down in each country, and net outwards in them. You can access energy from this channel simply by intending to tap into it. Pm me if you'd like more info.

http://www.kindspring.org/
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 16-06-2012, 06:37 PM
SerpentQueen
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.Truth
In fact I don't think there is even such a thing as enlightenment or the end of suffering.

It may be more efficient to take an attitude of "I don't know."

Quote:
Its just that after deep meditation one can feel certain things like "silence" or "peace" but the mind always creeps back in. It has to in order for one to live their life. And so what I'm proposing is that the most we can hope for is just the ability to meditate really deeply and be able to do it often so we can feel that nice feeling of bliss/oneness in everyday life.

Maybe it's not a permanent state of "nice feeling" or "bliss." Personally, I think it's a disservice to promote it that way-- it only encourages forever seeking. Maybe you've touched it already, but you didn't recognize it because you thought and assumed it would feel a certain way?

Quote:
Or am I missing something? Could there be such a thing as a "realization" so profound that one can be thrust into a permanent "enlightenment" that doesn't require any maintanence?

The joke is we're all enlightened. That's why there's never been anything to seek or to find. You have already achieved permanent enlightenment. We all have.
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  #18  
Old 16-06-2012, 07:35 PM
Xan Xan is offline
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It may be more efficient to take an attitude of "I don't know."

Good idea. In fact, developing the open mind of not knowing is a challenge in itself, but with great benefits.


Xan
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Go within, beloveds. Go deep within to the Heart of your Being.
The Truth is found there and nowhere else.-Sananda

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  #19  
Old 16-06-2012, 08:15 PM
Henri77
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I'll know when I arrive there..... how it truly feels.
Except I won't be there!

Than again maybe I've experienced it somewhat...
and it just remains truly ineffable.

cool discussion
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  #20  
Old 17-06-2012, 07:21 AM
Dr.Truth
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xan
1. No "me". Apparently the feeling of a separate "me" is dissolved and is replaced by a feeling of wholeness/unity/emptiness.

2. A non-identification with mind. So one identifies themselves only as "consciousness" or "being" and thoughts are not enough to distract them from that peace of beingness. And some even take it a step further and claim that after a while thoughts and thinking STOP ALLTOGETHER!!!


3. The end of "seeking".


But I don't think enlightenment has anything to do with the above. In fact I don't think there is even such a thing as enlightenment or the end of suffering.



Dr. Truth, you have listed some side effects of enlightenment, which is simply becoming aware in your true nature... whole awareness, empty of thought yet full of silent presence and love itself.

Yes this inner discovery, and the gradual dissolving of the mind that suffers, is Real... speaking from my own experience.


Xan

Hi Xan,

Okay, it seems to me that your making some assumptions about how enlightenment is...

Don't get me wrong, I believe in personal/spiritual developement and I certainly believe there are things we can do to feel better or improve our karmic condition/circumstance but the idea of going around carrying out everyday tasks - whether it be work or travel or shopping or interaction with other people in a no-mind state...

c'mon lets be serious here.

Also some are trying to avoid any thought or "yesterday" or "tomorrow" because they have been told that "enlightenment" is all about present moment awareness. But again, that is not helpful in my opinion...

Oh! but they are more that welcome to try!!! Yes, by all means... nobody has to take my word for anything if they don't want to. heheheh
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