speaking of religion.

[Baile]

Originally Posted by AlwaysDayAfterYesterday

If you are ever curious how this applies to the Bible, Buddha or even Muhammad, let me know. It's my passion in life to tell this story. I can show you how to find my articles if you are curious.

Why not start a thread and conversation in this forum (General Religion) and post some links?

Religion is avoidable (falls away completely) when one comes to understand that knowledge isn't about belief. Knowing has to do with inner wisdom; the process of self-realization (the 'Jesus and Buddha process' one could say). Much like the 'verb' comment, self-realization wisdom is an activity.

[AlwaysDayAfterYesterday]

Originally Posted by Baile

Why not start a thread and conversation in this forum (General Religion) and post some links?

Religion is avoidable (falls away completely) when one comes to understand that knowledge isn't about belief. Knowing has to do with inner wisdom; the process of self-realization (the 'Jesus and Buddha process' one could say). Much like the 'verb' comment, self-realization wisdom is an activity.

Great advise, but I posted it last night as my first welcome message, making it infinitely easier in the future to the point to that link when someone needs to ask my view. You can also google my username in quotes and find me by my larger body of articles. I'm already finding this forum to be a great place to stretch the mind in Yoga. Thank you for the comments.

[Baile]

Originally Posted by AlwaysDayAfterYesterday

You can also google my username in quotes and find me by my larger body of articles.

Nice, I just did that. The very first post of yours I came across offers a fab example (mind-blowing insight) of the difference between religion (exoteric belief) and wisdom (esoteric understanding):

Religious take: Adam and Eve were forbidden to eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

Wisdom (your comment): A tree grows in a specific way, ever mirroring the growth of all reality as a template. Information is enfolded inside; insight is sight within. Notice how a tree grows by Line, Branch and Fold, just as dimensions do the same. From the tree, fruit and a forest. All of us express from root to fruit in the same manner.

[Honza]

The problem that I have with the direct experience of God or with spiritual experiences is that they can be so powerful that they overwhelm the person. People here at this forum all have experiences of one sort or another and they often become sure they have found the truth.

The mind can detach itself from experience and can remain objective. The mind has beliefs which are formulated over time. Whereas one or two strong experiences can totally overwhelm the subject and douse them with nonsensical proof.

A clear mind is not to be sniffed at. I'd rather hang on to mine rather then let it go.

[AlwaysDayAfterYesterday]

Originally Posted by Baile

Nice, I just did that. The very first post of yours I came across offers a fab example (mind-blowing insight) of the difference between religion (exoteric belief) and wisdom (esoteric understanding):

Religious take: Adam and Eve were forbidden to eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

Wisdom (your comment): A tree grows in a specific way, ever mirroring the growth of all reality as a template. Information is enfolded inside; insight is sight within. Notice how a tree grows by Line, Branch and Fold, just as dimensions do the same. From the tree, fruit and a forest. All of us express from root to fruit in the same manner.

Thank you for that. I have a larger outline of the dimensions in a PDF. You can google my username in quotes with no spaces and find a docs page.

[AlwaysDayAfterYesterday]

Originally Posted by Honza

The problem that I have with the direct experience of God or with spiritual experiences is that they can be so powerful that they overwhelm the person. People here at this forum all have experiences of one sort or another and they often become sure they have found the truth.

The mind can detach itself from experience and can remain objective. The mind has beliefs which are formulated over time. Whereas one or two strong experiences can totally overwhelm the subject and douse them with nonsensical proof.

A clear mind is not to be sniffed at. I'd rather hang on to mine rather then let it go.

There are two paths that are generally outlined by most Eastern literature--direct experience and contemplation. Meditation is not simply the Lotus variety of sitting. There are many other flowers in the field. For me, contemplation and one-pointed focus gradually brought about the experience of realization to me from a different form of meditation, which is what we are doing right now. With all realization, there must be accompanying Great Doubt and suffering in some form. Sitting is a form of suffering. So is suffering the verbal abuse of others in these forums. This type of discourse and meditation on topics of Mystic importance trained me to fight for the goal. Seeking always opens doors. Knocking is one thing, but I have pounded the door off its hinges, which eventually brings the same enlightenment.

Enlightenment is not a point of arrival, but a gradual and incremental movement forward toward higher states of awareness. Even for a person who simply meditates in no thought, the experience of this expanded awareness is the mirror of the upper and lower Triloka. Each side is at rest. Between, there is Nirvana, or existence and mind in action. There is no difference other than what is missed by either side of the equation. Empty is not the end, it's the basis of the usefulness of the manifest.

A person who is ignorant of the empty field of potentiality may also be ignorant of the fact that Maya is also Nirvana. A person who mistakes the emptiness for Nirvana fails to regard Maya as part of this absolute. Both are enlightenment. Reaching a state of non-duality is only half. You are doing the the other half now in life, which is the real practice; real meditation; real yoga.

Find my docs page, then check out the one on the 10 dimensions of the Triloka, especially given that you recognize the Tree you are sitting under. Too many are sitting as fruit on the tree, but you have dropped to new ground. Have you ever read the Koan of the man hanging from a tree by his two front teeth? I'll explain it to you if you are ever interested.

[Yessy]

Originally Posted by Honza

Is religion avoidable? I'm not so sure it is. Loosely speaking all manner of practices and understanding can be called religion.

There is a definite trend here at these forums for people to state that they are not religious. So what manner of spirituality are they practicing? Is it not realistic to call any spiritual endeavor religion?

Religion is generally regarded as being the 'belief in God'. So what people are doing now is replace 'belief' and 'God' with two other states. 'Belief in God' turns into the 'practice of I'.

My contention is that the 'practice of I' is just as religious as the 'belief in God'. It is not the same. But it could be called a religion just as well.

People say 'I have no beliefs'....but they do. They believe in I. Every Eastern and New Age practice depends upon the belief in I. If people did not believe in I then they would not practice I. I is a belief just as much as God is.

Wow! You got it right.

THAT is the fundanental difference between True Christianity and every other religion.

In True Christianity it is all about what Jesus did and what He is doing now.
In True Christianity it is all about gazing at His glory and then being changed from one degree of glory to another as we become what we behold.
In True Christianity it is all about His righteousness, His atonement and His finished work.
And I am merely like a planet rotating around the sun, spinning my life around Him, because He is so worthy and it is all about Him.

In every other religion it is all about ME. My spirituality, my encounters, my enlightenmens, my evolvement, my good works or lack thereof, my righteousness. All these things are meaningless to the Father. There are only One that pleases the Father and that is Jeus, and if our righteousness does not come from atonement by His finished work, then it is as filthy rags to God. Not our sin, our GOOD WORKS apart from Jesus, that aims to just bring glory to us, that is as disgusting menstrual cloths, stained with our own blood, it stinks.

Only in Jesus can we have life, true LIFE, because then His very life becomes ours.

John 8:24-27Living Bible (TLB)
24 That is why I said that you will die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am the Messiah, the Son of God, you will die in your sins.”
25 “Tell us who you are,” they demanded.
He replied, “I am the one I have always claimed to be".

[sky]

Religion is a man made institution.
Spirituality comes from inside, deep within oneself.

Jesus said..... ' The kingdom of heaven is within you '
He knew

[Baile]

Originally Posted by Yessy

THAT is the fundanental difference between True Christianity and every other religion.

In every other religion it is all about ME.

Right idea, wrong conclusion. Christianity is the same as any other religion. "Being true" to the religion has nothing whatsoever to do with the particular tenets of the religion. It depends entirely on the focus and mindset of the follower of that religion, period.

[Honza]

Originally Posted by Baile

Right idea, wrong conclusion. Christianity is the same as any other religion. "Being true" to the religion has nothing whatsoever to do with the particular tenets of the religion. It depends entirely on the focus and mindset of the follower of that religion, period.

Except that the focus of Christianity is not the SELF; it is God/Heaven/Christ/People etc.