Thoughts on Ego

[youngnostic]

I believe any sense of self that we have; any time we use the word I it's a form of ego.
Now, the thing I'm starting to realize is not to compartmentalize that state of being or place a value-judgement on it, but rather realize that 'Ego' is essential to our survival and, dare I say it, thriving, in the Matrix which is an illusion but a practical one that requires us to Master the Art of Living and accept the ego as a self; as our only self or selves, for that matter, and empower ourselves (our egos) in living life to the fullest potential.
My understanding leads me to deduce that even G-d has an ego; and since I've never met an egoless person; only heard rumours and myths about one, I'm led to believe by the fact that the most spiritual and for that matter, balanced, person I've ever met of whom I was still able to detect an ego; and while he maintained an active Buddhic state of compassion and respect for the freewill of other sentient beings I still couldn't manage to discern an egolessness about him. Therefore I now hold to the idea that the Ego is neccessary and even good and maintain that to enrich our spiritual journey and master the Art of Living we are to embrace our egos and channel them towards fulfilling our lives.
Until someone proves me by showing me a completely egoless person; in which case they would have to be a Buddha or a non-returner; someone who completely annihilated their desires; I won't conceive of the notion that we are to become egoless and work towards annihilating our ego, rather it is by recognizing that the "I" is the ego and using that to our advantage that we go about moving forward on the spiritual path.

Also, just some thoughts: Even a Mother Teressa-like Saintly person who constantly gives of themselves to feed the hungry and heal the sick would be operating in ego... the important part however, I find, is distinguishing between selfishness and what I term "enlightened self-interest".

Feel free to comment and share your thoughts on the ego and how you can go about into turning it into a friend and power-tool on your journey.

[Baile]

Originally Posted by youngnostic

in the Matrix which is an illusion

That's an ego statement. Why? Because you need to believe that, in order to make some kind of sense of life, right?

Releasing ego is releasing the need to believe; relinquishing the need to hang onto one's personal belief-choices. And when the ego (lower self thinking) is relinquished, higher self wisdom takes hold. And one of the first things one comes to see, is that nothing we experience is an illusion. Everything we experience is quite real, and quite valid, and very important to our soul-spirit development.

You are correct in that we couldn't function without an ego. So it's really about learning to control one's ego, and has nothing to do with eliminating it... which isn't possible anyway, not while one is in a physical-material body.

Originally Posted by youngnostic

distinguishing between selfishness and what I term "enlightened self-interest"

That's good! Very nice description. I put it this way: The lower self (ego) knows what it wants; the higher self knows what it needs.

[youngnostic]

Originally Posted by Baile

That's an ego statement. Why? Because you need to believe that, in order to make some kind of sense of life, right?

Releasing ego is releasing the need to believe; relinquishing the need to hang onto one's personal belief-choices. And when the ego (lower self thinking) is relinquished, higher self wisdom takes hold. And one of the first things one comes to see, is that nothing we experience is an illusion. Everything we experience is quite real, and quite valid, and very important to our soul-spirit development.

You are correct in that we couldn't function without an ego. So it's really about learning to control one's ego, and has nothing to do with eliminating it... which isn't possible anyway, not while one is in a physical-material body.That's good! Very nice description. I put it this way: The lower self (ego) knows what it wants; the higher self knows what it needs.

Sure, I agree somewhat with what you're saying: but do you believe the moon is real? There are scientists out there at the moment who believe if no one is looking there is no moon.
Also, I don't mean to come off as argumentative, just sharing some points to generate conversation.

[youngnostic]

Also, the reason I posted this in the first place, is because I came to realize that the ego is the actualizer of our success within the Matrix.
The ego is a false self... but it coincides with the falseness of the matrix.
I'm not saying it's false because humans give it a subjective existence, but rather any sentient being within the Universe gives birth to it. If all of a sudden we were left with no sentient beings to inhabit the Universe, or observers, I argue that the Universe would cease to exist.
Hence my original statement that it's an illusion.
Which is why I like to say "Know the Truth; but respect the illusion."

[youngnostic]

Also, another thought is: just because something is false doesn't mean it doesn't have a right to exist because there could be a practical purpose for it.
For instance, if the ego is false, then to go about undoing it would be validating it as, in fact, real... for if it in fact were false it would not require any effort to be disproven.
On the contrary we have no selves apart from our ego and as long as we are a conscious "I" we are egoic at our core of being and thus have to rely on this helmsman and guide within the world of form to actualize our purpose and will our desire(s) into fulfillment, which are part and parcel based on our ego which came here to experience and experiment and exhaust itself in living out its own experiences until these desires of themselves are no longer clung to.

[youngnostic]

Originally Posted by Baile

You are correct in that we couldn't function without an ego. So it's really about learning to control one's ego, and has nothing to do with eliminating it... which isn't possible anyway, .

Also I'm glad you mentioned that, because as I also see it, it's impossible to annihilate the ego. So again, unless someone could even perhaps provide an anecdote of an 'egoless' person I'd have my doubts and cling to the belief that the Ego is necessary for our progress on Earth. In fact it is the source and center of our entire experience/existence.

[Baile]

Originally Posted by youngnostic

do you believe the moon is real? There are scientists out there at the moment who believe if no one is looking there is no moon.

There is one answer only to your question: Of course the moon is real. To argue otherwise, against this or any other obvious and commonsense observation, is what the ego does. The ego needs to think it is smarter than the reality it exists in.

I guess I was picking up on this very thing in your first post, which is why I said what I did, even though I wasn't quite sure why I was pointing it out. Some part of you desperately wants to believe something "way out there" regarding life (and spirit I imagine). And it doesn't get more way out there than stating that the moon doesn't exist. That's your ego that wants that. It's your ego that wants to believe it is a clever little fellow, a clever fellow who knows reality, better than reality knows itself.

Releasing ego has much to do with releasing the need to be more (intellectually) clever than, among other things, the very real world one lives in. It has to do with the reverse of that in fact: it is about attuning one's self to and with this very real world we live in, in order to understand the source of authentic (experiential) wisdom. Yes the moon is real. Observe it, study it and contemplate upon it, if you wish to know the wisdom the moon has to share. That is why it is there, in the sky. It has very real wisdom to share with us.

[Baile]

Originally Posted by youngnostic

On the contrary we have no selves apart from our ego and as long as we are a conscious "I" we are egoic at our core

Life is a matrix illusion. The moon isn't real. We have no self and no I; both are an egoic illusion.

I can see what you're here to explore this lifetime: beliefs that "nothing is real." That sort of nihilism can take you to some pretty hopeless belief-places. I really have nothing to add other than be careful what you manifest via your life outlook and belief choices, and all the best.

[Baile]

I just read your first post in your "Merging" thread. Now I understand a bit more. I would suggest smoking seriously inhibits the ability to see life and reality as the means whereby we can come to experiential wisdom. Altering one's consciousness like that, is altering one's essential (human) relationship to reality. Altering essential reality in that way, makes reality "not real." That's the reason most people smoke and drink in fact, to avoid the reality of the world.

I don't smoke, I'm anti-mind-altering of any kind actually. But I'm not bringing this up for that reason. I'm pointing this out to explain why it is impossible to have an authentic dialogue with you on this topic. I'm standing on the beach talking to you, and you're out in the water beneath the waves, trying to communicate with me. Under these circumstances -- these two entirely different consciousness-perspectives we're each coming from -- I can't hear you, you can't hear me, and everything we say to each other is garbled.

[Rayden_Greywolf]

Are we meant to view individuation as a bad thing to be avoided or destroyed at all cost?