what is bliss?

[running]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

Yeah, I'm having a break from these forums for a while (for a month or so) and all of this 'spiritual/philosophical' discussion and going to meditate, worship God and learn the rest of the Shiva Stuthis and Ashtakams by heart, that I only ever got half-way through in my youth (and still recall what I learned, but get frustrated that I need to stop half-way because that's as far as I got).

Just reading all of this thread...other threads...it's all a game of 'one-upmanship' that I cannot be bothered playing anymore because I honestly 'know better than that'.

Speaking with others about spiritual issues...trying to communicate in any way whatsoever, is like bashing my head against a brick wall, when I am forever faced with "you are wrong and I am right" and as soon as I ask "what makes me wrong and you right then?" I get "I don't have to explain why or justify my position to you" and I'm like "yeah...you kinda do, if you're going to make baseless assertions like that"....and then, the whole conversation stalls and I get placed on yet another ignore list.

These are the 'conversation killers' and I see them on here...people trying to talk with others, only to have the other say "and what would you know about it?" when they have already said what they know about it...

I need a break from all this nonsense, because I know that I deserve more than what I get from here a lot of the time...I won't say all the time, because occasionally I will get a nice 'gem of wisdom' or helped by another who doesn't have their own personal agenda behind it...but it gets frustrating to have to sit and sift through all the rubbish to find it...and it's getting much worse.

finding what works for you is what matters imo. i know for me i spent a lot of time by myself meditating and contemplating. for me that worked. perhaps different from person to person. but in any case its about the product imo. not the practice. so if your getting the product you want with the practice that works for you. then who cares what somebody thinks the practice should be like. unless of course the worship was of the practice over the product.

[running]

Originally Posted by davidsun

No. I think meditation adventures and and energy practices are great for de-conditioning one's 'self' from and gong past prior habits, limitations, etc. But I think people (you in this case) are susceptible to then just get into repeat the same old routines in this regard without realizing that they are thereby just imprisoning their 'selves' in another, albeit often bigger and more health conducive 'box' - they often become 'smugly' self-satisfied instead of continuing to be adventurously explore additional possibilities, creatively (re)solve 'greater' problems, and become more and more attnued and engaged with what Life is all (not just the Life in their 'new' 'corner') about.

My sense is that there a bunch of "blissed out because the believe that's their 'real' nature" ' junkies here, just as there are a bunch of "ecstatic because Jesus saved me" junkies and "Hot to become a martyr because that will get them ibnto 'paradise' where they'll have sex with 70 virgins" junkies elsewhere. My question/challenge to all such would be Can you really 'groove' with, enjoy and practically serve and enjoy serving the practical needs of animals and people around you who alive but different from you (instead of just wanting and inviting them to 'join' and walk with you in your way Life? Do you both curiously and humorously (unpompously) enjoy having meaningful conversations with different others, from the 'least' to the 'greatest', who you cross paths with you, or are you into a mono-cultural socialization, getting people into your 'trip'? Etc., etc. etc.


I would expect nothing less from a person who 'came on' in the way you did in the first post of yours that I responded to.


So have I, and though I have gratefully taken whatever I thought and felt was the best in them, I have gone past every one of them and keep on going, past even whatever may have been 'traditional' for me as of a months or even weeks ago. The journey never ends, Bro. Another example of what I am talking about: the one who posts under the screen name 'naturesflow'. I am ever on-flowing - which is what I think eternal Life really means, not eternally sitting around in 'bliss' or any other 'state' of mind and spirit which would be 'the death' of my ever adventurousness, I think.

Though they may indeed have been 'advances' when they were first started, 'traditions' (of the 'formal' kind) are for those who enjoy zombying (not really seeing with 'fresh' eyes all the time - as WabiSabi bell-rang above) as a relief from the uncertainties and changes in flow which are experiences as stressful - IMO, that is.

your ideas of what bliss is like in life is not in reality. at least not based on what i have seen and experienced.

i dont know why all the anger and hostility. and accusations about people you dont even know?

[naturesflow]

Seeing the Preciousness of True Nature
However, the moment you recognize that true nature is such a beauty, such a preciousness, you will do anything for it. No sacrifice is too great to realize that beauty, that radiant, lustrous preciousness. It is difficult to convey verbally the sense of this preciousness, this beauty, and the wonder and magic of it. Physical beauty is a very pale reflection of the beauty of Being, which is the nature of your soul. If you really recognize that the truth of who you are is so beautiful, so precious, so full of value, and so magnificent, you would devote the totality of your life to it. Everything in the universe, from beginning to end, is like dust compared to this magnificence, and every action and situation is expendable for this preciousness.
Facets of Unity, p. 225 http://www.ahalmaas.com/glossary/true-nature

[naturesflow]

Originally Posted by running

your ideas of what bliss is like in life is not in reality. at least not based on what i have seen and experienced.

i dont know why all the anger and hostility. and accusations about people you dont even know?

True Nature Illuminates Itself and Liberates Itself by Revealing Itself

When we understand the discerning capacity of true nature, we come to see that it teaches not only as revelation but as self-revelation. It illuminates itself and liberates itself by revealing itself. In its operation, this penetrating intelligence teaches us the capacity to learn. But as it teaches, it learns. As it reveals, it realizes. As it illuminates, it is enlightened. As it transforms, it evolves. We see that true nature is behind the whole process of learning, unveiling, and transformation. True nature awakens itself by guiding itself as the individual consciousness that appears to be inquiring. In reality, the inquiry of the individual is nothing but the way that true nature is revealing itself. It is Total Being functioning as the student eager to learn and as the teacher, outer or inner, skillfully guiding the student. This is the picture that we see when the discriminating intelligence synthesizes the role of the individual practicing and the action of true nature. It is a picture that emerges when this intelligence utilizes both dual and nondual perceptions in the same insight. This understanding is one of its awakenings: The inner teacher learns in the form of teaching an other which is a form of itself.


The Alchemy of Freedom, p. 126

[running]

Originally Posted by naturesflow

Seeing the Preciousness of True Nature
However, the moment you recognize that true nature is such a beauty, such a preciousness, you will do anything for it. No sacrifice is too great to realize that beauty, that radiant, lustrous preciousness. It is difficult to convey verbally the sense of this preciousness, this beauty, and the wonder and magic of it. Physical beauty is a very pale reflection of the beauty of Being, which is the nature of your soul. If you really recognize that the truth of who you are is so beautiful, so precious, so full of value, and so magnificent, you would devote the totality of your life to it. Everything in the universe, from beginning to end, is like dust compared to this magnificence, and every action and situation is expendable for this preciousness.
Facets of Unity, p. 225 http://www.ahalmaas.com/glossary/true-nature

wow, that is really well said. thabks for sharing!

[naturesflow]

Originally Posted by running

wow, that is really well said. thabks for sharing!

Thought you might like it.

In reflection how do you see yourself in all this?

[running]

Originally Posted by naturesflow

Thought you might like it.

In reflection how do you see yourself in all this?

ordinary. except there is bliss with everything.

its really at least for me stages. that lead back to the beginning. but with bliss. i have heard similiar from some others.

[jonesboy]

Nature,

Your email is full.

[naturesflow]

Originally Posted by running

ordinary. except there is bliss with everything.

its really at least for me stages. that lead back to the beginning. but with bliss. i have heard similiar from some others.

When you say ordinary, what do you mean?

I think I understand your bliss by now..lol. Its like been playing out here for how many years..

[naturesflow]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

Nature,

Your email is full.

Hey I cleared it of some, the other day, so should be room by now.