What is consciousness and in which forms can it appear?

[Emm]

Originally Posted by Greenslade

I guess you don't know much about the Soul because it doesn't need to think, it just knows.

I've been thinking about this, comparing it with an experience I had back in 2012. I had what I now call an out of body experience (previously was calling it a shift in consciousness) simply because I was viewing a situation I was in from a different vantage point with a sense of being out of the realms of time and space.

While in that state there was no thought, no opinion, total neutrality...there was a sense of self but was entirely focused on what was happening below. However, despite the lack of thought there was a sense of communication going on between that awareness and the me that is here...the communication was one of sensing rather than thought itself. I can't quite grab hold of what was being communicated even now...its like trying to remember a name, with it being on the tip of your tongue but can't quite get it... but I know I will remember when the time is right.

As this thread is about consciousness I might as well also mention that ever since that experience I do have moments where my consciousness shifts momentarily...its like remembering a dream where I'm somewhere else entirely but can't grab the whole dream but recognise it and know its not in this reality. Its an odd experience, I'm fully aware of where I am this time but its like a visual thought input...I see it in my minds eye and then its gone again...like being in two places at one time. Even in my dreams I can return to the same place over and over and recognise it as if I'm living in some other parallel reality. Whatever consciousness is, its certainly nothing to do with the physical brain.

Going back to thought...I do believe when in the non physical we quickly learn to harness our thoughts as the environment we find ourselves in reacts instantly to it...thought is vibrational, it alters how we feel, its energy, so not sure the soul doesn't think, but possibly knows how to use thought if you know what I mean.

[Siemens]

Originally Posted by God-Like

If Consciousness 'IS' matter and matter 'IS' consciousness then bobs your uncle, it isn't a matter (excuse the pun) of whether consciousness creates matter for they are one and the same .
Do you follow me?

Yes I do. Thanks for the tipp! I just had similar thoughts.

[Siemens]

Originally Posted by Greenslade

[consciousness] epiphenomenal so it doesn't come from anywhere.

An epiphenomenon is defined as a secondary phenomenon that occurs alongside or in parallel to a primary phenomenon. If consciousness is an epiphenomenon, what is the primary phenomenon?

Originally Posted by Greenslade

All matter is of consciousness

Okay, there are more ways this could be interpreted. Do you mean consciousness is a sort of substance which can solidify to form matter – or in which way “is matter of consciousness”? I don’t know if you already answered this but how do you define consciousness in general?

And do you even believe in reincarnation?

[BigJohn]

Originally Posted by Greenslade

The Soul is the Spiritual or immaterial aspect of ourselves, the divine spark if you like. Being immaterial it's outside of the thinking which is electrical signals whizzing around in the brain.

If a person is unconscious, does it mean the soul has left?

[BigJohn]

Originally Posted by Greenslade

When I was going through trauma as a child my consciousness was literally beside my body as though I was having an out-of-body experience.

your experience sounds like you created an Elemental and called it Consciousness.

Have you had experiences with Elementals?

Ever created one?

Originally Posted by Emm

I've been thinking about this, comparing it with an experience I had back in 2012. I had what I now call an out of body experience (previously was calling it a shift in consciousness) simply because I was viewing a situation I was in from a different vantage point with a sense of being out of the realms of time and space.

While in that state there was no thought, no opinion, total neutrality...there was a sense of self but was entirely focused on what was happening below. However, despite the lack of thought there was a sense of communication going on between that awareness and the me that is here...the communication was one of sensing rather than thought itself. I can't quite grab hold of what was being communicated even now...its like trying to remember a name, with it being on the tip of your tongue but can't quite get it... but I know I will remember when the time is right.

As this thread is about consciousness I might as well also mention that ever since that experience I do have moments where my consciousness shifts mnmentarily...its like remembering a dream where I'm somewhere else entirely but can't grab the whole dream but recognise it and know its not in this reality. Its an odd experience, I'm fully aware of where I am this time but its like a visual thought input...I see it in my minds eye and then its gone again...like being in two places at one time. Even in my dreams I can return to the same place over and over and recognise it as if I'm living in some other parallel reality. Whatever consciousness is, its certainly nothing to do with the physical brain.

Going back to thought...I do believe when in the non physical we quickly learn to harness our thoughts as the environment we find ourselves in reacts instantly to it...thought is vibrational, it alters how we feel, its energy, so not sure the soul doesn't think, but possibly knows how to use thought if you know what I mean.

What I was thinking about but not mentioning there was Gnosis. which you more than likely know about. It seems to happen (for me anyway) outside of the brain/mind process. With information there's a definite process of it coming from an external source, the brain/mind thinking about it then reacting to the information from there. With Gnosis it's as though it's always been there, and the awareness is that it's more on the same wavelength as intuition. If that makes sense.

A couple of years back I went through what was commonly termed as 'Ascension symptoms'. where I was going through all kinds of bonkers experiences. One of those was consciousness from the perspective of one of those third-person games rather than a first-person as we usually perceive it. I was also experiencing time dilations and periods when my consciousness paused as my brain.mind carried on. Sometimes it was interesting, other times it was damned scary.

When I was a child I went through abuse, and on one particular occasion my consciousness detached itself from my body, it was as though I was having a pre-death out-of-body experience. My consciousness was standing beside my physical body and I sensed my Higher Self standing by my shoulder. In January I was involved in a car smash and in a dream-like state, my consciousness was shown into a dark room and told to sit on a chair. I sat there while almost totally unaware of what was happening around me. I had to go see a shrink a few weeks back and apparently this is a normal reaction to trauma, in some ways I wasn't sure how I felt about that because it takes the fun out of the profound Spiritual experiences.

I have a metal health issue and I used to work in mental health, so I am probably more aware than most of how the mind can play tricks that can alter what input we have to create our reality upon. And yes, being aware of what seems to be alternate/parallel realities too. It would be all to easy to slip off to some other dimension and never come back, but I know too well what the consequences of that would be.

I'm going to be cantankerous and make the distinction between thinking and Gnosis, because perceptually they are very different. Tolle said that object consciousness is the consciousness of the brain/mind, so information, knowledge, the brain's chemical and electrical processes, memory...... The Soul doesn't have a brain. Gnosis is above that, it's more on a par with intuition and 'sixth sense' and seems to sit 'above the brain/mind. It's also on the same wavelength as mediumship, where a direct Spirit link is created. Although that doesn't use the brain/mind it's still filtered into the mechanism because the mind has to be able to understand it. I think we all have the potential to access higher aspects of consciousness through Gnosis and the like, but often too much store is placed on the mind.

I rather think we're along, long way off from having a forum-wide discussion on your last paragraph because you're going into territory where angels fear to tread. Even an understanding of vibrations is a long way off, never mind how vibrations, the Soul and energy all interact. The other issue I believe is that people tend to nobbler their own consciousness by ignoring things like science, which is a shame because in many ways it makes sense of what you're saying here.

Matsuru Emoto conducted some experiments that have been replicated over again. He took some jars, filled them with water and imprinted his consciousness onto them. On one jar he placed a sticky note that says "I Love you" and towards that jar he directed loving thoughts. Similarly with a jar with "I hate you" written on the note. The crystalline structures of the "I Love you" jar were very complex and intricate while the "I hate you" structure was more like a pool of melted plastic. When the Spiritual implications of that are better understood - and the reasons we don't want to embrace that consciousness - then we might make some progress in the Soul/energy/vibration discussion. I think a better discussion for the time being is being conscious of what we are conscious of, and our agenda as to the reasons consciousness is deliberately crippled.

There is a direct inter-relationship between the brain/mind mechanism and consciousness, my own experiences have shown me that. We also have access to 'input' beyond the five senses and what can be termed by the shrink as a mental health issue can mean that the brain's wiring has been altered and can access/create other levels of consciousness. We can become conscious then become conscious that we have consciousness, and when those two become distinct yet inter-related the fun really begins. What we are conscious of is not consciousness itself, and while we can progress through layer upon layer of consciousness consciousness itself 'sits atop' all of that.

Originally Posted by Siemens

An epiphenomenon is defined as a secondary phenomenon that occurs alongside or in parallel to a primary phenomenon. If consciousness is an epiphenomenon, what is the primary phenomenon?

The primary phenomenon is the creation of the reality in which God/Universe/Source can experience itself. If the Big Bang hadn't gone bang, where would consciousness be today? What would it have to be conscious of?

Originally Posted by Siemens

Okay, there are more ways this could be interpreted. Do you mean consciousness is a sort of substance which can solidify to form matter – or in which way “is matter of consciousness”? I don’t know if you already answered this but how do you define consciousness in general?

And do you even believe in reincarnation?

To understand this you need a little understanding of quantum mechanics and the double-slit experiment. What the double-slit experiment shows is that the consciousness of the observer changes the energy, the energy is neither particle nor wave until someone is conscious of its state. Once you understand this you understand so many things in Spirituality so differently. It's been shown time and again in many ways that consciousness affects matter - and a few other things too.

So how would any of this preclude me from believing in reincarnation?

By the way, the 'standard model' of incarnation is based solely on the human mind/brain because it's based on linear time. Time is a human construct, not one of Spirit so much of what we understand of reincarnation is pretty meaningless - including (especially) the bit about karma. All of time affects all of time all of the time. Past Lives aren't because there is no past.

Originally Posted by BigJohn

If a person is unconscious, does it mean the soul has left?

We really don't understand enough about consciousness, unconsciousness and the Soul, to be honest. While I dare say there are so many very informed people who are experts in consciousness posting on this forum, I doubt many of them are consciousness researchers for their day jobs. I'm a trainer/assessor by trade so I'll admit to my own knowledge of consciousness being limited to what I've taken from sources that have done their homework, and my own experiences.


What I can say is that both consciousness and I'd guess the Soul too (considering it's supposed to be outside of the constraints of time) can 'pause' as time as we understand it passes - it both speeded up, slowed down and paused for me. I think we perceive the body, the brain/mind, Soul, Spirit..... all as separate beings but I don't think that's the case at all, in that case the Soul leaving would be more of a tearing of your arm off.

Originally Posted by BigJohn

your experience sounds like you created an Elemental and called it Consciousness.

Have you had experiences with Elementals?

Ever created one?

The thing is, I'm very much aware of how the mind can play tricks and how easy it would be to throw all kinds of Spiritual psycho-babble at this. I saw a shrink recently and she said that my experiences were a normal reaction, while I've also discussed them from a purely Spiritual perspective. I'm not going to say ether is right or wrong but it's interesting to perceive them from the two very different perspectives. The bottom line is that I choose how I label them. I know that consciousness is not bound by the confines of physicality because of my own experiences, and for that matter may well be jumping from one reality to another. I was, literally, not in that body and watching from a third-party perspective. There was also another consciousness standing by mine, whose 'energies' felt very different to my own.

I had some experiences of Elemantals when I was younger but after seeing what I was unleashing..... I was a very angry young man then.

[Siemens]

Originally Posted by Greenslade

So how would any of this preclude me from believing in reincarnation?

How could there be reincarnation if there were no soul, what you consider to be the case?

Originally Posted by Siemens

How could there be reincarnation if there were no soul, what you consider to be the case?

At the moment it's not any kind of clear that we have a Soul, and for some we only have a single incarnation here while some religions say we have have many. Again it's another belief.