What are the flaws in the popular new age version of death?

[AstralJosh]

As I understand it (well in my current version anyway) death is a transmutation of energy to a higher realm, thoughts are the same, behaviours also, wishes, likes, desires, attachments (death is not a liberation)

Thought is the acting force outside of physics and nature, what you think is what is. This allows for a Christian heaven, Hindu etc... Also hell and anything anyone can think of really.

In this all encompassing version of the afterlife it has become my defacto belief of the afterlife. There are many nuances to this but I am sure most are familiar with this popular viewpoint.

Also in this belief set is the idea that taking ones own life leads to the person not knowing they have passed on and remaining in some middle realm indefinitely, unaware of their state in some stupor-like trance.

Either way since this viewpoint is so all encompassing ie after death, thought is everything, you can create everything, I fail to see the logical flaw, can anyone provide more wisdom on this?

As I understand it (well in my current version anyway) death is a transmutation of energy to a higher realm, thoughts are the same, behaviours also, wishes, likes, desires, attachments (death is not a liberation)


-To me thoughts, behaviours, ect do not exist in every realm of death so they only follow you if you have not completed the process to free yourself from those attachments.

Thought is the acting force outside of physics and nature, what you think is what is. This allows for a Christian heaven, Hindu etc... Also hell and anything anyone can think of really.

-This I'm not really sure if you mean what you think, you become or what you believe to be true is because you believe it.

In this all encompassing version of the afterlife it has become my defacto belief of the afterlife. There are many nuances to this but I am sure most are familiar with this popular viewpoint.

-I've not heard of this but then again I made up my own concoction of beliefs to what feels right to me.

Also in this belief set is the idea that taking ones own life leads to the person not knowing they have passed on and remaining in some middle realm indefinitely, unaware of their state in some stupor-like trance.

-I believe if you commit suicide you are continuously reborn with that attachment until you rid yourself of it.

Either way since this viewpoint is so all encompassing ie after death, thought is everything, you can create everything, I fail to see the logical flaw, can anyone provide more wisdom on this?

-I do not think flaw is a factor. I truly believe it's what feels right I also feel everyone should do what feels right to them because we are all so different I do not see it possible for one belief to fit all exists in this realm and everyone should be true to themselves here.

[Fairyana]

I'm not very familiar to the New Age view of afterlife. What makes sense to me is that we are essentially consciousness and our body is a temporary physical "garment" made for us to interact in this reality. So I do think that what we experience after death has to do with our level of consciousness or conscious awareness.

I think that most who die will maintain their pattern of thoughts, their consciousness will be still closed to that mindset they had when living, but there will be in the afterlife ways in which closed consciousness will be able to see the bigger picture, to see themselves for who they truly are, to heal and seek to evolve.

[Tabby94]

Interesting topic to discuss. In what way do you believe Death isn't liberation AstralJosh ? Thanks.

[AstralJosh]

[quote=lilybug]

-To me thoughts, behaviours, ect do not exist in every realm of death so they only follow you if you have not completed the process to free yourself from those attachments.

*I would agree somewhat, but argue that those thoughts and behavoirs were removed pre-death so they wont manifest post-death but still exist in those realms. Once we start talking about higher realms I agree fully though.

Thought is the acting force outside of physics and nature, what you think is what is. This allows for a Christian heaven, Hindu etc... Also hell and anything anyone can think of really.

-This I'm not really sure if you mean what you think, you become or what you believe to be true is because you believe it.

*Both, but more-so truth from belief, churches, mosques, sinagogues all exists, because they are thought to.

-I believe if you commit suicide you are continuously reborn with that attachment until you rid yourself of it.

*I suppose we'd have to discuss the rebirth process, but I would focus on the first stage, which may be some middle realm, impenetrable to outsiders, a hazy dark state come about by breaking natural laws, possibly lasting forever. I am not particularly sure of my conviction.

Either way since this viewpoint is so all encompassing ie after death, thought is everything, you can create everything, I fail to see the logical flaw, can anyone provide more wisdom on this?

-I do not think flaw is a factor. I truly believe it's what feels right I also feel everyone should do what feels right to them because we are all so different I do not see it possible for one belief to fit all exists in this realm and everyone should be true to themselves here.

*I don't understand, what are the flaws you are suggesting? Flaws are always factors, otherwise all things would be universally accepted, replace the word flaw with one more to your liking if you wish

[AstralJosh]

Originally Posted by Fairyana

I'm not very familiar to the New Age view of afterlife.
I think that most who die will maintain their pattern of thoughts, their consciousness will be still closed to that mindset they had when living, but there will be in the afterlife ways in which closed consciousness will be able to see the bigger picture, to see themselves for who they truly are, to heal and seek to evolve.

This fits with the New Age afterlife view. Important point is what happens to close-minded, unaware consciousnesses. Earth-like conditions are created, even down to unpleasant ones such as pollution and arid land. These exists in lower realms. The big difference is negative thought, especially in groups is disasterous, making the environment worse and worse if they can't escape each others influences. Many of them are unreachable, so absorbed in their universe.

[AstralJosh]

Originally Posted by IndianaJohal

Interesting topic to discuss. In what way do you believe Death isn't liberation AstralJosh ? Thanks.

Good question, this is almost a revelation I have had in the last few days and could have warranted a topic all by itself. I tend to base many of my beliefs on what seems logical to me and this fitted quite surprisingly.

I idea is that you carry your thoughts, your prejustices, judgements, all of it comes. Those who end their lives in order to be liberated from dualistic existence will be sorely disappointed. Instead, those wishing liberation create a paradox, an almost breaking of natural law that prevents complete annihilation.

In addition, those poorly prepared for death may find themselves drawn in by unsavoury energies into lower realms due to an incapacity to maintain a positive frame of mind and having an easily bent will, or life force. You could call it mental deterioration, but more dangerous in the thought-world as negativity manifests faster.

In some sense this had made me want to prepare for the afterlife even more, learn how to control my state when around other negative energies, learn not to be caught in negative mind spirals and watch by thought patterns and body language even more carefully. I little sad though, the grandiose lifting of all negative thought cycles through death was something I was quite looking forward to, to no longer be oppressed by neurological dis-eases.

[Miss Hepburn]

Deleted.......

[quote=AstralJosh]

Originally Posted by lilybug

-To me thoughts, behaviours, ect do not exist in every realm of death so they only follow you if you have not completed the process to free yourself from those attachments.

*I would agree somewhat, but argue that those thoughts and behavoirs were removed pre-death so they wont manifest post-death but still exist in those realms. Once we start talking about higher realms I agree fully though.

--So are you saying we don't have these attachments it's the realms that have them?
I believe each realm has different qualities as in I think suicide only exists in the human realm so I would be continuously reborn human until I have been able to successfully overcome and die naturally although I do not have a list together of all the realms I believe exist and their qualities because I haven't really gotten that far. I often wondered where my soul would go if I had my life taken by an accident or murder.

Thought is the acting force outside of physics and nature, what you think is what is. This allows for a Christian heaven, Hindu etc... Also hell and anything anyone can think of really.

-This I'm not really sure if you mean what you think, you become or what you believe to be true is because you believe it.

*Both, but more-so truth from belief, churches, mosques, sinagogues all exists, because they are thought to.

--Yes that resonates with me as well for example I use crystals for healing and such but in my opinion they only work because I believe they do as well as cleansing them the way I made up because again my thinking allows the process although I could say this is a crutch as well because if I lost them all to never have again I should be able to heal myself. Sorry a bit off topic maybe but I'd say my crystals would be like my church I go to them meditate with them ect.

-I believe if you commit suicide you are continuously reborn with that attachment until you rid yourself of it.

*I suppose we'd have to discuss the rebirth process, but I would focus on the first stage, which may be some middle realm, impenetrable to outsiders, a hazy dark state come about by breaking natural laws, possibly lasting forever. I am not particularly sure of my conviction.

--Im not either of my own but I felt I would always be reborn as human if I
committed suicide and this came to me in a tarot reading I did for myself. A past life spread which indicated I had committed suicide numerous times and I keep coming back struggling with that attachment until I die naturally. I feel my rebirth is directed by my life before hand, it dictates what realm I flow to next.

Either way since this viewpoint is so all encompassing ie after death, thought is everything, you can create everything, I fail to see the logical flaw, can anyone provide more wisdom on this?

-I do not think flaw is a factor. I truly believe it's what feels right I also feel everyone should do what feels right to them because we are all so different I do not see it possible for one belief to fit all exists in this realm and everyone should be true to themselves here.

*I don't understand, what are the flaws you are suggesting? Flaws are always factors, otherwise all things would be universally accepted, replace the word flaw with one more to your liking if you wish.

--I was referring to your statement about seeing a logical flaw. I accept your viewpoint and do not see a logical flaw in it because it's yours and it is what feels right to you so only you can see a true imperfection in it not me as it isn't my place to decide that. I hope that makes sense I wasn't sure how else to phrase that at the moment.

[Fairyana]

Originally Posted by AstralJosh

In some sense this had made me want to prepare for the afterlife even more, learn how to control my state when around other negative energies, learn not to be caught in negative mind spirals and watch by thought patterns and body language even more carefully. I little sad though, the grandiose lifting of all negative thought cycles through death was something I was quite looking forward to, to no longer be oppressed by neurological dis-eases.

This is such an important aspect of life and spirituality: the ability to be aware of our own thoughts and control them so as to keep them elevated (on positivity and constructiveness). It's so hard to be able to do this. If it were easy, the world would be such a better place.

However, sometimes there is a problem with the physical brain that stops consciousness from expressing itself in their true form. In which case death could be liberating. Like a TV set that is damaged and therefore the image and sound is coming out bad, but the signal in itself is quite good. It's different from a fully operational TV set, but what's being captured is a signal full of bad programming.

I do believe, however, that consciousness has the ability to not only heal itself but also reprogram how it uses the brain depending on the illness.