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10-07-2012, 02:29 AM
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Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Southwest, USA
Posts: 25,096
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Xan
...but have subtle powers to awaken others through direct transmission.
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You're not a'kiddin'!!!
Powers and grace galore!!! Just for being open and guilless.
I thought LSD was pumped into my veins.
__________________
.*I'll text in Navy Blue when I'm speaking as a Mod. :)
Prepare yourself for the coming astral journey of death by daily riding in the balloon of God-perception.
Through delusion you are perceiving yourself as a bundle of flesh and bones, which at best is a nest of troubles.
Meditate unceasingly, that you may quickly behold yourself as the Infinite Essence, free from every form of misery. ~Paramahansa's Guru's Guru.
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10-07-2012, 01:15 PM
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Master
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 4,274
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Originally Posted by Starbuck
Hmm I agree Oliness. I think there's a difference between learning from others (which of course, we all naturally have to do from birth) and attaching to others to fulfil an inner yearning. Not that either of those is 'bad' as such, but learning generally suggests becoming more independent whereas attaching to others places others in a more important, guru or celebrity role. That works for some people and they prefer not to move on any further.
Some people follow gurus and develop their own understandings and beliefs from them. I do this from reading books etc. In the past I have seen therapists for support and also to learn how to become myself and free of the past. But I don't follow their words blindly. I don't lose myself in ideas without having the independent capacity to feel what is true for myself. That is the difference in my view. I'm not so sure it's all about the nature of the guru, but how these gurus are interpreted by the people around them.
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Excellent post!
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"Just came back from the storm." -Jimi Hendrix
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10-07-2012, 02:33 PM
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Master
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 7,993
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn
You're not a'kiddin'!!!
Powers and grace galore!!! Just for being open and guilless.
I thought LSD was pumped into my veins.
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My thoughts:
People go to these born-again Christian rallies and faint asthe preacher waves his hand over their heads. People go to rock concerts andfaint and cry uncontrollably when the Beatles or Michael Jackson would comeout.
Maybe the “power” felt by the Guru falls into this category.I think it does, although I am not exactly sure what is happening. I do thinkit best not to jump to conclusions and I also think it helpful to ask myselfwhy I may have jumped to such conclusions....if it had been me....and it has at times.
To me that is growth………………..James |
10-07-2012, 02:51 PM
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Master
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 6,087
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There is the spiritual master or shaman and the shaman's journey...this is the direct transmission of awakening or awareness.
It is experienced anew by everyone who comes to that place and that teaching.
That is very real.
Everyone needs to honour his or her own experience and wisdom, along with that of others. We learn and receive...and we evaluate and cull (a VERY critical step!!! LOL)...and we give as well...
All aspects are important.
Peace & blessings,
7L
__________________
Bound by conventions, people tend to reach for what is easy.
Here we must be unafraid of what is difficult.
For all living beings in nature must unfold in their particular way
and become themselves despite all opposition.
-- Rainer Maria Rilke
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10-07-2012, 03:02 PM
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Master
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 7,993
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by 7luminaries
There is the spiritual master or shaman and the shaman's journey...this is the direct transmission of awakening or awareness.
It is experienced anew by everyone who comes to that place and that teaching.
That is very real.
Everyone needs to honour his or her own experience and wisdom, along with that of others. We learn and receive...and we evaluate and cull (a VERY critical step!!! LOL)...and we give as well...
All aspects are important.
Peace & blessings,
7L
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It is only real if you perceive life this way..........in which case it is subjective. I will experience what I "want" to expereince...........from awakenings to other worlds.
This a great mystery depicting the power of the mind and being human.
I have found that I even attracted the "gurus" , "places", "teachings" that I "needed" to experience.....
James |
10-07-2012, 05:35 PM
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Master
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,847
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Hi Dream Angel,
These links are for texts that may be helpful to your and others' inquiries, as I find they have been extremely useful in understanding this subject for myself.
The first link is for a chapter in Sri Aurobindo's The Synthesis of Yoga - Part I, Chapter 1, The Four Aids, which outlines the actual general means of spiritual progress. (1. truth, principles, 2. personal effort, 3. assistance of a guru, 4. time)
The aid of a guru, which is little understood in the West, is described in this chapter. It is found after the 2nd set of ***'s (page break) beginning with..."As the supreme..." He tells you exactly what the true guru in human form represents.
Sri Aurobindo explains the underlying basis of the guru phenomenon
Parts of this directly answer some of your questions, and greatly clarifies subsequent discussion on many points now appearing in this thread.
According to Sri Aurobindo - the authentic guru does 3 things:
1) they present the formal teaching
2) they are a living example as an embodiment of that teaching
3) they provide influence in their presence and/or by 'contact' with their 'consciousness'. This is the one that deals with the knotty intangibles of occult influence, and unseen dynamics that take place once a consecrated relationship has been established with an authentic guru. This is explained in the text near the end of the chapter.
Link to SF thread on the above cited book:
http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/sh...ad.php?t=30142
Another book that I recommend in this regard is Sri Chinmoy's
"The Master and the Disciple" on general principles and specific personal dynamics of the (authentic) guru-disciple relationship.
I hope this is helpful in clarifying what often seems to be misconception and misunderstanding on this subject.
~ J
Last edited by Jyotir : 10-07-2012 at 10:04 PM.
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10-07-2012, 06:01 PM
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Master
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 6,087
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by WhiteShaman
It is only real if you perceive life this way..........in which case it is subjective. I will experience what I "want" to expereince...........from awakenings to other worlds.
This a great mystery depicting the power of the mind and being human.
I have found that I even attracted the "gurus" , "places", "teachings" that I "needed" to experience.....
James
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Well of course that is all true 
If you are open to direct mind-to-mind transmission of experience and awareness, it is real. 
peace & blessings,
7L
__________________
Bound by conventions, people tend to reach for what is easy.
Here we must be unafraid of what is difficult.
For all living beings in nature must unfold in their particular way
and become themselves despite all opposition.
-- Rainer Maria Rilke
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10-07-2012, 06:23 PM
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by psychoslice
The so called Guru knows that he is like everyone else, its what is beyond the Guru that he points to, the Guru has experienced he's true inner Being, he has Realized that he is not the mind body, and all he is doing is pointing others to their own inner Being, you can know all about the experience but you really don't know until you yourself have experienced your true inner Being, or Self. The ego will hate the Guru and come up with all sorts of exscusses to belittle the Guru, the ego is happy just where it is, for where it is, it knows that its in charge of your whole life, its either you like where you are or you don't, if you do like where you are, then stay there, if you don't, then maybe you should listen to the Guru.
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Guru is simply wisdom which breaks you away from the illusionary belief/cultural dogma. Therefore scriptures can be the perfect Guru because that does away with serving the perishable physical body. |
10-07-2012, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Seawolf
Someone can think about spirituality alot and sound like they're very knowlegable. Also some can develop skills through practice that make them seem 'great', but overall I think everyone is on the same level. Like Starbuck said, we follow others because it's part of our nature, but then sometimes we realize they're just like everyone else. It feels good to think we can be on a higher level than others, but it's doesn't really make us better people.
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Very true. |
10-07-2012, 07:01 PM
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Master
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 6,880
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Jyotir
2) they are a living example as an embodiment of that teaching
~ J
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Absolutely... ..
x daz x
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Everything under the sun is in tune,but the sun is eclipsed by the moon.
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