Loki as a patron?

I see Loki as both a benevolent and malevolent God - just like many Gods are, he is very dualistic, and very unpredictable, which is why I am cautious with him. Also the only times, he has come to me in a positive light, is to be more playful in life - that is all; I have not actually seen the negative side of him, but I know it is there.

But given to Loki's nature, I would just be cautious of his influence on you. :) Try to attract his benevolent side, if you so wish to accept him as your patron, and just be wary of his malevolent side - who knows what he can influence.

[Kaere]

I would agree with you Animus27. IMO, Loki or just something claiming to be Loki, I would NOT trust to be doing so for MY benefit at all.

Originally Posted by AngelicOrin

I see Loki as both a benevolent and malevolent God - just like many Gods are...

In most Germanic cultures the gods weren't seen as being either benevolent or malevolent in the sense the words are commonly used. The gods are preservers of the natural order. Humans gift the gods so they can prosper and gain luck. But overall, the gods were concerned about preserving the world, rather than helping out individual people. Loki, as seen in the Eddic poems, is an outlaw to the gods. Regardless of his connection he had to Odhinn (the cryptic comment made in the Lokasenna); he is no longer seen as being aligned with them, and thus not with lucky humans by extension.

I am mostly just exploring the role of the Loki figure of the Eddas, with the backdrop of how many dynamics worked for both gods and people as understood by Old Norse peoples. I just see that Loki's role in the poems is easily misinterpreted, and that he's just a simple trickster; when it's much more complex than that.

Originally Posted by Animus27

In most Germanic cultures the gods weren't seen as being either benevolent or malevolent in the sense the words are commonly used. The gods are preservers of the natural order. Humans gift the gods so they can prosper and gain luck. But overall, the gods were concerned about preserving the world, rather than helping out individual people. Loki, as seen in the Eddic poems, is an outlaw to the gods. Regardless of his connection he had to Odhinn (the cryptic comment made in the Lokasenna); he is no longer seen as being aligned with them, and thus not with lucky humans by extension.

I am mostly just exploring the role of the Loki figure of the Eddas, with the backdrop of how many dynamics worked for both gods and people as understood by Old Norse peoples. I just see that Loki's role in the poems is easily misinterpreted, and that he's just a simple trickster; when it's much more complex than that.

That is true, definitely see where you are coming from with that - I am so used of beings such as Shiva and Devi, so my apologises.

And, Loki himself is one complex character too.

[UniverseofLove]

This is an interesting point. I know that, in Viking mythos, Loki is the mischievous one, but I also thought he was one of the Gods. In the kids' show "There's a Viking in my Bed", Loki is referred to be the resident Viking when he says "Loki's oath" when he's up to no good and is trying to get away with it.
I also have a friend who is from the Asatru religion (Viking) and that person worships Thor, Frey, Freya, Odin and maybe more but refuses to even speak Loki's name as it's bad luck - I think they said it calls upon them, or risks them being summoned. I was free to say it if I wished, but they wouldn't and I think preferred me not to.

(This is all related) I'm often surrounded by Christian friends and I know quite a lot about various forms of Christianity – so I’m using the example – but I don't agree with their interpretation of Lucifer. I believe Lucifer to be a loving Angel like any other and that he's being wrongly incorporated into the Bible and Christian doctrine as the evil fallen Angel who tempts people. I could quote the book I read that in, but my reason for believing it is because it seems more plausible than the fallen Angel story. Perhaps Loki has had the same background and mistreatment? I don't know what I believe on that front because I don't have extensive knowledge on the Viking religion, but that might be worth thinking about and perhaps researching (in both Viking religion and objective texts).

I would say, follow your heart. If you truly trust him and there is no ego involved in that trust, then I don't see where the harm is, but if you have cause for concern then call on the God/Goddess you most trust for the relevant protection.

As I have a lot of faith in New Age Spirituality, I would ask "are you of the divine?" or something like that to ask them if they are good or not. If they say yes, then ok, but if they say no or don't answer (or don’t give you a straight answer) then just tell it/him/her to go away. I think they do if you say that.
If that works for you, then you might want to give it a try :)

I would say, follow your heart. If you truly trust him and there is no ego involved in that trust, then I don't see where the harm is, but if you have cause for concern then call on the God/Goddess you most trust for the relevant protection.

As I have a lot of faith in New Age Spirituality, I would ask "are you of the divine?" or something like that to ask them if they are good or not. If they say yes, then ok, but if they say no or don't answer (or don’t give you a straight answer) then just tell it/him/her to go away. I think they do if you say that.
If that works for you, then you might want to give it a try :)

Given the fact that Loki is a habitual liar & manipulator - wouldn't that strategy just scream 'mess with me' to him?

Originally Posted by Animus27

Given the fact that Loki is a habitual liar & manipulator - wouldn't that strategy just scream 'mess with me' to him?

Yeah, I imagine Loki eats the "love and light" New Ager crowd for breakfast.

Originally Posted by Quintessence

Yeah, I imagine Loki eats the "love and light" New Ager crowd for breakfast.

LOL. I can't help but think of this story when it comes to asking Loki questions or making deals: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mj%C3%B6lnir#Prose_Edda

I can just imagine him sneering and saying "well, that's not what I said."

Joking aside, there's so much that can be learned from the "malevolent" Pagan gods out there. Tons of Pagan gods aren't exactly nice folks (though frankly, neither are the various versions of the Abrahamic God if we read some of the tales about him/her/it). I don't see it as malevolence, though. Pagan deities, being something of personifications of nature, are amoral entities in my book. It makes no more sense to call Loki "evil" or "malevolent" than to call a tree "evil" or "malevolent." In some respects, these kinds of forces remind us that the universe isn't here to serve humanity, though I suppose some users on this forum would disagree with me on that point.

Originally Posted by Quintessence

Joking aside, there's so much that can be learned from the "malevolent" Pagan gods out there. Tons of Pagan gods aren't exactly nice folks (though frankly, neither are the various versions of the Abrahamic God if we read some of the tales about him/her/it). I don't see it as malevolence, though. Pagan deities, being something of personifications of nature, are amoral entities in my book. It makes no more sense to call Loki "evil" or "malevolent" than to call a tree "evil" or "malevolent." In some respects, these kinds of forces remind us that the universe isn't here to serve humanity, though I suppose some users on this forum would disagree with me on that point.

I see your point. I don't necessarily agree in all respects, since I see gods as more than personifications of natural forces.

One good example of how different gods can be malevolent and benevolent would be the relationship Odhinn and Loki have with the other gods in Eddic poetry. Odhinn is portrayed to be, well, a jerk (or ***, which would be a nice pun ) on many occasions. He has no problem screwing people over and hanging them out to dry if it suits his agenda. Loki is the same in that regard. Loki manipulates and cons people without regret. But the key difference is why they do it. Loki does it for amusement, without a plan or purpose. He delights in stirring up trouble for the sake of it. Odhinn on the other-hand, has a purpose. He amasses knowledge and wisdom and plans for Ragnarok. He calls volven out of their mounds and asks the future, he tricks and steals from giants to to ready himself for his fight and own death.

The whole issue of Loki worship, from a heathen point of view, is resolved, to a fair degree, by looking at the culture in which the eddic poetry was composed in; that is to say medieval Iceland - where outlawry was basically a death sentence. Worshiping or honoring Loki for the sake of doing so doesn't make sense because he is anathema to the gods who establish and uphold order.

It seems I've ranted a bit. Heh. I'll be quiet now