Spiritual Forums

Home


Donate!


Articles


CHAT!


Shop


 
Welcome to Spiritual Forums!.

We created this community for people from all backgrounds to discuss Spiritual, Paranormal, Metaphysical, Philosophical, Supernatural, and Esoteric subjects. From Astral Projection to Zen, all topics are welcome. We hope you enjoy your visits.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest, which gives you limited access to most discussions and articles. By joining our free community you will be able to post messages, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload your own photos, and gain access to our Chat Rooms, Registration is fast, simple, and free, so please, join our community today! !

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, check our FAQs before contacting support. Please read our forum rules, since they are enforced by our volunteer staff. This will help you avoid any infractions and issues.

Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Religions & Faiths > Hinduism

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 07-05-2017, 05:29 AM
kisalipa kisalipa is offline
Pathfinder
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 65
 
Recognition and Value for God

Purity means oneness. Pure gold means the single gold metal without any second metal like copper. When a single bond exists without a second bond, that single bond is called as pure love or devotion. This is the highest stage. In the lower stage, even if several bonds exist, only one bond becomes the topmost, before which all other bonds get rejected, in case of competition. In childhood, the bond with parents is the topmost. In youth the bond with one’s beloved or wife is the topmost. Afterwards the bond with one’s children becomes the topmost and continues throughout one’s life. The rejection of other bonds before the topmost bond is the meaning of the word “hate” used by Jesus, when He stated that one cannot become His dearest disciple unless one hates the worldly bonds. The bond with inert money is only to see happiness in one’s parents, wife and children; i.e. the bond with money is only for the sake of life. The bond with one’s own life happens to be the topmost bond from birth to death and before this bond all other bonds may be rejected. But sometimes, this bond may be rejected before the other bonds. It varies from one individual to the other. The bond with God is also like the bond with money. People love God and money only for the sake of the happiness of self (life), parents, wife and children. Money and God are only the instruments to achieve happiness for the sake of self, parents, wife and children. If these bonds are absent, the bond with God and money disappears. This is the case of Pravritti, which is the general trend of most devotees. Only few exceptional cases exist among devotees for whom God becomes the topmost. Such exceptional devotees come under Nivritti and God loves only such exceptional devotees. The transformation of Pravritti to Nivritti is the real spiritual path. Jesus referred only to such devotees of Nivritti in His statement given above. Krishna also referred to such devotees in the Gita (Matchittah matgatapranah…). Divine movies aim to achieve such Nivritti. But people take God as an instrument to achieve protection and happiness of their worldly bonds including their own selves. Jesus says that His dearest disciple must be prepared to carry his own cross for the sake of God. This means that one has to sacrifice even the bond with one’s life for the sake of God. In fact, Jesus sacrificed the bond with His life for the sake of God’s mission, through His crucifixion. Hanuman tore His chest and heart to show God in His heart and this also shows the sacrifice of the bond with life for the sake of God. Krishna also sacrificed the bond with His life and the bonds with His children, wives and relatives for the sake of God’s mission. To establish justice and devotion on this earth, which is the primary aim of God’s mission, Krishna supported the Pandavas by all means.

For the sake of this He accepted the curse from Gandhari due to which all His family and even His own life had to be sacrificed. Such practical sacrifice with all worldly bonds including one’s life for the sake of God’s mission alone could prove that God is the topmost. Thus, Krishna Himself practiced what ever He preached. Practical sacrifice alone can bring the real fruit. Theoretical knowledge and theoretical devotion should lead to the practical sacrifice. Theory is essential for the appearance of practice. Theory is like the seed and the subsequent practice resulting from it is like the tree. The tree alone can give fruit. The knowledge and devotion are like water and fertilizer, which are essential for the seed to grow into a tree. Therefore, knowledge and devotion are important but without practice (service), which is work, there is no fruit. Brahma Vidya, Brahma Jnanam or spiritual knowledge is the most complicated path and even to achieve the correct knowledge is a hectic affair (Kashchinmamvetti…—Gita). Correct knowledge is the first step and even in this first step, there are a lot of complications. People are often misled even in this first step. The whole complication lies only in one point: you must conquer your ego and jealousy completely and recognize the contemporary human incarnation existing before your eyes even though He acts as an ordinary human being. Sometimes He may even act as the worst human being. You have to recognize God who is beyond good and bad. God is the Possessor of the world in which both good and bad exist. God is not touched by the world and therefore the good and the bad do not touch Him. He can expose good or bad but He is not touched by both. The world is like a shirt, which cannot be His characteristic like His skin. The good and bad are like the different colors of His shirt and they are not the colors of His skin. The white color of His shirt is not the white color of His skin. He is wearing white shirt and He is beyond the white shirt. Seeing the color of the white shirt, you will decide that He is white and approach Him as a good person.


In the case of the individual soul, your analysis is correct because the individual soul is a bundle of qualities. The individual soul is the shirt itself. Therefore, the individual soul is actually white or good himself. Similarly, the individual soul can be black or bad. But in the case of the human incarnation, God is beyond the white and black colors, since He is unimaginable. When you approach Him, He will change His white shirt and put on a black shirt. You will think that He is black and you will run away. All your spiritual knowledge must be used to distinguish a really black man and a colorless person wearing a black shirt. This is a test for your knowledge of discrimination and your faith about your identification of God. It is also a practical test for your value for God over the other worldly values including the value for your life. Thus, your identification of God in a human being, who looks like an ordinary human being, is the first step. The faith in this identification is tested on the exhibition of bad qualities by the incarnation. If your faith remains, the extent of faith is tested through the extent of value given to God over other worldly values. Sage Sharabhanga could not identify Rama as God, because Rama ended in problems by blindly following the foolish desire of His wife for a golden deer even though Lakshmana warned against it. He submitted his living body in the fire altar for the sake of God and thus he showed that he had the highest value for God. But he could not recognize the contemporary human incarnation. King Dhritarashtra believed in Krishna as the contemporary human incarnation but his value for God was not high
compared to his value for his son. Therefore he refused the proposal of Krishna to avoid war even after seeing Krishna’s cosmic vision (Vishwarupam). If you see Hanuman, He not only recognized the contemporary human incarnation as God like Dhritarashtra, but also gave the topmost value to God like Sharabhanga by tearing open His chest with His own nails and offering His life for God. Thus, Hanuman contains the merits of both Sharabhanga and Dhritarashtra and he also avoided the defects of both. Most human beings have both the defects and therefore salvation is only for one in millions and that too after millions of births as per the Gita. In the statement of Jesus that unless one sacrifices all the worldly bonds including the bond with one’s life, one cannot be His dearest disciple, both these merits are indicated. Generally the inner circle-devotees of God, who are very few in number, are born as devotees and get salvation, which is only a show for the sake of other devotees because the inner circle-devotees are already liberated souls. Sage Nara was a liberated soul already associated with Lord. But he was born as Arjuna, then as a hunter and finally as Vivekananda. In these three births, he represented an ordinary human being (Nara) and showed the path of salvation in the role of a devotee. Thus, the same liberated souls are born again and again and get salvation to show the path to other devotees. Only one in millions, after millions of births, gets real salvation and enters the inner circle of God. To achieve this goal, you have to conquer the ego and jealousy in order to recognize the contemporary human incarnation on one side. On the other side, you have to increase the value of God to the highest place, defeating all other worldly values including the value for your own life.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 13-05-2017, 12:43 AM
running running is offline
Deactivated Account
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: in my truck. anywhere usa
Posts: 8,524
  running's Avatar
the colors from what i can tell represent whats going on from the emotional body.

once the two have become one then there is another phenomena going on. which is bliss and silence. two being shakti and shiva. male and female. becoming one is the merging of them. or also described as kundalini awakening to kundalini awakened.

once the kundalini is awakened bliss and silence is like gravity. in that it is always, effortlessly, drawing in everything into it. dissolving emotions and the mind into it. emotions no longer linger much and they are ALL felt in joy. because the power of bliss and silence supercedes and is stronger than them. so the mind is effortlessly in silence and joy.

everything is the same and everyrhing is different. different because reguardless joy and silence is experienced. the same because emotions and preferences still exist.

preferences and ideas have to do with cultural background and personal lifetimes of experience. not something you can use as a guide post to where somebody is at on the spiritual path. the biggest mistake people make. causing a lot of confusion.

bliss and silence is something to recognize and is something that can rub off on another helping somebody along. which is why gurus have helped many people.
__________________
celebrate co2
https://co2coalition.org/

Wherever I May Roam
https://youtu.be/Qq9PxuAsiR4
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 15-05-2017, 09:51 AM
kisalipa kisalipa is offline
Pathfinder
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 65
 
Hello,

Yoga shows six wheels (Chakras) and the seventh wheel (Sahasrara) exists in the top most part of the head, which is the place of intelligence. The six wheels indicate the entire creation. The seventh wheel above all these six wheels containing unimaginable God at the center (Shiva) indicates that God is beyond creation (six wheels). The centre of intelligence means arriving at central conclusion by several analytical discussions done from all sides. Therefore, the Veda says that no item of the creation is God (Neti Neti). Among the six wheels, Mooladhara shows earth, which is solid state of matter. Next, Manipoora indicating water represents the liquid state of matter. Next, Anaahata standing for air indicates the gaseous state of matter. The Swaadhisthaana wheel stands for fire which is inert energy in the visible range. Vishuddha stands for space, which is the energy in the invisible range. Thus, the five wheels constitute the inert matter (three substages) and inert energy (two substages). The sixth wheel is Aajnaa chakra, standing for mind or awareness (awareness is like lump of gold and mind is like a specific golden jewel representing gold in general). This is nervous energy or general awareness (Chit). The sixth wheel indicates the three functioning modes of awareness (mind, memory and individual ego). God is in the seventh wheel which is above six wheels (Buddhiyoga). What does this mean? God is above the creation consisting of matter, energy (even space) and awareness also. Hence, to consider the awareness as God is totally wrong. When God is beyond space and even imagination (mind), God becomes unimaginable. Kundalini is the mind or awareness or nervous energy travelling in the form of waves like a serpent. When this imagination (mind) reaches the sixth wheel, it means that the awareness attained itself or becoming itself called as self-realization (Aatma jnaana). It is very very difficult to cross the sixth wheel because nothing can go beyond itself! Even Shri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa was unable to cross this sixth wheel and his preacher (Totapuri) pierced this wheel present in between two eyebrows with a piece of glass. Now, you can imagine the cases of ordinary human beings! However, this does not mean that everyone can cross this wheel with the help of a glass piece! It is only a symbolic action of the grace of the preacher indicating the anger of the preacher for his inability to cross it. Intelligence is also a mode of awareness representing several analytical discussions and the final conclusion is to imagine that God is unimaginable. After entering the seventh wheel containing infinite number of modes of analysis of intelligence, the imagination reaches the center which is unimaginable God. Imagining that God is unimaginable itself is attaining the unimaginable God. The mind dissolves in the God surrounded by infinite number (Sahasra) of petals, which mean nothing but the infinite number of human forms of God in which the unimaginable God is merged. This is the attainment of the original true unimaginable God.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 15-05-2017, 04:30 PM
running running is offline
Deactivated Account
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: in my truck. anywhere usa
Posts: 8,524
  running's Avatar
no offense but where is the focus of the topic. the experience of bliss and silence.. im not understanding the purpose of the story without speaking of the topic. but I'm not a religious or spiritual text reader.. im a guy that contemplates experience.
__________________
celebrate co2
https://co2coalition.org/

Wherever I May Roam
https://youtu.be/Qq9PxuAsiR4
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 17-05-2017, 11:01 AM
Shivani Devi Shivani Devi is offline
Master
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 10,861
  Shivani Devi's Avatar
Namaste to all.

I seemed to have tied myself in knots of 'thought bites' here, trying to formulate a coherent reply to that which I probably should just leave be.

Many may say that having recognition and value for God, means having the same recognition and value for that which you truly are...being "Tat Twam Asi" anyway. This makes the whole notion of God somewhat...impersonal, but I get that this is the whole point and purpose of the exercise.

From what I gather, the OP is a Vaishnava (possibly Gaudiya) and I am a Shaivite but that makes no difference here. When I think of Krishna, I think of Keshava or Madhava...when I think of Shiva, I think of Neelakantha or Chandrashekhara...I think of God as existing and displaying a form...roopam and having a leela...a Divine passtime.

While I do understand the whole concept of 'Tat Twam Asi' or 'I am Shiva' (Shivoham Shivoham) as per Adi Shankaracharya...it's still difficult to reconcile any part of me as loving/worshiping myself as a 'Divine being' with or without the ego being involved....God still exists apart from what "I" am...much more than what "I" am...I am not 'that'...I am just a small part of what 'that' is...God is everything, which kind of includes what I am.

I look over Jonesboy's Shiva Stutis...but I am more of a 'Stotram girl' in that Shiva isn't an 'abstract concept' being that I am Shiva. In the end...Shiva is still there, with ash-covered body, matted locks, snake around neck, Ganges flowing from hair and so forth...

It was in this form he first introduced Himself to me as being 'God' and when I ask if I am Him, I always seem to get "It's like when two people who are in love join in conjugal bliss.....they become one in the act of love, even though they still exist as being separate...like Ardhanarishwara...you are my better half"...so, I am Devi...who would have known?

Thus, the value of the Divine Form becomes diminished by the Advaitins...probably because some of us still require God to look like that to make the connection with Him...it doesn't happen automatically by saying "Shivoham" or reading a Stuthi or Mahavakya somewhere...

I'm not sure if this can be understood...yes, I am Shiva, but no, I am not Shiva because Shiva is Shiva...is the best way I can explain it and hope others will be able to understand.

...and as for Shiva being a 'demigod'...there's no such thing as one of those...

Om Namah Shivaya
__________________
I am the creator of my own reality, so please don't get offended if I refuse to allow you to be the creator of it instead of focusing on creating your own. Thanks.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 11:58 AM.


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
(c) Spiritual Forums