Do Buddhas Desire?

[Gem]

Originally Posted by Tirisilex

I know the 4 Noble Truths. The second Noble Truth is Tanha which is Craving, Passion.. Not so much mundane desire.. For example the Desire To Eat or to goto the store of to sit down. these desires do not cause suffering.

Sometimes we lose meaning through the translation, so Buddhist desire can be understood as the desire to have something (pleasure sensation) and the desire to get rid of something (discomfort sensation), hence, In English, 'desire' as used in Buddhist text means both cravings and aversions (extremes of which are hatred and greed).

In the example of eating, ok for a start there is a sensation which we associate as 'hunger', and because we are adverse to that sensation we seek food, not for the sake of food itself, but out of desire for the sensation experienced with feeding. Hence, desire to get rid of hunger sensation and desire for the fed/satisfied sensation are like inseparable bedfellows, and this is why Pali uses the one word for both sides of that coin. In a short while, the satisfaction wears off as the hunger sensation returns, and hence, lasting happiness is not found by feeding. Indeed, one may find, if that desire is not sated quickly, that degree of suffering, aversion to hunger + desire for being full, quickly escalates into significant suffering.

This brings us to a core philosophy of The Middle Way, which means, in this context, one doesn't starve themselves in a bid to overcome desires, and nor does one indulge in greed as compelled to sate every desire, but be mindful of bodily sensation and the minds reaction to it, so as to, rather than be compelled by escalating agitation, respond mindfully and sensibly to the body's sensations.

[sky]

When ignorance is replaced with wisdom, it is possible to distinguish* between what is of true benefit and what is not. With wisdom, desires* will naturally be for that which is truly beneficial. In Buddhism, this* desire for true well-being is called*dhammachanda*(desire for that which is right),kusalachanda*(desire for that which is skillful), or in short,chanda.

The objective of chanda is*dhamma*or*kusaladhamma,* truth and goodness. Truth and goodness must be obtained through effort,* and so*chanda*leads to action, as opposed to tanha, which leads to* seeking.*Chanda*arises from intelligent reflection (yoniso-manasikara), as opposed totanha, which is part of the habitual stream of ignorant reactions.
****

There are different types of desires, having the wisdom to understand which are wholesome or not is beneficial to practising Buddhism.
Not all desires are bad.....

[Tirisilex]

Originally Posted by RyanWind

You can find out. Just be present without any thinking and see if any desires are there.

So your telling me that you can be so mindful that when you are mindful during the day you wont desire anything at all? No desire to go to work.. or to goto the bathroom.. or to watch the news?

It cannot be done..

If I asked you to raise your right hand without desiring to could you do it?

All action is governed by deisre.

[sky]

Ego depends on desire, desire depends on ego, while practising ' Mindfulness ' there is no ego, hence no desire.
That is the way I see it in my practise.

[sky]

Originally Posted by Tirisilex

So your telling me that you can be so mindful that when you are mindful during the day you wont desire anything at all? No desire to go to work.. or to goto the bathroom.. or to watch the news?

It cannot be done..

If I asked you to raise your right hand without desiring to could you do it?

All action is governed by deisre.

Going to work and the bathroom etc: are needs not desires, different...

[RyanWind]

Originally Posted by Tirisilex

So your telling me that you can be so mindful that when you are mindful during the day you wont desire anything at all? No desire to go to work.. or to goto the bathroom.. or to watch the news?

It cannot be done..

If I asked you to raise your right hand without desiring to could you do it?

All action is governed by desire.

Yes we impose our will over our bodies and this leads to action. However, we can also identify with our mechanical habitual thoughts and this leads to action too. The question is not about having or not having desire. The question is what we are from moment to moment. Are our actions motivated by ourselves as free and unconditioned selfless beings or is our action dictated by our animal natures and our habitual and selfish and self centered thinking?

Most Guru's say they don't watch the news. They have no desire to. I saw one get asked the question, "Do you stay up on world affairs?," and the Guru looked at the questioner like he was crazy. He answered, "Why would I want to fill my consciousness with such things?"

Yes every one desires if you want to use that word to describe self caused action. But what we are determines what we desire or want or what we do. If one is identified with thought and the animal nature of the body, that leads to what they do. If one is unconditioned and selfless, their desires are very different so what they do is very different.

A hermit Monk living in the forest only desires to know God. To reside and dwell in that peace and conflict free bliss of being selfless. They desire to have no desires, to be unconditional love. Yes they still eat and go to the bathroom and deal with getting by in life, but their desires are not from their lower natures. Some young guy living in the city desires women and money and fast flashy cars. He is constantly trying to get and keep these things to be happy.

We are all at different places in our journey and where we need to be to learn what we are here to learn. Over time, we learn that we get everything by wanting nothing. We become everything, by becoming nothing. Freedom from our limited sense of self and our thoughts and ego becomes the most valuable thing to have in the world. In the end, that is all we desire. To find what we really are and through that, connect to the source of all that is.

[jonesboy]

The first guru that doesn't watch the news has the desire to avoid.

The monk living in the forest is avoiding issues that arise with others and has the desire to be more than what he is.

Bhakti the desire to continue our practice to realize the true state of our being is a good thing.

A Buddha is one that has truly realized that...

Desire to have a steak or a burger is normal and there is nothing wrong with that. Living in the flesh it is part of life.

Desire to have a steak to impress others is where the attachments show up.


This might help from the Tao Te Ching:


Verse 22

Yield and overcome,

bend but follow the flow.

Empty yourself of everything, then you can be full.

Have little but gain a lot.

Have much and be confused.

Let go of your attachments, don't attach and let them flow. When you are empty of attachments of grasping you realize the fullness of that which is. When you grasp at 'things" the mind takes over hence the confusion.



Therefore the Sage embraces the one;

he sets an example to the world,

by not putting on a display he shines forth.

The Sage is one who has let go and shows no attachments to things such as putting on a display.



Having no preference, he is open to all.

By never boasting or bragging he can never falter.

By not attaching he never falters.

Because the thoughts just flow through and never attach he is always with the flow and not caught up in boasting/bragging/desires to be or change things.


By knowing this and refusing that,

he knows the ways of man.

Thus he can avoid a quarrel.

The Ancient Masters were always empty,

but this emptiness was always whole.

Yield and overcome and be forever full.

And so, all things will come to you.

Just good advice :)

[RyanWind]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

The first guru that doesn't watch the news has the desire to avoid.

The monk living in the forest is avoiding issues that arise with others and has the desire to be more than what he is.

That's one thing about spirituality, it is about what the person is, not about what they pretend to be or say they are. Some of the biggest Guru's turn out to be the biggest sinners and egotists.

The CEO of one of the biggest corporations in the world could be more advanced than some Hermit monk living in a cave...it depends on what is in their heart, what they are inside.

In every field, in every profession, you have saints and sinners. That includes the military and monasteries. An old advanced soul could be a soldier in the Army, likewise, a selfish self-centered egotist could run a monastery. That's the way life is.

It's like that old story where a enlightened seer announces he has had a vision that a very highly advanced master is in a monastery so all of the monks living in the monastery get all excited they may be the person the seer saw in his vision. The seer comes followed by a great crowd and all of the monks gather out front to be picked... The seer walks past them all and into the monastery kitchen and there he bows down at the feet of the old woman washing the dishes staying "Master teach me."

[jonesboy]

Originally Posted by RyanWind

That's one thing about spirituality, it is about what the person is, not about what they pretend to be or say they are. Some of the biggest Guru's turn out to be the biggest sinners and egotists.

The CEO of one of the biggest corporations in the world could be more advanced than some Hermit monk living in a cave...it depends on what is in their heart, what they are inside.

In every field, in every profession, you have saints and sinners. That includes the military and monasteries. An old advanced soul could be a soldier in the Army, likewise, a selfish self-centered egotist could run a monastery. That's the way life is.

It's like that old story where a enlightened seer announces he has had a vision that a very highly advanced master is in a monastery so all of the monks living in the monastery get all excited they may be the person the seer saw in his vision. The seer comes followed by a great crowd and all of the monks gather out front to be picked... The seer walks past them all and into the monastery kitchen and there he bows down at the feet of the old woman washing the dishes staying "Master teach me."

Do you know how he was able to pick out the old lady from them all?

When you are able to feel energy..

Beings with great clarity radiate. With sight one can see a being.. Beyond sight is knowing...

It is not always the actions, great masters have been thought to be mean or crazy.. but the presence never lies..

[sky]

[quote=jonesboy]Do you know how he was able to pick out the old lady from them all?





She was the only one wearing yellow washing up gloves