Energy in Buddhism

[Gem]

Originally Posted by JustBe

Hello gem

I’m curious about jonesboys question he asked you about energy as a physical sensation. I’d be interested in your view on this more so. If you want too elaborate, that is.

At first in the meditation one can feel the normal physical things they are used to, but if you really try to feel subtle details of feelings the mind is required to focus and you start to feel the more subtle nuances of the feelings that you haven't felt before.



If you go over every part of the body feeling every little detail, you will start to notice the areas which feel tense, dense and solid as well as other areas that have lighter feelings. Some areas will be easy to feel and there are other places which you can hardly feel or not feel at all.


If we are tying to feel energy, that desire will impel us jump about the body from light, pleasurable sensation to light, pleasurable sensation, but if we do this we will not address denser solid feelings or the unfelt parts of the body, so we continue to retain solidity and the sleeping parts don't wake up.



Feeling over over the entire body without overlooking any small part, and no matter the if feeling is solid or light, you try to feel the subtlest details you can of whatever feeling is there. By examining closely you find that a very solid or dense feeling has a lighter movement under it, and in this way you begin to feel the actual nature of feeling not as large hard feelings that last, but as tiny dynamic movements that are passing very quickly. By focusing the the mind to feel the most subtle nuances of the feelings, the perception becomes more sensitive and you're able to feel increasingly subtle levels of feelings over time. On the sleeping parts which you can barely feel at all, you have to really try to feel something, and this requires the mind to focus with all of its attention bringing conscious awareness to these places so that you become conscious of them. Thus they start to come alive. Focusing like this also hones the mind into a more finely tuned, sensitive, perceptive instrument.


During this practice you will notice a lot of things about the mind. Perhaps so far I've been giving the impression that this is a rather pleasant thing to do. But there is pain in the body and there is pleasure, and the mind will react adversely to discomfort and crave pleasure, which is antithetical to the equanimity that characterises meditation. You will learn how distracted you really are and how you generate a lot of suffering through your adverse and craven reactivity. There's frustration, boredom, impatience, agitation, sloth and self-defeat, and you cannot examine the body without also exposing the ways in which you generate all of your suffering through these ill states of mind.


Bear with me. I am not digressing from the question. I'm just articulating the underlying principles. As Buddha worded it, "ardent awareness free of craving and aversion in the world". That is not 'energy practice'. It is the practice of keeping a perfectly stable mind regardless of what feelings you happen to experience.


Bringing your conscious awareness from the surface of hard physical feelings to the underlying subtler, dynamic feelings purifies the life-form as it goes. But it has to be a pure awareness and not not an awareness tainted with adversity and craving toward your feelings. Awareness with equanimity is what we actually practice. We are not trying to make energy happen nor trying to make the hard density go away. We are observing as closely as we can to discover the deeper reality for insight into the true nature of mind and matter phenomena.


As the mind becomes very perceptive and can feel very subtle details of feeling clearly and distinctly, the solidity and density start dissolving away and the sleeping unfelt areas wake up and can be felt clearly and distinctly; and the whole body becomes a uniform vibrant feeling all over. Then the attention can pass through the body easily (since it has lost its density) and flows from head to toe and and bottom to top at a constant, uninterrupted rate. The impurities that were blocking up the body are dissolved in pure awareness and the feelings start to flow.



But these flows very distinct and not hard to feel, so you continue with feeling the subtlest details you can, requiring the mind to really focus and become ever sharper, and the neutrality of equanimity become ever stronger.


At some stage of the purification the love of the universe will rise in the heart and pervade the body-mind and the warm glow of love that characterises of our existential nature will emanate outward from you.


The dissolving feelings continues. The bony structures are still pretty solid, and you continue feeling the subtlest details as you possibly can, mind even more sensitive, equanimity even more stable, and one day the entire body of feelings will entirely dissolve into an infinite momentary array .

[Gem]

[quote=jonesboy]

Originally Posted by Gem

Very nice post on how Buddhism works with the practices.

Unfortunately that is not what an empowerment is or how it works within Buddhism.

Ok... umm... your refutation is noted?

[jonesboy]

Originally Posted by Gem

As the mind becomes very perceptive and can feel very subtle details of feeling clearly and distinctly, the solidity and density start dissolving away and the sleeping unfelt areas wake up and can be felt clearly and distinctly; and the whole body becomes a uniform vibrant feeling all over. Then the attention can pass through the body easily (since it has lost its density) and flows from head to toe and and bottom to top at a constant, uninterrupted rate. The impurities that were blocking up the body are dissolved in pure awareness and the feelings start to flow.



But these flows very distinct and not hard to feel, so you continue with feeling the subtlest details you can, requiring the mind to really focus and become ever sharper, and the neutrality of equanimity become ever stronger.


At some stage of the purification the love of the universe will rise in the heart and pervade the body-mind and the warm glow of love that characterises of our existential nature will emanate outward from you.


The dissolving feelings continues. The bony structures are still pretty solid, and you continue feeling the subtlest details as you possibly can, mind even more sensitive, equanimity even more stable, and one day the entire body of feelings will entirely dissolve into an infinite momentary array .

Very, very nice Gem!

The difference with tantra is having the same equanimity they use intent to direct the flow of energy within that has powerful results. Then they move on to meditation.

Eventually you realize, the energy and mind are one and the same. Later you realize that you and all there is, is one and the same.

[Phaelyn]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

nobody here is really a Buddhist except you I guess.

I think everyone here is a Buddhist. Why else would they be here! Maybe they subconsciously just don't like the label "Buddhist" or something. But if you read this thread, and like Buddhist teachings so much you are attracted to them, yes you are a Buddhist! In my view anyway. If one was not Buddhist, in anyway, they would not ever click on this thread! My "Buddhist temple" invites all in. All are welcome! If you have even the smallest, tiniest interest in what Buddha as the seed set forth that has become today's Buddhism and Zen and even some "new age" belief you are Buddhist!, the spider web of interconnection is VAST,....even Tolle speaks of Buddha and Buddhism! So the seed is there even unrecognized.. It's not that a Buddhist is someone that believes or does a particular thing, no anyone who knows or has touched this particular thing is a Buddhist! In the end, Buddhism is a teaching of love and compassion, IS love and compassion, therefore ALL who love and have compassion are expressions of Buddhism and are Buddhist!

But yes some will make it about something other than universal LOVE! They're just grumpy.

[Phaelyn]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

Eventually you realize, the energy and mind are one and the same. Later you realize that you and all there is, is one and the same.

Hopefully none of that "realizing" is verbal or has anything to do with thinking or having the attention on such things! But then if one is not focusing on thoughts and thinking, all those words and mental concepts, "energy" - "mind" - "one and the same"..... none of that exists if one is living the realization.

But then as is "typical" one has a metaphysical experience, leaves it back to ego consciousness, and the flows of words and mental conceptualizing begins. The words are substituted for the non-verbal reality. The delusional consciousness accept the words and mental concepts AS equal in value or substance to the past memory of a particular transcendental experience.

[BigJohn]

Originally Posted by Phaelyn

I think everyone here is a Buddhist. Why else would they be here! Maybe they subconsciously just don't like the label "Buddhist" or something. But if you read this thread, and like Buddhist teachings so much you are attracted to them, yes you are a Buddhist! In my view anyway. If one was not Buddhist, in anyway, they would not ever click on this thread! My "Buddhist temple" invites all in. All are welcome! If you have even the smallest, tiniest interest in what Buddha as the seed set forth that has become today's Buddhism and Zen and even some "new age" belief you are Buddhist!, the spider web of interconnection is VAST,....even Tolle speaks of Buddha and Buddhism! So the seed is there even unrecognized.. It's not that a Buddhist is someone that believes or does a particular thing, no anyone who knows or has touched this particular thing is a Buddhist! In the end, Buddhism is a teaching of love and compassion, IS love and compassion, therefore ALL who love and have compassion are expressions of Buddhism and are Buddhist!

But yes some will make it about something other than universal LOVE! They're just grumpy.

I agree with you.

but.............. some on here do not think those from predominate Buddhist countries are Buddhist.

That is a major division in Buddhism.


As for love........... that has been a hot topic especially among the Buddhist on the Christian Forum.

[JustBe]

Originally Posted by Gem

At first in the meditation one can feel the normal physical things they are used to, but if you really try to feel subtle details of feelings the mind is required to focus and you start to feel the more subtle nuances of the feelings that you haven't felt before.



If you go over every part of the body feeling every little detail, you will start to notice the areas which feel tense, dense and solid as well as other areas that have lighter feelings. Some areas will be easy to feel and there are other places which you can hardly feel or not feel at all.


If we are tying to feel energy, that desire will impel us jump about the body from light, pleasurable sensation to light, pleasurable sensation, but if we do this we will not address denser solid feelings or the unfelt parts of the body, so we continue to retain solidity and the sleeping parts don't wake up.



Feeling over over the entire body without overlooking any small part, and no matter the if feeling is solid or light, you try to feel the subtlest details you can of whatever feeling is there. By examining closely you find that a very solid or dense feeling has a lighter movement under it, and in this way you begin to feel the actual nature of feeling not as large hard feelings that last, but as tiny dynamic movements that are passing very quickly. By focusing the the mind to feel the most subtle nuances of the feelings, the perception becomes more sensitive and you're able to feel increasingly subtle levels of feelings over time. On the sleeping parts which you can barely feel at all, you have to really try to feel something, and this requires the mind to focus with all of its attention bringing conscious awareness to these places so that you become conscious of them. Thus they start to come alive. Focusing like this also hones the mind into a more finely tuned, sensitive, perceptive instrument.


During this practice you will notice a lot of things about the mind. Perhaps so far I've been giving the impression that this is a rather pleasant thing to do. But there is pain in the body and there is pleasure, and the mind will react adversely to discomfort and crave pleasure, which is antithetical to the equanimity that characterises meditation. You will learn how distracted you really are and how you generate a lot of suffering through your adverse and craven reactivity. There's frustration, boredom, impatience, agitation, sloth and self-defeat, and you cannot examine the body without also exposing the ways in which you generate all of your suffering through these ill states of mind.


Bear with me. I am not digressing from the question. I'm just articulating the underlying principles. As Buddha worded it, "ardent awareness free of craving and aversion in the world". That is not 'energy practice'. It is the practice of keeping a perfectly stable mind regardless of what feelings you happen to experience.


Bringing your conscious awareness from the surface of hard physical feelings to the underlying subtler, dynamic feelings purifies the life-form as it goes. But it has to be a pure awareness and not not an awareness tainted with adversity and craving toward your feelings. Awareness with equanimity is what we actually practice. We are not trying to make energy happen nor trying to make the hard density go away. We are observing as closely as we can to discover the deeper reality for insight into the true nature of mind and matter phenomena.


As the mind becomes very perceptive and can feel very subtle details of feeling clearly and distinctly, the solidity and density start dissolving away and the sleeping unfelt areas wake up and can be felt clearly and distinctly; and the whole body becomes a uniform vibrant feeling all over. Then the attention can pass through the body easily (since it has lost its density) and flows from head to toe and and bottom to top at a constant, uninterrupted rate. The impurities that were blocking up the body are dissolved in pure awareness and the feelings start to flow.



But these flows very distinct and not hard to feel, so you continue with feeling the subtlest details you can, requiring the mind to really focus and become ever sharper, and the neutrality of equanimity become ever stronger.


At some stage of the purification the love of the universe will rise in the heart and pervade the body-mind and the warm glow of love that characterises of our existential nature will emanate outward from you.


The dissolving feelings continues. The bony structures are still pretty solid, and you continue feeling the subtlest details as you possibly can, mind even more sensitive, equanimity even more stable, and one day the entire body of feelings will entirely dissolve into an infinite momentary array .

Beautifully articulated. Thankyou.

As you show in the ‘totality’ of our interconnectedness within the mind/body arrangement, energy is just one aspect of becoming more ‘aware’ of yourself as an open clear flowing vessel in its potential ‘aliveness’ of being.

In my awareness of energy in my own experience, it’s a stepping stone or ‘process that opens you deeper the nature of what is, as it is. The ‘sensations, surges, movements, in this way ‘clearing’ the way for more ‘clarity’ or even ‘pure awareness’ (unbounded awareness, not bound by anything the mind constructs it as being) So in this view it might be likened as a ‘signal’ of ‘movement’ ‘awakening’ more within the whole dynamic of you, more open, clear and ‘aware’. From there as you show it can deepen to a more finer, subtle awareness.

If we see energy as ‘part of’ the ‘inception’ (creation) of everything within us and part of our transmutation process, this same energy when one is ‘not contained by mind/body distinctions, separateness, ‘need to flow’ it here or there, unblock this or that, can simply be recognised as part of your own ‘being’ that moves as itself aware.

Yes, one can get stuck in energy, not only because it ‘feels powerful’ it ‘feels good’ but because what lays beneath all that, feeling deeper the nature of what is, is often much harder to face, feel and notice.

Then of course you find entanglements and power issues arise because ‘energy’ feels powerful and we want more of that and more of the person we could, might believe is making that happen. True empowerment requires you to ‘know thyself’ and while we fix others and don’t move deeper into deeper, more subtle truths within, we can contain ourselves right where others are contained.

[jonesboy]

Originally Posted by Phaelyn

I think everyone here is a Buddhist. Why else would they be here! Maybe they subconsciously just don't like the label "Buddhist" or something. But if you read this thread, and like Buddhist teachings so much you are attracted to them, yes you are a Buddhist! In my view anyway. If one was not Buddhist, in anyway, they would not ever click on this thread! My "Buddhist temple" invites all in. All are welcome! If you have even the smallest, tiniest interest in what Buddha as the seed set forth that has become today's Buddhism and Zen and even some "new age" belief you are Buddhist!, the spider web of interconnection is VAST,....even Tolle speaks of Buddha and Buddhism! So the seed is there even unrecognized.. It's not that a Buddhist is someone that believes or does a particular thing, no anyone who knows or has touched this particular thing is a Buddhist! In the end, Buddhism is a teaching of love and compassion, IS love and compassion, therefore ALL who love and have compassion are expressions of Buddhism and are Buddhist!

But yes some will make it about something other than universal LOVE! They're just grumpy.

To be a Buddhist you have to actually do the practices. You have to actually practice the Dharma.

Buddhism really isn't just picking and choosing some beliefs that you like and then calling yourself Buddhism.

For example and not being mean. Your ideas are not the same as Buddhism, you don't do any practices. Not sure how you can say you are a Buddhist.

[jonesboy]

Originally Posted by Phaelyn

Hopefully none of that "realizing" is verbal or has anything to do with thinking or having the attention on such things! But then if one is not focusing on thoughts and thinking, all those words and mental concepts, "energy" - "mind" - "one and the same"..... none of that exists if one is living the realization.

But then as is "typical" one has a metaphysical experience, leaves it back to ego consciousness, and the flows of words and mental conceptualizing begins. The words are substituted for the non-verbal reality. The delusional consciousness accept the words and mental concepts AS equal in value or substance to the past memory of a particular transcendental experience.

A Buddha had thoughts, had verbal, etc..

Your concept is limited.

Buddhism is non dual.. your mind can't get past words.

[jonesboy]

Originally Posted by JustBe

Beautifully articulated. Thankyou.

As you show in the ‘totality’ of our interconnectedness within the mind/body arrangement, energy is just one aspect of becoming more ‘aware’ of yourself as an open clear flowing vessel in its potential ‘aliveness’ of being.

In my awareness of energy in my own experience, it’s a stepping stone or ‘process that opens you deeper the nature of what is, as it is. The ‘sensations, surges, movements, in this way ‘clearing’ the way for more ‘clarity’ or even ‘pure awareness’ (unbounded awareness, not bound by anything the mind constructs it as being) So in this view it might be likened as a ‘signal’ of ‘movement’ ‘awakening’ more within the whole dynamic of you, more open, clear and ‘aware’. From there as you show it can deepen to a more finer, subtle awareness.

If we see energy as ‘part of’ the ‘inception’ (creation) of everything within us and part of our transmutation process, this same energy when one is ‘not contained by mind/body distinctions, separateness, ‘need to flow’ it here or there, unblock this or that, can simply be recognised as part of your own ‘being’ that moves as itself aware.

Yes, one can get stuck in energy, not only because it ‘feels powerful’ it ‘feels good’ but because what lays beneath all that, feeling deeper the nature of what is, is often much harder to face, feel and notice.

Then of course you find entanglements and power issues arise because ‘energy’ feels powerful and we want more of that and more of the person we could, might believe is making that happen. True empowerment requires you to ‘know thyself’ and while we fix others and don’t move deeper into deeper, more subtle truths within, we can contain ourselves right where others are contained.

Nice post except..

Then of course you find entanglements and power issues arise because ‘energy’ feels powerful and we want more of that and more of the person we could, might believe is making that happen. True empowerment requires you to ‘know thyself’ and while we fix others and don’t move deeper into deeper, more subtle truths within, we can contain ourselves right where others are contained

Why is there always a power issue, entanglements or that the other person is contained which limits ourselves?

Always such fear of others.. which is a containment all in itself is it not?