Mark of the Beast.

[ciel_perdu]

In Revelation 13, there is a prophecy that says ''no man can buy or sell save he that has the mark in the right hand or the forehead''.

Now, there are so many theories that this prophecy has happened, but they are never cohesive enough to take into account what the prophecy actually says.

Obviously at the moment there is noting in our right hands or foreheads with which we use to buy or sell. But we are moving closer to such a time.

Money used to be gold, silver, then is evolved to cheaper metals, paper, and checks/cheques. It then became even more theoritical when plastic was introduced. Now we can buy and sell on line, via phones, etc. There is a definite evolution of money. And it has gone further...

In countries like Kenya, one can buy and sell from money loaded onto their phone, it's called M-pesa. There are similar technologys in places like the UK, and US.

However, the evolution is becoming more advanced.

There are nightclubs in Scotland, Amsterdam, and Barcelona (Baja Beach Club), where patrons can pay for admission and buy their drinks with a micro-chip implanted in their arm.

That, I believe is where the system is heading to with regards to the monetary system.

It makes sense. No more credit/debit fraud. No need to worry about being robbed, or forgetting your wallet, etc. It will give the governments/banks much more centralized control and tracking of funds, which will cut down on a lot of illegal activity, in which physical cash is very much needed in order to operate.

That's a brief picture of where money was and where it is going.

The Revelation says that anyone who takes the mark will recieve the full-undiluted wrath of God. I am sure many would ask, ''but why would a loving God punish anyone for just wanting to put food on their kids plates, to hold down a good job, providing for him family, etc? Well, in short, the answer is because their faith is in money (greed), and not in God (love).

Jesus made it clear in Matthew 6:24, that man has to choose between working for God, or for mammon. We can't serve both. We will end up loving one and hating the other. This teaching of Jesus is an excellent second witness to the mark of the beast prophecy.

While most of us continue to convince ourselves that we can indeed serve two masters, there is a time coming when we really will have to decide once and for all, what we love...God/Truth/Love, or Mammon, money, greed, fear, material possessions/reputation/status/respectability, etc.

Jesus gave an answer to all who wish to stop working for money. He taught that if we work for God/Love, then we don't need to worry about money, we don't need to work for it. All we need to do is seek to build his Kingdom, obey our conscience and follow his words, serving him and others in love, and God will provide all we need. Jesus said that the birds and the flowers don't work for money, yet God feeds and clothes them, and follows with, ''how much more important to God are you?''.

Now, back to the Mark. The things we know about it are:

1- it will be in the right hand or forehead
2- NO ONE will be able to buy or sell without it.
3- anyone who takes it will recieve the full wrath of God

I would like to hear people's thoughts on the prophecy and how it relates to the teachings of Jesus.

Please think rationally about your response, because so often people just react to this issue.

Just a couple of points to clarify.

I am not saying the mark WILL be a microchip. I am just saying that currently, I don't see any other technology actually in use at the moment, or even on the cards, that would fit better the prophecy.

I am not saying that MONEY is evil (before people write that I am). What I am saying is that Jesus taught us to NOT WORK for money.

I am also NOT saying that people should stop working for money and do nothing, i.e. be lazy/greedy. I am saying that if we stop working for money, we will be free to really work hard for love, both for God and for others.

Well, I look forward to the repsonses.

[ciel_perdu]

Below is a the link for a BBC article that deals with the implantable microchip being used in a nightclub in Barcelona.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/3697940.stm

Hopefully people can feel free to share their thoughts on this subject, because it is an important one, IMO, for Christians. Considering that The Revelation is a 'revelation of Jesus Christ', and this prophecy of the mark is very much related to what Jesus taught in Matthew 6:24, about how we cannot work for God and money at the same time.

I can imagine some are thinking ''ah prophecy, always about the future, completely overlooking the present moment, the here and the now'' (as they sigh and pass over this very relevant issue). True it's talking about something that will come in the future, but it's also relevant to what we do NOW, TODAY.

It is dealing with our spiritual attitude towards love/faith and greed/fear.

Even if most people don't believe in God, most people believe in the Universe, some Surpreme Being. If that's the case, doesn't it makes sense to believe that whatever IT is, IT can look after us if we seek to live according to it's will?

This is what Jesus taught. From what I have read of other religions, I cannot find a one that makes the claim that Jesus made when he said that if we stop working for money and work soley for God/Love, then our Father will feed us, clothe us, give us everything we need. Consider the birds and the flowers, the elephants and the moles, the whale and the fish...do any of them need money? do any of them believe in an illusion/delusion? are any of them dependent on anything but nature (God)?

We humans think we are smart, but we can be the most foolish of creations because we consciously choose to not live in faith and obedience to the one who created us, gives us every breath we breathe and to whom our spirits will go to when we die.

Words fail me to explain what I want to convey, but I guess that's how it is with something so beautiful. Jesus wants us to have the fullest life, an abundant life, a life of meaning and purpose, but that life only comes when we let go of the illusion/delusion that greed keeps us trapped in.

What I am saying is really true, if you think I am just spouting my own opinion and that what I say is not from God, then my response would be that which Jesus said, ''if you think the doctrine I speak is from me and not of the Father, then just do it''.

[Morpheus]

Exactly right. The only question for the person of faith is will it occur
before or after a global catastrophic event, and, the "Rapture"?

Look up at Wikipedia, "George Laurer", founder of the UPC code, which code is now utilized in everything commercial.
Note his attempt to nullify the correlation of the UPC and the, "Mark", of Revelation. The lines after all are "marks".


We can also discuss the three 6's hidden in the code.

Technology is neutral. It is how it is used which is about evil, or good.

[psychoslice]

There is very good evidence to suggest that the Revelation was in fact written long before John by a woman named Sibyl of Tarquin. Sibyl was a great Oracle who lived around 500BC, a story suggests that she sold 3 volumes of her prophetic writing to the King of Ancient Rome for 300 gold pieces. Her prophesy was so good, that she was later venerated by the Roman people.

Some people suggest that the book of Revelation was part of the 3 volumes originally purchased by Rome.

If you think she is a fiction...then one has to wonder why there is a picture of her on the Sistine Chapel ceiling in Rome...

[Morpheus]

Well, she looks like a hefty lady. Maybe there is some validity to that.

However, point of fact, the Book of Revelation agrees with Daniels prophetic book, especially concerning the seven year tribulation period that is prophesied before the Lord's return, and, initiation of His reign on Earth for a thousand years.

Do you study the Bible at all? Or, do you just study everything else that you think refutes it.
The topic is about the, "Mark of the Beast", mentioned in Revelation 13.
Curious, did you look up the reference article that ciel provided above?

Now, most people equate "The Beast" directly with the devil, or, "The Man of Perdition", his minion, which is errant.
The devil is called the, "god of this world", and, "age", but concerning "The Beast", seems it has to do with a global world system with which everyone in the world is involved.
The "Mark" has to do with commerce.
Also connected with, "Babylon".
You might recall an old '80's song by the group, "Wang Chung". Wherein are the words, "All the World is Babylon"?
The Jews were captives in ancient Babylon for a time.
We also, regarding this, "Matrix", "Maya", and "World" are captives.

Regarding this evolved organic aspect in (illusory), time and space, it is a lie compared with the greater reality and truth involving the, "Spirit", and the immaterial soul. Apart from, "Space/Time".

Recall also the song by, "The Police"? "Spirits in the Material World"?

Now concerning the UPC, the Universal Product Code, it is actually 2 + codes in one.
There is a line 1 of marks or lines of code for each numeral, and there is a different line of code for each numeral in line two.
One and two are different line designations for each numeral.

Line one, then, is used first, on the left side of the common code. Line two of different marks for the right side of the common code
If you find a numeral six on the right hand of the code, which uses the second set of lines for each numeral, you wil see that the lines representing the numeral six are two thin lines close together. And, you will note also that these are the same set of lines which start, divide, and end the code...three of them. (A.K.A. Guard Bars)
This has been common knowledge since the Eighties. And concerning study, "psychoslice", it is easily referenced online today.
IF one is inclined to research, objectively.

The Bar Code system has spread to usng various other displays, and images since.
Nevertheless, where is the bar code used today?
Or perhaps one should ask, where is it not used...
Concerning plastic it is in the black strip on he back.
What of the latest inovations involving micro chips?
Satellite technologies?

Here is an online reference site with bar code pics for demonstration:
http://www.judaismvschristianity.com/666_in_barcodes.htm

I noted someone else had also referred to the UPC as the, "Universal Perdition Code".

[psychoslice]

I've studied the bible for many years, with the Seventh Day Adventist, you can find anything you want in the bible, you can make it agree with any other part of the bible, just like they did with the prophesies of Jesus from the old testament.

[Morpheus]

Right. Aware of the Seventh day Adventist's which are commonly referred to as a Christian cult. "Christian", because they do adhere to the fundamental doctrines concerning Christ.

They had early on adopted a partucular point of view concerning the "Mark of the Beast" I noted, and having to do with the main problem in Humanity, "Ego" they refuse to change their perspective on this in the face of overwhelming evidence opposing it.

No matter.

[psychoslice]

Originally Posted by Morpheus

Right. Aware of the Seventh day Adventist's which are commonly referred to as a Christian cult. "Christian", because they do adhere to the fundamental doctrines concerning Christ.

They had early on adopted a partucular point of view concerning the "Mark of the Beast" I noted, and having to do with the main problem in Humanity, "Ego" they refuse to change their perspective on this in the face of overwhelming evidence opposing it.

No matter.

No they don't, the mark of the beast is the Roman church, they were the ones who changed the Sabbath (Saturday) to Sunday worship, there's a lot more than that of course.

[Morpheus]

The Roman Church also is referred to as an aspect of, "Babylon".
Well, we could bicker about it. Let's not.

Meanwhile we are in a period where the world is come together in a global community, thanks to electricity, and technology, and cash money is being left by the wayside.

All it would take is an event of global nature to leave it behined altogether.
We are seeing Biblical prophecies coming to pass before our eyes.
Politically, environmentally/ecologically.

Meanwhile, regarding the topic?

[ciel_perdu]

Originally Posted by psychoslice

No they don't, the mark of the beast is the Roman church, they were the ones who changed the Sabbath (Saturday) to Sunday worship, there's a lot more than that of course.

Hi Pyscoslice,

this thing about Sunday worship really has nothing to do with the prophey about the mark of the beast. A simple way to test some theory that sunday worship is the mark is to ask ourselves some simple question.

1 - How does it fit in with NOT being able to buy and sell?

2 - How is this relevant to ALL people?

3 - How is the sunday worship a mark in ones right hand/forehead?



Please can we try to focus on the issue at hand, i.e. how the mark relates to BUYING and SELLING, what form the mark might take, and what Christians should be doing to prepare for it?