Higgs Boson...Err What ?

[Papa Bear]

Originally Posted by Neville

When it comes to particle physics. I am not the sharpest bullet in the rifle...

So July 4 the 2012..The Higgs Boson has been identified, Just one small question presents, What is a Higgs Boson Particle?

So to help me and anyone else who needs a hand to get their head around what all the fuss is about a Higgs Boson. I found the following analagy most helpful;


Now having been furnished with this understanding, I will leave it in your hands to decide on exactly what relevance or impact if any, this discovery has on Spirituality

It is suggestive to me at least, that sans physicality, both before and after life as we experience it in Human form, we are perhaps a bit Higgs bonish ourselves.

Like I said though, It really is up to you to decide whether science and spirituality can come together in this matter.

Hi Neville, my knowledge of such things is general, but I think I am right defining that the Higgs Boson`s form a positive all- pervading universal field, which by definition requires a reflective all- pervading negative field to justify its existing balance.

Massless is a term in physics, I prefer the term `formless` because the required `negative` all-pervading universal field would also be `formless` only existing to give balance to the boson positive universal fields. To me that formless, massless, negative field is in actuality the ethereal condition, a reflective `formless` condition from which all energies in matter evolved.

The fundamental restriction to understanding the ethereal condition is its `massless` formation, but by recognizing the subtle energy resonance influences of the Higgs Boson, physicists have realized how they may understand a massless or `formless` particle, even more importantly how `formless` mass may have universal source significance.

This may not clarify what an individual boson may be, but its universal all-pervading source influence may lead human physics to the bridge which abridges the material universe and its ethereal counterpart, the first step into the Spiritual in the history of human physics. Well that’s just my reflection or translation, right or inaccurate it creates the first glimpse of how or why human physics may at last harmonizes with spiritual reality, if only at its ethereal beginnings.

As a particle I have thought of it like an invisible pebble entering a universal pool, it is the ripples it creates that are the resonance effects which give mass to other energies. And it is those resonances (ripples) and their effect on other energies that physicists recognized, to be able to theorize the existence of the (pebble) Higgs Boson particle that created those resonances, even though it was massless or (formless in my vocabulary). Maybe amateur in definition but my best shot.

Originally Posted by jondav

Just a thought,but have they really observed it, or is it,s exsistance just been postulated,in order that a nice neat answer,to an awkward question,can be published in scientific journals. I am reminded of the "fact" that other planets have been "discovered" simply by observing that distant stars appear to wobble ,due to the so called gravitational pull of attendant planets, this is all unproven hypothesis

They do seem pretty sure that they have observed a higgs ish particle.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-18702455

Thankyou Papa Bear,

It is your following quoted statement that epitomises the interest that has been aroused in me.

This may not clarify what an individual boson may be, but its universal all-pervading source influence may lead human physics to the bridge which abridges the material universe and its ethereal counterpart, the first step into the Spiritual in the history of human physics. Well that’s just my reflection or translation, right or inaccurate it creates the first glimpse of how or why human physics may at last harmonizes with spiritual reality, if only at its ethereal beginnings.

From time out of mind Humanity has in certain respects , accepted the existence of an afterlife a , point beyond physical death which inturn points to the existence of a state before physical birth , both states being without form , and yet according to many a state none the less (and up to press based on faith alone for the most part)...Interesting stuff...to me at anyrate,

Though by way of disclaimer, I'm not jumping the Gun just yet, as much more research needs to be done in this area of study and doubtless many more questions will present, having said that, as far as first steps go, this was quiet significant IMO.

[hybrid]

Originally Posted by jondav

Just a thought,but have they really observed it, or is it,s exsistance just been postulated,in order that a nice neat answer,to an awkward question,can be published in scientific journals. I am reminded of the "fact" that other planets have been "discovered" simply by observing that distant stars appear to wobble ,due to the so called gravitational pull of attendant planets, this is all unproven hypothesis

who knows, one thing for sure, higg's boson has to be "found" lest those who spent billions of dollars loose their careers and grants.

Originally Posted by hybrid

who knows, one thing for sure, higg's boson has to be "found" lest those who spent billions of dollars loose their careers and grants.

I agree,

It would seem, indeed a very big gamble, so I'm thinking that speculation on the existence of the Higgs Boson Particle must have been very strong to warrant such a massive investment in research in the first place,

Just a thought,but have they really observed it, or is it,s exsistance just been postulated,in order that a nice neat answer,to an awkward question,can be published in scientific journals. I am reminded of the "fact" that other planets have been "discovered" simply by observing that distant stars appear to wobble ,due to the so called gravitational pull of attendant planets, this is all unproven hypothesis

Moving away from the Higgs for a second, there are actually five main ways of detecting extrasolar planets.

The Doppler (radial velocity) method - Measures the speed at which a star moves towards/away from Earth as it is pulled back and forth by its planet's gravitational pull.

The Gravitational Microlensing Method - Checks for light distortions resulting from the pull of gravity.

The Pulsar Timing Technique - Detects an orbiting planet as it disrupts a star's (usual) constant stream of radio waves.

The Astrometry Method - If I may quote you again, 'the "fact" that other planets have been "discovered" simply by observing that distant stars appear to wobble ,due to the so called gravitational pull of attendant planets'

The Transit Technique - When an orbiting planet passes in front of its star, there will obviously be a slight 'dip' (decrease) in the star's brightness. This is measurable. Kepler (very successfully) utilizes this method. Amateur equipment can even be used for this method.

I've been present for the discovery of a few exoplanets... if one of these methods says there is a planet out there, then there is a planet out there.

Back to the Higgs...

Attention-grabbing headlines aside, the Higgs Boson was indeed 'postulated' (predicted) back in 1964. There has been a hunt for it ever since. Some believe that CERN caught a glimpse of the elusive particle back in 2000. Much like the whole 'faster than light neutrinos,' the media (and yes, some scientists) are getting a little ahead of themselves out of pure excitement. What they have detected could be the Higgs Boson, as predicted by the Standard Model, or it could be something else, maybe even more 'mysterious.' Only time (and further tests) will tell.

If, however, it is the Higgs Boson, well, see my post before.

[Papa Bear]

Originally Posted by Neville

From time out of mind Humanity has in certain respects , accepted the existence of an afterlife a , point beyond physical death which inturn points to the existence of a state before physical birth , both states being without form , and yet according to many a state none the less (and up to press based on faith alone for the most part)...Interesting stuff...to me at anyrate,

Though by way of disclaimer, I'm not jumping the Gun just yet, as much more research needs to be done in this area of study and doubtless many more questions will present, having said that, as far as first steps go, this was quiet significant IMO.

I agree Neville, and similarly I recognize there is a way to go, but nicknaming it the `God` particle does no harm if it encourages the stubbornness of traditional physics to glint in the direction of that universal negative all- pervading field, required to justify its material boson field equivalence, for it is surely the ethereal condition.

Consider that if subatomic particle physics make the Higgs Boson the source and reasoning for mass in particles, then the particles that source biological life are sourced by those same bosons. That means OUR life forms are at source, a formless massless particle, and if that is not a bridge for us to use to recognize ethereal aspects of our Natural condition in formless conditions, then what more do we need.

Realizing the existence of a source formless influence, through its resonance influences is the essence of the Spiritual human experience. Mind itself may fundamentally be formless in of itself as many experiences that are defined as `intuitive` may also have sources which are `formless` which create a resonance recognition in our human experience.

Consider the spiritual medium, the source of their reflections if spiritual are formless, yet intuitiveness and heightened human sensitivities may allow a harmonization with their resonance flows. In essence it is the human experience which is the only lab that can experiment within the formlessness of ethereal experiential awareness, to be able to justify its existence as a `state` of interconnectivity with another nature.

As we may be formed by bosons so we may have a another formless source condition namely the subtle etheric body, both structures being formless in source condition, as a massless boson on a material level, and `its` source ethereal `formless` condition. It`s just a speculative thought from a formless mind.

[r6r6]

Higgs is suppose to be a glue that makes mass = or become a matter.

Specifically a fermionic matter---hadrons/quarks, electrons/leptons, and neutrino's/leptons.

But we have to include those weirdo mesonic bosons, because they are actually two fermionic quarks combined to have whole integer spin of bosonic force particle exchanged between hadrons-- proton neutron etc.. ----.

As of yet, they do not know if the this alledged Higgs, has spin-0 like EMRadiation--- not just light, or visible light, as so many mistaken state ---i.e.EMRadiation is much broader scale of frequencies than light and includes light.

Or it maybe spin-1 ergo the 3-weak forces( W-, W+ and Zo ), or gluons/glue that hold quarks together.

Since the Higgs decays into two Zo particles, some believe it will have spin-q value.

Based on my Rybonic extrapolations of Synergetics, I believe the Higgs is related closely with the VE/cubo-octahedron and the VE/cubo-octahedron's 4 great/equaltorial, circle-like, tubular planes are associated with those weirdo mesonic force particles as two quarks.--- strange is putting in mildly ---.

So, my guess is, that, Higgs are a hybrid that will have spin-o, spin-1 and spin-2 characteristics.

Quasi-physical/gravity spacetime membrane/network, is the essential glue of all fermionic matter and bosonic forces, this places the Higgs in a peculiear position vey much like gavity. imho.

Rybo the Rybot

I listened to a radio interview with a physics professor yesterday. After some preliminary q&a the question asked was "As my body has mass, how many Higgs boson's are in my body right now?" The answer was "probably none".

Looks like this higgs boson gives mass to other particles but in itself it does not have to be present in order for particles to have mass.

Confused? So am I.

Maybe it is the Higgs field which gives mass and the boson is just an indicator that the Higgs field exists?

[mArIya]

original post by Neville
Quote:
Imagine looking down from a balcony in a ballroom, watching a cocktail party below. When just plain folks try to go from one end of the room to the other, they can walk through easily, with no resistance from the party crowd. But when a celebrity shows up, other partygoers press around him/her so tightly that he/she can hardly move ... and once he/she moves, the crowd moves with him in such a way that the whole group is harder to stop.

The partygoers are like Higgs bosons, the just plain folks are like massless particles, and The Celebrity is like a massive Z boson.

great analogy Neville and thanks for sharing it