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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Paranormal & Supernatural > ESP & Telepathy

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  #81  
Old 15-05-2011, 09:52 PM
Westleigh Westleigh is offline
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I agree, that is interesting about schizophrenia. I have to say, while I have questioned the validity of my experiences, I have never exactly questioned my sanity as such. I used to suffer from anxiety and several phobias but have recovered from them in recent years, and one of the things a guide of mine likes to say when I wonder about my sanity is "if you were going to go mad, don't you think it would have happened when you were dealing with mental instability and not now when you are perfectly normal and well-adjusted?" He has a very valid point.

I agree that there is a link between insanity and spiritual experiences, and I wonder how many people who have had spiritual experiences think they are mentally disturbed, or how many have become disturbed as a result of spiritual experiences like kundalini. I suppose that, without any sort of physical measure of proof, the important difference is whether or not the experiences are having a negative or debilitating effect. All of mine have had an extremely positive effect - my spirit companions give me a great deal of affection, excellent advice, are always on hand with pep talks when I feel down, and even help me with little aspects of my everyday life. Aside from the fact that it's a difficult thing to share with others, there is no negativity associated with these experiences whatsoever, and that experience seems to be the same for others who regard their spirit experiences in a healthy way. I'm not worried about being mad, only concerned that I might have an overactive imagination.

I know what you mean by that limbo place, IQ - it is quite frustrating and disconcerting at times, but there just isn't any measure of physical proof that can validate spiritual experience because the fact that it is spiritual and therefore of a completely different nature to the physical world is exactly the problem. Dulce, I like your ideas. It does seem logical that that, for those of us who have established these experiences are doing us no harm (rather the opposite) the healthiest solution is just to accept them and get on with things!
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  #82  
Old 15-05-2011, 10:20 PM
Prokopton
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I agree that there is a link between insanity and spiritual experiences, and I wonder how many people who have had spiritual experiences think they are mentally disturbed, or how many have become disturbed as a result of spiritual experiences like kundalini.

Well this of course is partly why Kason did her research and wrote the book! One of the most useful things about it is to realize you can 'feel like you're going crazy' but still be sane.

Schizophrenia definitely is the holy madness thing sometimes -- it's still insanity but it's lost in terrain that anyone here might find themselves in. From the article I wrote:

Bleuler in Dementia Praecox (1958) mentions a man having the ‘metaphysical delusion’ that ‘he contained within his own body all the heavenly bodies while also maintaining that these heavenly bodies simultaneously existed in the outer world.’ An ordinary shrink might do a double take there. But this is actually a high realization in some eastern and western spiritual traditions. In the kabbalah of the Sepher Yetzirah (see for example Kaplan 1997, Bardon 2010) the inside of the body, the organs, are connected to the cosmos, and the same is true in many forms of Taoist inner alchemy, some of which are being openly taught (eg. by Mantak Chia). The realization that the inner self or microcosm contains the heavenly bodies is an advanced one.

... etc.
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  #83  
Old 16-05-2011, 12:21 AM
jjj
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I didn't read many of the other replies. I've wondered this very thing a lot... but feel I have better insight after some years in the mental health field. Schizophrenia is characterized also by very disjointed thinking and language and paranoia. Strange delusions (ex. rap stars are making music off of my body, the government has implanted chips in my body, someone stole my urine sample, etc), and the voices and images tend to be scary and threatening.

Frankly, I am not sure how to discern between imaginary friends and psychic stuff. That is, I am not sure if my imaginary friend when I was a kid was real or not. However, in my adult life when I have had sure fire psychic (guide) communication; it has been a strange voice (not mine) and a message told me over and over again... like in a loop. Also, it seemed to just 'come from out of the blue'. Other times that there has been psychic communication has not been so clear-cut but has been through dreams and later validated by the person involved.

It also depends who you ask. I'm not 100% certain that spiritual stuff has nothing to do with schizophrenia. Schizophrenia almost always manifests around the 17-25 years old range so that does suggest an organic thing. However, it has been documented that while certain third world countries have just as many new cases of schizophrenia as the US does, there is a greater rate of 100% remission in these countries. I suspect there may be a link to the type of healing modalities used, including things such as exorcisms and other spiritual healing rituals. Others have suggested that perhaps it is because of the view and decreased stigma of people who see and hear things in those countries.
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  #84  
Old 16-05-2011, 12:24 AM
Silver Silver is offline
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it has been documented that while certain third world countries have just as many new cases of schizophrenia as the US does, there is a greater rate of 100% remission in these countries. I suspect there may be a link to the type of healing modalities used, including things such as exorcisms and other spiritual healing rituals. Others have suggested that perhaps it is because of the view and decreased stigma of people who see and hear things in those countries.

That's a very good point to be cognitive of. Ty for sharing that.
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  #85  
Old 16-05-2011, 11:20 AM
Internal Queries Internal Queries is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DulcePoetica
IQ- have you ever tried a mental trick to allow yourself the freedom to believe? I do this sort of thing quite frequently when I want better understanding of something that my brain habitually deems implausible.

Here are some concepts I have used to bring myself back into an experience:

1. While I do not believe this, many people I respect and admire believe this and I will try to find the truth that they believe in.

2. We already know that humans can not see all light frequencies or hear all sound frequencies. Therefore, science has proven that VAST amounts of measurable things take place beyond human senses. I do not believe that science has already discovered ALL of existence, therefore it is perfectly reasonable, and in fact intelligent to accept that at least some invisible/unexplained things are very real.

3. I may not yet have external confirmation that this specific phenomena is a "true" experience, yet in all cases where I have gotten feedback from other involved parties, my sub-sensory perception has been verified as accurate. Therefore, even without confirmation, I can maintain my intellectual integrity while also believing there is a high probability of this being real.

4. Simply because I do not know if this paranormal/supernatural experience is real, I will only find peace of mind by further investigation. Therefore, I must continue to participate, and the more I delve into it, the more understanding I will gain.


thank you, Dulce. i do use those kinds of "tricks" in some form or another but i guess the bottumline problem is that i'm obsessing over the phenom in general so i'm going to try a new tactic. i'm going to try to minimize the apparent significance. i'm going to try to make it feel "normal" to myself instead of feeling "gee, this is so effing weird". if it's not "effing weird" maybe i won't obsess. right?

lol yeah right. oh well, it's worth a shot.
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  #86  
Old 16-05-2011, 11:34 AM
Internal Queries Internal Queries is offline
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Quote:
I know what you mean by that limbo place, IQ - it is quite frustrating and disconcerting at times, but there just isn't any measure of physical proof that can validate spiritual experience because the fact that it is spiritual and therefore of a completely different nature to the physical world is exactly the problem. Dulce, I like your ideas. It does seem logical that that, for those of us who have established these experiences are doing us no harm (rather the opposite) the healthiest solution is just to accept them and get on with things!
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ah but Wes, these imaginary friends of mine claim to be telepaths living in physical bodies on this timeline in America. according to them this is not a strictly "spiritual" experience and there are ways for them to validate the reality of the situation. i'm trying to be patient but i grow weary of the excuses for the lack of confirmation. if they had claimed to be "spirit guides" or some other kind of disembodied entities i'd not be demanding proof of their physicality. i don't think me unreasonable to desire such proof considering the amount energy i've devoted to their fancy psy project over past 5 months. do you think i'm being unreasonable?
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  #87  
Old 16-05-2011, 11:42 AM
Internal Queries Internal Queries is offline
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Originally Posted by jjj
I didn't read many of the other replies. I've wondered this very thing a lot... but feel I have better insight after some years in the mental health field. Schizophrenia is characterized also by very disjointed thinking and language and paranoia. Strange delusions (ex. rap stars are making music off of my body, the government has implanted chips in my body, someone stole my urine sample, etc), and the voices and images tend to be scary and threatening.

Frankly, I am not sure how to discern between imaginary friends and psychic stuff. That is, I am not sure if my imaginary friend when I was a kid was real or not. However, in my adult life when I have had sure fire psychic (guide) communication; it has been a strange voice (not mine) and a message told me over and over again... like in a loop. Also, it seemed to just 'come from out of the blue'. Other times that there has been psychic communication has not been so clear-cut but has been through dreams and later validated by the person involved.

It also depends who you ask. I'm not 100% certain that spiritual stuff has nothing to do with schizophrenia. Schizophrenia almost always manifests around the 17-25 years old range so that does suggest an organic thing. However, it has been documented that while certain third world countries have just as many new cases of schizophrenia as the US does, there is a greater rate of 100% remission in these countries. I suspect there may be a link to the type of healing modalities used, including things such as exorcisms and other spiritual healing rituals. Others have suggested that perhaps it is because of the view and decreased stigma of people who see and hear things in those countries.


interesting stuff, jjj! thank you for your insights.
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  #88  
Old 16-05-2011, 01:48 PM
DulcePoetica
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Internal Queries
thank you, Dulce. i do use those kinds of "tricks" in some form or another but i guess the bottumline problem is that i'm obsessing over the phenom in general so i'm going to try a new tactic. i'm going to try to minimize the apparent significance. i'm going to try to make it feel "normal" to myself instead of feeling "gee, this is so effing weird". if it's not "effing weird" maybe i won't obsess. right?

lol yeah right. oh well, it's worth a shot.
Talking about my experiences on here has made a lot of it seem more like normal events, even dull sometimes.

I had a dream last night where I was visited by a recently deceased friend (overdose) and he clearly didn't know he was dead. I told him I missed him and he looked right in my eyes with that familiar guilt and lonely, drug addicted stare and then he tried to get into his truck but he was a ghost, so he couldn't open the door. Someone else got in and drove off in it, and my dead friend was standing in the middle of the street bewildered.

I thought with a shrug, "Yeah, that's how these things go I guess."

Of course if I had that type of dream a few years ago, it would weigh on my consciousness for weeks or months trying to understand its meaning. He's not the first deceased friend to pay me a dream visit since I have opened up. The more dramatic stuff has been going on with me for about a year now, and while some of it still throws me, much of it has normalized into feeling like every day stuff.
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  #89  
Old 19-05-2011, 11:20 AM
jjj
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I wonder what would transpire if you were to tell him something like, "You have passed over. You can move on now." or something...

I don't have a lot of visits but the ones I've had were awesome... like one with my great-grandmother (who died in her 90s) jumping on the bed with me, giggling, and telling stories. She looked very young... I'm not sure how I knew it was her but I just knew.
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