What's true and what isnt?

Originally Posted by explorer007

it's like with christian's oh the end times, fallen world, not long now til 2nd coming of jesus. the trouble with this is it's like a false hope where nothing is happening and year's go by.

Einstein said that insanity is doing the same thing over again and expecting different results, The last time we had some kind of Spiritual revolution was the Renaissance, whether the New Age was actually new or just a rehash is moot, and ince then it's the dawning of a new understanding on a weekly basis.


But then if nothiong happens then nothing happens. are we being the changes we want to see?

[Emm]

Originally Posted by Pewdiepie

Assume here that: truth = objective reality OR raw subjective experience

There is so much knowledge and deception out there in the world. I am still in the phase of figuring out what is true and what isn't by trial and error...

Its part of the journey ...you learn to become honest with yourself and feel your way to your truth. Its a good thing, its not about judgement more about honing in on your own inner guidance.

Originally Posted by Pewdiepie

Even my own mind could unknowingly deceive itself, for example through the placebo effect or even just sheer arrogance or hubris

This is where you learn to be honest with yourself...again a good thing...all part of the journey of self discovery

Originally Posted by Pewdiepie

Dare I say that I don't have really any established spiritual facts (Truths) in my arsenal, I just have assumptions and beliefs, and I guess thats where faith comes in.

Go with what feels true to you right now, don't worry if in time that changes...keeping an open inquisitive mind and self awareness are what's needed...later on the journey you find its the letting go of beliefs that give you greater clarity

Originally Posted by Pewdiepie

I think having this type of conflict is necessary for growth, but imagine believing a falsehood, following it to your detriment, and ending up in a tunnel of lies. However, I still think it can be an experience for potential growth in the end.

We've all been there and yes it all helps with getting a clearer vision of your own truth... letting go of what you see as lies is like clearing house.

Originally Posted by Pewdiepie

They say that wisdom = knowledge + experience. Knowledge is essentially verbiage and logic, and experience is a confirmation of those former two concepts. But what if the experience is tainted with bias or superstition? Or what if the verbiage and logic are flawed?

Then go with what feels better to you...its all about following your joy and highest excitement, that's your inner guidance. When logic tells you one thing and your heart tells you another...this is the tug of war that you need to be aware of...follow one and see where it leads, then follow the other. Mistakes are our greatest teachers so don't be afraid of making them, as long as you are choosing with some awareness of what you're following you get to discern where your inner guidance is coming from and to trust it.

Originally Posted by Pewdiepie

I think I am going to have to just accept living in a constant, almost complete state of uncertainty for now. Maybe one day it will transform into anchored knowledge, or as they say, strong roots in the tree of life.

Hmmm, Knowledge isn't at the top of my list of spiritual must haves lol...not now anyway, so don't put too much store by it. Self awareness is key...wisdom flows from within your being not always from experiential memory. Accepting life as constant change is wisdom and a truth...so you've found one of them anyway lol. Live also with the desire to know your truth and it will come to you if you live in open awareness...its closed minds that cling to beliefs that have more trouble ever seeing.

[Dargor]

Nobody can know the truth. A lot of people have different kind of experiences from various religious backgrounds whereas others did not. The only thing I personally know is that there is an afterlife, hidden dimensions, and possibly beings, both good, evil, and neutral. But I don't cling to any religion or belief system. I only just hope and pray that religious fundamentalism is far from the truth, otherwise most of us will surely be in for a treat.

[Mila Ru]

There are two points. The first point is your heart, the second point is the imaginary line where the crown chacra line crosses the third eye chacra line, or the pineal gland. Those are points of light. Those are truth. From there you can perceive what is true and what is not. The pineal is where your soul touches the physical body, that is always true and always will be, no matter how faded your heart might be.

[explorer007]

i was watching this thing on the tbn christian channel, i observe with an open minded approach, it talks about hearing the voice of god, i just couldn't help to shake off the thought of 'higher self' it seems the voice of god is like a thought form or a feeling not really a direct voice close up close to your ear. this is where im a truth seeker it's like i could read about this sort of thing for hours, it's fascinating but i dont know for sure what is happening, i just cant prove it.

[lemex]

I think several posts touch upon some very important ideas. As has been said no one knows what is true. What would the physical process feel like. I can imagine it. How would one discern differences of hearing a direct voice and (hearing) thought, thought is not a voice. Voice would have a recognized difference, as I know myself, and feelings of self we're all aware of. We would all know new ideas as they would be known different. Physical hearing is not just a sensation processing energy signals by the brain and we often disagree with voices. Do we believe we would 100% of time would agree with what we were told, newly. Thought to is a physical process of energy however thought would mean ideas are those ideas always agreed with, ideas one already thinks. How can we be right 100% of the time as voice would support truth (what's said). There would sometimes be different things told which would challenge us. A direct voice would deal with truth and would be recognized as not being the 'you'. It would (on occasion) mean hearing message never (one) thought before. Since none know what is true of not, if one knows something should not be true does one go with heart.

[Shivani Devi]

Heya all.

I didn't know where to post this...here will do.

Yesterday, I walked into a second hand bookstore and went over to the DVD section. They didn't have much, mainly children's cartoons...but in amongst those, a DVD basically jumped out at me.

It was "Holy Smoke" starring Harvey Keitel and Kate Winslet.

I read the back of it and it sounded interesting, so I bought it for $1, took it home and watched it...what unfolded before me were scenes from my own life story.

What is truth? collectively, it is whatever the most people believe in, if it serves their collective agenda. What is "personal truth"? well, that doesn't matter and is totally irrelevant to anybody else but oneself (and those who happen to share your rather "unique" situation).

In the film, a girl in her mid twenties (Kate Winslet) travels to India to stay in an ashram for a while. Her family believes she has joined a "cult" (because they are devout Christians), so her mother goes over to India to get the girl with the LIE that her father was on his deathbed and wanted to see her one last time (just to get her out of India on the very next plane) and then her family accused the "cult" of manipulating her, when THEY were being the manipulative ones!

She continued to rebel and run away, so they hired an "exiter" or a "deprogrammer" (Harvey Keitel) who brainwashed her into believing that love, peace and light was NOT the answer..but all he wanted to do was to get into her pants. The reason he became a deprogrammer? because as a child, he was raped in an ashram by a monk...again, he was projecting his own insecurities on the girl.

To try and break her spirit, he showed her videos of Charles Manson...The Jonestown Massacre...Heaven's Gate etc...yes, the general "truth" in society about anything at all really, is this: "If you have seen one, you have seen them all" and there are generally no "exceptions" to this rule of thumb. It is where the process of labeling comes up short every time.

Had I been Kate Wnslet, I would not have fought and lashed out against the indignity, humiliation and injustice as she did. I just would have gone into meditation on the spot...refusing to eat or drink anything until my room was unlocked and I was allowed to either return to India or commit suicide....but that would make for a pretty boring movie, wouldn't it?

All through the movie, her family was saying "we are only doing this for your own good...because we love and care for you" but it was also plain to see that was also a LIE and the real "cult" that was damaging the girl was her own family...they just didn't want anybody ELSE to undo the brainwashing, programming and conditioning they had already installed and viewed any challenge to it as "competition" that needed to be crushed and destroyed...while the sanity of a girl caught in the crossfire hung in the balance.

In the end, one forgets about what is "true" and what is "not true" because two people can call each other 'delusional' until they are blue in the face and get absolutely nowhere.

[Shivani Devi]

As a footnote to the above, that movie, as well as my own spiritual awakening has given me a brand new appreciation for Neil Diamond...never thought much about his songs before, until they were placed within a context:

"I AM....I said" - Neil Diamond
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sxDyXK93o6g

[Khalli]

Everything!

[WildHairedWoman]

Delight in the mystery.