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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Religions & Faiths > General Religion

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  #1  
Old 30-01-2006, 01:21 PM
Poppies
Posts: n/a
 
Gnosticism

I was reading the Jesus a Re-incarnation of Adam? thread, and at the bottom of the 1st page, Space_Man posted a link some interesting articles that mentioned Gnosticism. I looked it up in Google, and found this article... which I thought looked interesting... I have copied out the whole article below - I know it makes this post long, but I thought it would be helpful!

To me, some elements reminded me of the Matrix films.

I really do not mind where this thread goes... I just thought the article (while a little difficult to follow in places!) looked interesting....

One question that comes to my mind is "does anyone else see links with the Matrix films?". I am not trying to start a competing Matrix film thread here, but I found the article interesting, and the 'Matrix connection' intrigued me too... I know that in the Matrix films there are spiritual threads/elements from various sources.... as I read this article, I wondered if some aspects of Gnosticism could have been another 'source'.............?

Also, I wondered what people think about the ideas put across in this article....?

I will confess here that some other sites on Gnosticism lost me completely :oops: This particular article caught my eye though... I'm not trying to say that this is correct and other articles are not.... it's just that, like I said, I found it rather more understandable.... and it got my attention...

[color=blue][quote]The Gnostic World View:
A Brief Summary of Gnosticism


GNOSTICISM IS THE TEACHING based on Gnosis, the knowledge of transcendence arrived at by way of interior, intuitive means. Although Gnosticism thus rests on personal religious experience, it is a mistake to assume all such experience results in Gnostic recognitions. It is nearer the truth to say that Gnosticism expresses a specific religious experience, an experience that does not lend itself to the language of theology or philosophy, but which is instead closely affinitized to, and expresses itself through, the medium of myth. Indeed, one finds that most Gnostic scriptures take the forms of myths. The term
  #2  
Old 31-01-2006, 09:17 PM
Poppies
Posts: n/a
 
Gnosticism and the Matrix films....

I am not saying that the Matrix films are strongly based on Gnosticism
  #3  
Old 01-02-2006, 11:30 AM
DASA
Posts: n/a
 
Similarities

Hi Poppies,

I actually read your earlier link about this in full yesterday (about the texts found in 1945) and thought it would make a nice starter for a new thread!! Then today I see you've entered these posts :-)

What struck me was the amount of similarities between what is being said here, and the teachings of the ancient Vedic texts of India. I guess that might tie in with the Matrix references you refer to? See below:

1) Reincarnation: 'These writings affirmed the existence of the doctrine of reincarnation being taught among the early Jews and Christians.' - Both texts propose the idea of reincarnation, a wheel of rebirth for the soul ended by one re-awakening a state of pure love with God.

'Christian Gnostics held the view that if spiritual resurrection was not attained in one lifetime, then the soul would be subjected to as many reincarnations as it takes until spiritual rebirth is attained.'

2) Holy Names being important: 'An important Christian Gnostic teaching was the "Logos" which in Greek is translated as "the image of the Word." It is an important concept found in the gospel of John:
"In the beginning was the Word (Logos), and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." (John 1:1)'
I've heard it said that here John is actually QUOTING the Rig Veda, which reads as follows: "In the beginning was Brahman, with whom was the Word, and the Word was truly the Brahman." Brahman translates to 'Supreme', and is often used to describe 'God' or 'God's Energy' in Vedic scripture.
Many followers of the Vedic scriptures believe that mantras including the word of God, when chanted will release one from the cycle of re-birth. For example that is why the great saint Chaitanya Mahaprabhu asked everyone to say the Hare Krishna mantra:

"Hare Krishna Hare Krishna, Krishna Krishna Hare Hare,
Hare Rama Hare Rama, Rama Rama Hare Hare"

3) Spiritual Knowledge: 'The Christian Gnostics emphasized spiritual knowledge rather blind faith as the road to salvation.' This sounds philosophically similar to the path of Yoga as outlined in Vedic scripture were one undergoes a path of purification.

4) Becoming a Servant of the servant of God: "So then, men ought to regard us as servants of Christ and as those entrusted with the secret things of God." (1 Cor. 4:1)

"A Krishna Consciousness person thinks always about himself as the lowest creature in the world, and the more one thinks like that he becomes elevated more and more. A Krishna Conscious person is never falsely puffed-up; he is satisfied with his humble position as the servant of the servant of the servant of Krishna." (Srila Prabhupada letter, June 1, 1968)

5) The Aim - Returning to God:
'According to Gnostic theology, a series of "falling away" from the Whole that is God occurred in eternity which resulted in all that there is today. After the first "fall", the divine consciousness descended to the level of the divided consciousness; now after another "fall", it has fallen even further, into the depths of the unconscious; it has been "forgotten."

'Once souls fell into the lower levels of consciousness, they became enamored of it and burned with the desire to experience the pleasures of matter. The souls then no longer wanted to disengage itself from these lower levels. Thus the world was born. From that moment souls forgot themselves. They forgot they original habitation, their true center and eternal being.'

Compare these to the below text by Srila Prabhupada:

After all, the living entity falls down from the spiritual world. Just like Jaya-Vijaya. There is possibility, if you do not stick to the spiritual principle, even if you are in Vaikuntha (Heaven), you will fall down, what to speak of this material world? Because in the Vaikuntha or in the spiritual world, no contaminated soul can stay there. He will fall down.

Therefore in the Bhagavad-gita you will find the statement, bahunam janmanam ante jnanavan mam prapadyate: [Bg. 7.19] "After many, many births, when one is actually wise..." Wise means in the sattva-guna platform. "Then he surrenders to Krishna (God)." Then the beginning of spiritual life is there, and he may finish this course of spiritual understanding even in this life, simply by understanding Krishna.
Honolulu, July 4, 1974

There's definitely more than one similar thread between the two ;-)

Hare Krishna,

Your servant,

Das
  #4  
Old 01-02-2006, 01:43 PM
Poppies
Posts: n/a
 
It's interesting that the links are there, isn't it DASA?

The link that DASA refers to is on the Reincarnation and the Early Christians link (labelled "some interesting articles" on the Jesus a Re-incarnation of Adam? thread

On that page are some interesting points made about how the early Christian Church dealt with Gnosticism....

Quote:
These writings affirmed the existence of the doctrine of reincarnation being taught among the early Jews and Christians. These Christian mystics, referred to as Christian Gnostics, were ultimately destroyed by the orthodox Church for being heretics.

Quote:
The Christian Gnostics were regarded by some as a new Jewish sect who believed they had finally found the long-awaited Messiah and not a new religion. Some of the apostles became Gnostic and because of this, Christianity could well have grown up as a Gnostic religion had it not been for their eventual persecution by the organized Church centuries later.
  #5  
Old 01-02-2006, 04:05 PM
DASA
Posts: n/a
 
Links

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poppies
It's interesting that the links are there, isn't it DASA?

Could I venture the opinion that they are both describing the same Transcendental reality? Maybe something got a little lost in the standard translation? ;-)
  #6  
Old 01-02-2006, 08:26 PM
Poppies
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Links

Quote:
Originally Posted by DASA
Quote:
Originally Posted by Poppies
It's interesting that the links are there, isn't it DASA?

Could I venture the opinion that they are both describing the same Transcendental reality? Maybe something got a little lost in the standard translation? ;-)

I'm really sorry DASA, :oops: but I'm not quite sure what you're saying there... could you clarify for me please? :)
  #7  
Old 02-02-2006, 09:35 PM
DASA
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Links

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poppies
I'm really sorry DASA, :oops: but I'm not quite sure what you're saying there... could you clarify for me please? :)

Actually I think I might be on thin ice with that last comment... if I say any more the extra weight could plunge me into a watery grave ;-) ... apologies on the vagueness.

Gouranga !!

Das
  #8  
Old 03-02-2006, 06:44 PM
Space_Man
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Links

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poppies
Does this bring to mind for anyone else, the Dues ex Machina?
Oh, yeah
  #9  
Old 04-02-2006, 11:35 PM
Poppies
Posts: n/a
 
Re: Links

[quote=Space_Man]So, going back to Christian mythology
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