knowledge of good and evil

[white pegasus]

dan just trying to get clarity-God wrote the 10 commandments out and gave them to moses-its in the Bible. Are you suggesting something different?

[sky]

"42 Declarations of Innocence"

"42 Admonitions of Ma'at"

"42 Negative Confessions"

I have not done iniquity.
I have not robbed with violence.
I have not stolen.
I have done no murder, I have done no harm.
I have not defrauded offerings.
I have not diminished obligations.
I have not plundered the Netcher.
I have not spoken lies.
I have not snatched away food.
I have not caused pain.
I have not committed fornication.
I have not caused shedding of tears.
I have not dealt deceitfully.
I have not transgressed.
I have not acted guilefully.
I have not laid wasted the ploughed land.
I have not been an eavesdropper.
I have not set my lips in motion (against any man).
I have not been angry and wrathful except for a just cause.
I have not defiled the wife of any man.
I have not defiled the wife of any man. (repeated twice)
I have not polluted myself.
I have not caused terror.
I have not transgressed. (repeated twice)
I have not burned with rage.
I have not stopped my ears against the words of Right and Truth (Ma'at)
I have not worked grief.
I have not acted with insolence.
I have not stirred up strife.
I have not judged hastily.
I have not been an eavesdropper. (repeated twice)
I have not multiplied words exceedingly.
I have not done neither harm nor ill.
I have never cursed the King.
I have never fouled the water.
I have not spoken scornfully.
I have never cursed the Netcher.
I have not stolen.
I have not defrauded the offerings of the Netcher.
I have not plundered the offerings of the blessed dead.
I have not filched the food of the infant, neither have I sinned against the Netcher of my native town.
I have not slaughtered with evil intent the cattle of the Netcher.



http://www.trinicenter.com/kwame/200...ed%20offerings.

[HITESH SHAH]

Originally Posted by white pegasus

sorry folks unable to respond to the good and evil post by soulseeker so I wanted to clarify it below

sky-God gave humans free will-God created everything He is the creator. My use of the word rule was a quick way to convey what I was trying to say, Perhaps if I may explain it this way,

the original post asked the question is the knowledge of good and evil good or evil. I was simply trying to say that the answer isn't a black and white cut and dry answer either good or evil-the answer I was trying to say-It is the way God created the universe

It all depends on what one likes . If one likes sports / game/ play in life , then life exactly provides it . It provides meaningful freedom to enjoy / view/ participate the game/play/sport . At the same time it puts lots of restrictions on your freedom in the form of dos and donts and associated scores/penalties for observance / violations of it . Laws of various sciences are the laws of life which one should try to observe and not violate.

So if one enjoys the sports , the knowledge of good or evil is definitely good because it lets one participate better in the game of life ,avoid penalties and score more points and at the same time experience the thrill and excitement of the sport called life.

If one likes laize faire , lawlessness , randomness etc definitely the knowledge of good or evil is evil .

For me the knowledge of good or evil is definitely good because I like the sports .

[Dan_SF]

Originally Posted by white pegasus

dan just trying to get clarity-God wrote the 10 commandments out and gave them to moses-its in the Bible.

Do you see these commandments, if you follow them, as an improvement of quality of living with other humans ?

Take one commandment and imagine what would be, if that commandment was not followed.

Then take your thinking back to the beginning, and imagine what would happen if it was followed.

Do you agree, that following these commandments is better ?

Are you suggesting something different?

God does not give commandments.

Moses, on the other side, wanted a set of rules, in which most happiness would be achieved.
Asking that, of God, he has got the answer. The commandments.

But, can you tell me, where is the place, where God does not give commandments ?

Is this universe before or after Adam has fallen asleep ? (this question is related to previous question)

Ok, to challenge your thinking a bit more, see:

The commandments apply to humans ! Right ? But God does not follow them.
To point to the problem, look at the commandment of "Thou shall not steal".

When i say, that God does not follow it, do you think that he is doing it ?
(For not following it means doing it, right ? for what ELSE can there be ?)

I'm explaining you this intellectually:

God does not know of stealing. What he wants, he has. This is easy to understand. But what is not so easy to understand how he gets, what he wants.
But the Bible is telling you this, in the beginning (there was) ...

And another paradoxical question is: If God is the Only God, what or where are the "Other Gods", which you should not have before him?

I understand it, but do you ?

[white pegasus]

dan ty for answering my question. Thank you also for explaining to me on an intellectual level your beliefs and perceptions about what you think and believe about God with respect to His commandments.

I will answer your questions

1. would the quality of my life improved if I followed the commandments-yes

however, because I am human I sin-I break the commandments. God provided the commandments for humans to live by-however God also knew from the very start that humans would sin, fail, break commandments, humans are incapable of not sinning breaking the commandments

the 10 commandments were given to Moses by God bc the Israelites God called his own therefore God wanted them to listen to Him and obey His laws or 10 commandments-

2. God knew from the start that we would need a savior who would be a sacrifice for the whole world to atone for all sin. When Christ suffered upon the cross He fulfilled the law and in the new testament is where there is a new covenant.

3. God created the lawe-he is perfect-so no God does not steal-God knows of stealing thus the commandment thou shall not steal. I think God who is perfect is above the law

4. If God is the only God, you asked what or where the other gods which one should not have before Him...……….personally I can say that I sadly have worshipped other things in front of God-I placed other things before God

god(s) come in many forms to every individual

5. now to answer your final question you state, "I understand it, but do you? what are you referring to when you say you understand "it"?

secondly what is i9t that you think I do not understand?

Again than k you for providing clarity on your statement about the commandments

[sky]

Originally Posted by white pegasus

dan ty for answering my question. Thank you also for explaining to me on an intellectual level your beliefs and perceptions about what you think and believe about God with respect to His commandments.

I will answer your questions

1. would the quality of my life improved if I followed the commandments-yes

however, because I am human I sin-I break the commandments. God provided the commandments for humans to live by-however God also knew from the very start that humans would sin, fail, break commandments, humans are incapable of not sinning breaking the commandments

the 10 commandments were given to Moses by God bc the Israelites God called his own therefore God wanted them to listen to Him and obey His laws or 10 commandments-

2. God knew from the start that we would need a savior who would be a sacrifice for the whole world to atone for all sin. When Christ suffered upon the cross He fulfilled the law and in the new testament is where there is a new covenant.

3. God created the lawe-he is perfect-so no God does not steal-God knows of stealing thus the commandment thou shall not steal. I think God who is perfect is above the law

4. If God is the only God, you asked what or where the other gods which one should not have before Him...……….personally I can say that I sadly have worshipped other things in front of God-I placed other things before God

god(s) come in many forms to every individual

5. now to answer your final question you state, "I understand it, but do you? what are you referring to when you say you understand "it"?

secondly what is i9t that you think I do not understand?

Again than k you for providing clarity on your statement about the commandments

Do you think it was Moses himself who chose which Command-ments were applicable ?
When you look at the origins of them most are repetitive anyway and shortening them into 10 is obviously useful.

[white pegasus]

sky I think Moses received the commandments from God when he was on Mount Sinai. My personal opinion/belief is that if I break of the commandments-Ive somehow broken them all-it is a matter of really looking at and breaking down where I missed the mark.
I believe that God knew since the beginning of time that humans would be incapable of living ithout sin(missing the mark). so He created a plan to save the whole world by sending His Son Jesus Christ to be the official sacrifice/atonement for all sin.

Christ fulfilled the old covenant and by doing so He created a new covenant that all who believe that Chrtist died for our sin would be saved-if we confess and believe in Him as ourt Savior

In my opinion I do not believe humans wake up in the morning looking to sin looking to miss the mark-

Ive often wondered what it would look like if I were able to keep all the commandments-a day wi years of continuous sobriety this past Feb.

However, because I believe in God and His son because I confess my sin and confess that I need Jesus Christ to save me-I believe I am forgiven-if in my heart I am truly sorry. So what does that mean for me it mean I do not have to carry around the guilt shame remorse of things that I have done-its in the past. God loves me more than I can imagine.

There have been many times that I have thought, how can God love someone like me-bc of my mistakes how can God still want me as His child-ive come to accept that he does.

I look at it like a Mother who has a chilod-that love is unconditional-I do not have any children so the best thing I can use for myself is my austrailian shepherd dog-no matter what she does doesn't do I still love her I think that is how it is with God
years ago. I celebrated
Christ fulfilled the laws of the old testament when he died upon the cross. there had to be the shedding of blood for the sin sacrifice because God sees blood as life.

There was a point in my life where I was at a crossroads and I was so angry at God-not that at that time I had any type of relationship with Him. I was raised in the Lutheran religion-I have no resentments against the religion but I always felt like God was somewhere out there unobtainable-like I didn't know how to connect with him. I was pretty sure that God was not too much interested in me.

However, as I was bottoming out from y disease of alcoholism I went to my first AA mtg-and it was there that I realized it was about finding a higher power who could and would if he were sought relieve me of my obsession and compulsion to drink. I remember thinking I am in big trouble here if this is about God bc He and I had stopped talking a long time ago.

Anyway as I was driving home that night form the mtg I said "uh hi God, its me, I know I haven't talked to you in a while, but look heres the thing Im in real trouble here because I cant set the drink down, these people at this mtg told me that if I ask you that you would relieve me of the obsession and compulsion to drink. So if you could help me out with this I would really appreciate it."

sky I can honestly say to you that was

years ago bc this past Feb I celebrated years of contunous sobriety. If I had to debate with another about how I know God exists it would not be based uponm the Bible. I would base my arguments upon all the personal experiences I have had throughout my life with God. I could write for a very long time on all the ways God has shown up in my life-and they truly miracles-nothing else can explain these happenings.

Christ gave us a new commandment in the New testament and it is this we are to love one anther.

[sky]

Originally Posted by white pegasus

sky I think Moses received the commandments from God when he was on Mount Sinai. My personal opinion/belief is that if I break of the commandments-Ive somehow broken them all-it is a matter of really looking at and breaking down where I missed the mark.
I believe that God knew since the beginning of time that humans would be incapable of living ithout sin(missing the mark). so He created a plan to save the whole world by sending His Son Jesus Christ to be the official sacrifice/atonement for all sin.

Christ fulfilled the old covenant and by doing so He created a new covenant that all who believe that Chrtist died for our sin would be saved-if we confess and believe in Him as ourt Savior

In my opinion I do not believe humans wake up in the morning looking to sin looking to miss the mark-

Ive often wondered what it would look like if I were able to keep all the commandments-a day wi years of continuous sobriety this past Feb.

However, because I believe in God and His son because I confess my sin and confess that I need Jesus Christ to save me-I believe I am forgiven-if in my heart I am truly sorry. So what does that mean for me it mean I do not have to carry around the guilt shame remorse of things that I have done-its in the past. God loves me more than I can imagine.

There have been many times that I have thought, how can God love someone like me-bc of my mistakes how can God still want me as His child-ive come to accept that he does.

I look at it like a Mother who has a chilod-that love is unconditional-I do not have any children so the best thing I can use for myself is my austrailian shepherd dog-no matter what she does doesn't do I still love her I think that is how it is with God
years ago. I celebrated
Christ fulfilled the laws of the old testament when he died upon the cross. there had to be the shedding of blood for the sin sacrifice because God sees blood as life.

There was a point in my life where I was at a crossroads and I was so angry at God-not that at that time I had any type of relationship with Him. I was raised in the Lutheran religion-I have no resentments against the religion but I always felt like God was somewhere out there unobtainable-like I didn't know how to connect with him. I was pretty sure that God was not too much interested in me.

However, as I was bottoming out from y disease of alcoholism I went to my first AA mtg-and it was there that I realized it was about finding a higher power who could and would if he were sought relieve me of my obsession and compulsion to drink. I remember thinking I am in big trouble here if this is about God bc He and I had stopped talking a long time ago.

Anyway as I was driving home that night form the mtg I said "uh hi God, its me, I know I haven't talked to you in a while, but look heres the thing Im in real trouble here because I cant set the drink down, these people at this mtg told me that if I ask you that you would relieve me of the obsession and compulsion to drink. So if you could help me out with this I would really appreciate it."

sky I can honestly say to you that was

years ago bc this past Feb I celebrated years of contunous sobriety. If I had to debate with another about how I know God exists it would not be based uponm the Bible. I would base my arguments upon all the personal experiences I have had throughout my life with God. I could write for a very long time on all the ways God has shown up in my life-and they truly miracles-nothing else can explain these happenings.

Christ gave us a new commandment in the New testament and it is this we are to love one anther.

Well we can disagree on where the origins of the Command-ments came from but I applaud you on tackling your Alcohol Problem, well done, and even if it was the Tooth Fairy who helped you then the outcome is what's important.

Keep up the good work

[BigJohn]

Originally Posted by white pegasus

dan just trying to get clarity-God wrote the 10 commandments out and gave them to moses-its in the Bible. Are you suggesting something different?

Exodus 31:18 (New International Version) (NIV) reads"

"When the Lord finished speaking to Moses on Mount Sinai, he gave him the two tablets of the covenant law, the tablets of stone inscribed by the finger of God."

Exodus 32:15 re-emphasizes that point That scripture reads:

"Moses turned and went down the mountain with the two tablets of the covenant law in his hands. They were inscribed on both sides, front and back. The tablets were the work of God; the writing was the writing of God, engraved on the tablets."

"They were inscribed on both sides" is rarely mentioned. Virtually everybody believes they were written only on one side of each tablet.

Moses destroyed those tablets when he saw that the Israelites had made a an idol of a golden calf.

God replaced the tablets as mentioned in Exodus 34:1. It reads:

"The Lord said to Moses, “Chisel out two stone tablets like the first ones, and I will write on them the words that were on the first tablets, which you broke."

The words, "Ten Commandments", was never in the Bible. Those words were added later when descriptive titles and headings were given. Same is true for chapters and verses.

The "Ten Commandments" is part of the Law. The rest of the Law follows. The Law consisted of at least 613 separate laws.

[BigJohn]

Originally Posted by white pegasus

Christ gave us a new commandment in the New testament and it is this we are to love one anther.

YOU ARE SPOT ON!