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  #561  
Old Yesterday, 10:55 PM
sentient sentient is offline
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Sufism and Zen .....
Quote:
When Inayat Khan, the Sufi teacher, came to America some ten years ago, I (Nyogen Senzaki) met him in San Francisco.

Inayat Khan smiled at me and asked, “Mr. Senzaki, will you tell me what the significance of Zen is?”

I remained silent for a little while, and then smiled at him. He smiled back at me. Our dialogue was over.
https://terebess.hu/zen/mesterek/Sufism-Senzaki.pdf

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  #562  
Old Today, 06:05 AM
Joe Mc Joe Mc is offline
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Zen Anybody

Zen has the best stories,and it has poetry. It has formality and informality. Square Zen and Beat Zen was an idea that was around during the beatniks adventures with poetry and writing. Need I say it referred to the formal Zen training structure which included Zazen, Ritual and Koan practice and things of that nature. Beat Zen on the other hand, as opposed to square Zen, referred to a type of skepticism with everything a questioning, not to mention some drug taking lol.

It may seem obvious to say but Zen seems to be unique in this regard when compared to other schools of Buddhism. It has an iconoclastic aspect to it that doesn't exist amongst say Theravadin Buddhism or Mahayana Buddhism. This is debatable of course and one could easily argue that Tibetan Buddhism in the form of the Vajrayanic path has 'crazy wisdom' which sometimes completely leaps outside the rules of formal training.

Anyway I was just wondering also why there are not so many threads here, if any, on Zen Buddhism ? It seems like the Buddhist Forum has become a hot bed ,with no disrespect meant, to the crossing the 't's' and dotting 'i's of classical theravadin buddhistic debate. It almost feels to me sometimes that you have to be a librarian or an expert in Pali Canon classifications to be part of ? But I know some of that feeling is my own lack of education in that regard so please forgive me.

So perhaps this thread could be open to Zen Buddhism, stories anecdotes, personal stories, poetry , zazen, snowballs, thieves, alcoholism or none of the above or all of the above ? Perhaps there could be a place for Zen after all or not as the case may be ?

Kind Regards, Joe

Ps. I would also be grateful if people could desist from racial profiling knowingly or unknowingly, wittingly or unwittingly. Otherwise this thread will be pulled by the admin. and rightly so. There has been a decent amount of sharing here already regarding the subject of Zen. Silence is also ok, and there is also nothing wrong with being tangential that seems to happen naturally enough, peeps start to talk about Religion, Psychology and all manner of things but that too would benefit if we try to bring it back to formal and informal knowledge, anecdotes, wisdom and our own experiences of Zen. I'm Irish myself so I'm no stranger to War, famine, colonialism, sectarianism even catholicism hahahaha !!! lol. Why would i need an enemy when i have encountered so many 'perceived' enemies in my life time without name nor face nor nationality, nor identity really. I am talking about perception and thoughts here, attitudes and feelings. Thanks.

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Too much intellectual pride and not enough intellectual beauty

To Thine own Self be True

The Frost performs its secret ministry,Unhelped by any wind. Samuel Taylor Coleridge

And you won't find that Love comes easy but that Love is always right.So even when the dark clouds gather you will be the light.

All Intellect falls prey to Love's Glory ! Rumi

He Made the Lock, He also Made the Key ! Rumi
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  #563  
Old Today, 06:06 AM
Joe Mc Joe Mc is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sentient

Thanks
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Too much intellectual pride and not enough intellectual beauty

To Thine own Self be True

The Frost performs its secret ministry,Unhelped by any wind. Samuel Taylor Coleridge

And you won't find that Love comes easy but that Love is always right.So even when the dark clouds gather you will be the light.

All Intellect falls prey to Love's Glory ! Rumi

He Made the Lock, He also Made the Key ! Rumi
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  #564  
Old Today, 10:10 AM
Phaelyn Phaelyn is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Mc
It may seem obvious to say but Zen seems to be unique in this regard when compared to other schools of Buddhism.

I found this quote: Zen minus Buddhism equals Taoism.

A special transmission outside the scriptures.
No dependency on words and letters.
Pointing directly to the human mind.
Seeing into one’s nature and attaining Buddhahood.

Bodhidharma.

Zen seems to have been influenced by Taoism and Confucianism which produces a certain flavor of Buddhism while other schools were influenced by Hinduism.
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  #565  
Old Today, 10:22 AM
sky123 sky123 is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 9,355
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phaelyn
I found this quote: Zen minus Buddhism equals Taoism.

A special transmission outside the scriptures.
No dependency on words and letters.
Pointing directly to the human mind.
Seeing into one’s nature and attaining Buddhahood.

Bodhidharma.

Zen seems to have been influenced by Taoism and Confucianism which produces a certain flavor of Buddhism while other schools were influenced by Hinduism.


As Zen was brought from China it's inevitable it was influenced by Taoism/Confucianism but it's all good

Not always mentioned Mencius was another great Sage and Philosopher..



'The way of learning is none other than finding the lost mind.'
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  #566  
Old Today, 12:49 PM
Still_Waters Still_Waters is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sentient
Sufism and Zen .....

When Inayat Khan, the Sufi teacher, came to America some ten years ago, I (Nyogen Senzaki) met him in San Francisco.

Inayat Khan smiled at me and asked, “Mr. Senzaki, will you tell me what the significance of Zen is?”

I remained silent for a little while, and then smiled at him. He smiled back at me. Our dialogue was over.

https://terebess.hu/zen/mesterek/Sufism-Senzaki.pdf

*

I practiced under Pir Vilayat Khan, the son of Hazrat Inayat Khan who left the earth plane in 1927. That story says it all.

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  #567  
Old Today, 12:52 PM
Still_Waters Still_Waters is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phaelyn

A special transmission outside the scriptures.
No dependency on words and letters.
Pointing directly to the human mind.
Seeing into one’s nature and attaining Buddhahood.

Bodhidharma.


"No dependency on words and letters".

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  #568  
Old Today, 05:02 PM
sentient sentient is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Still_Waters
I practiced under Pir Vilayat Khan, the son of Hazrat Inayat Khan who left the earth plane in 1927.
Yes, you had mentioned that in one of your earlier posts – how interesting!

I have always been fascinated by Sufism, but all of a sudden Sufism became like an ‘alive thread’ since – thanks to hologram8’s signature, I looked into my deep ancestry from Caucasus and suddenly realized they had been/are Sufis. So there is a personal connection, although a faint one.

Sometimes one can “journey” along these threads and tap into the collective unconscious of them to get a proper ‘feel’ if these threads are not too old.
The dombra and the drum acting as a conduit to take you ‘there’. 'That' specific rhythmic pattern of them ….

Quote:
Originally Posted by Still_Waters
That story says it all.
Yes it does.
Though my mind translates it as them having had a memorable non-dual moment together.
That dimensional moment of silence and stillness which is beyond both - thought and non-thought (as such).
Non-thought being a ‘conduit’ to it - to the 'shift'.
Just like sensuality can be a ‘conduit’ to a more ‘spiritually’ dimensional ‘feel’

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