Mindfulness and pleasure; Developing visualization through meditation

[RaveCrazedDave]

I am a complete newbie to meditation, and when I first thought about getting involved with it (a long time ago), my purpose was solely to increase my ability to concentrate, as I believe concentration is the tool with which we conquer existence; any and all other achievements would come with time, given that skill to be well honed. I have a few questions:

After way too long of postponing the one thing I've regarded as being the key to life, I bought the book "Mindfulness in plain english", by Bhante Gunaratana, and while the book wasn't really what I was expecting - though, thinking about it now, I didn't know what to expect - it did present that idea of "mindfulness". While parts of it seem wonderful, there's also something that's bothering me and scaring me; to put the question simply and bluntly: will I still enjoy things after I begin to attain the "mindful" mindset? Will I still enjoy books, hanging out with friends, eating chocolate, sex; or will those pleasurable things feel dissolved in a way? Do I just think those things are pleasurable because I can't see beyond them? I'm not fully comprehending this part of the deal. The book is great, by the way.

One thing the book also mentioned is that this kind of meditation is not really aimed at developing concentration very much; where should I look for this?

And what about practicing multiple kinds of meditation, does that hinder progress?

I was wondering if there were any kinds of meditation that focused on developing inner mental abilities: the mind's eye, the mind's ear, the mind's body.

Thank you in advance for all the help provided. Maybe some of these are dumb questions, but I'm still trying to get my thoughts sorted on meditation in general.

[Ground]

Originally Posted by RaveCrazedDave

...to put the question simply and bluntly: will I still enjoy things after I begin to attain the "mindful" mindset? Will I still enjoy books, hanging out with friends, eating chocolate, sex;

Probably not.

Originally Posted by RaveCrazedDave

or will those pleasurable things feel dissolved in a way?

If practiced correctly, probably yes.

Originally Posted by RaveCrazedDave

Do I just think those things are pleasurable because I can't see beyond them?

Probably yes.

Originally Posted by RaveCrazedDave

One thing the book also mentioned is that this kind of meditation is not really aimed at developing concentration very much; where should I look for this?

In the pali kanon. But really ... concentration as meditation is mere artificiality. What's the use?

"He discerns that 'This theme-less concentration of awareness is fabricated & mentally fashioned.' And he discerns that 'Whatever is fabricated & mentally fashioned is inconstant & subject to cessation.' For him — thus knowing, thus seeing — the mind is released from the effluent of sensuality, the effluent of becoming, the effluent of ignorance. With release, there is the knowledge, 'Released.' He discerns that 'Birth is ended, the holy life fulfilled, the task done. There is nothing further for this world.'

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipit....121.than.html

Originally Posted by RaveCrazedDave

And what about practicing multiple kinds of meditation, does that hinder progress?

Depends on what kind of 'progress' you are envisaging.

[baro-san]

Don't worry about side effects! Start meditating now, keep reading things, and you'll find what you're looking for.

It's likely that a 6th sense, inner voice, higher self, or such, pushes you on the meditation path.

Remember my words: if you don't start it now, then sometimes in the future, be it 1 year or 40, you'll look back and ask yourself: "if I started meditating at that time, were would I be now?".

Good luck on your path!

[sunnyray]

Don't worry about losing any of the pleasurable things you enjoy right now. If anything, meditation will help you appreciate life and all its aspects even more than before. It is not what activities you are involved in, but how you look at them, how attached you are to them. Don't worry about checking out several techniques, even dozen. Sometimes it takes time to find the right one for you. It is a journey. Enjoy it.

[secretscribe]

It would probably increase your capacity for pleasure, from being able to concentrate on it, while decreasing your interest in pleasure for its own sake. In the end, I think it's up to you, although like I said it will probably change what really moves you.

[shiningstars]

Originally Posted by RaveCrazedDave

I am a complete newbie to meditation, and when I first thought about getting involved with it (a long time ago), my purpose was solely to increase my ability to concentrate, as I believe concentration is the tool with which we conquer existence; any and all other achievements would come with time, given that skill to be well honed. I have a few questions:

After way too long of postponing the one thing I've regarded as being the key to life, I bought the book "Mindfulness in plain english", by Bhante Gunaratana, and while the book wasn't really what I was expecting - though, thinking about it now, I didn't know what to expect - it did present that idea of "mindfulness". While parts of it seem wonderful, there's also something that's bothering me and scaring me; to put the question simply and bluntly: will I still enjoy things after I begin to attain the "mindful" mindset? Will I still enjoy books, hanging out with friends, eating chocolate, sex; or will those pleasurable things feel dissolved in a way? Do I just think those things are pleasurable because I can't see beyond them? I'm not fully comprehending this part of the deal. The book is great, by the way.

One thing the book also mentioned is that this kind of meditation is not really aimed at developing concentration very much; where should I look for this?

And what about practicing multiple kinds of meditation, does that hinder progress?

I was wondering if there were any kinds of meditation that focused on developing inner mental abilities: the mind's eye, the mind's ear, the mind's body.

Thank you in advance for all the help provided. Maybe some of these are dumb questions, but I'm still trying to get my thoughts sorted on meditation in general.

Buddhist meditation in general builds the powers of samadhi and insight. Do it without trying to get anything.

The Thai Forest Tradition has very down to earth relate-able teachings. Google Ajahn Sumedho, Ajahn Chah etc.

And yes you will still enjoy chocolate if you want it, after a road of sweat, it's possible that life will be even sweeter.

shiningstars

[Ground]

"And what is the yoke of sensuality? There is the case where a certain person does not discern, as it actually is present, the origination, the passing away, the allure, the drawbacks, & the escape from sensuality. When he does not discern, as it actually is present, the origination, the passing away, the allure, the drawbacks, & the escape from sensuality, then — with regard to sensual objects — he is obsessed with sensual passion, sensual delight, sensual attraction, sensual infatuation, sensual thirst, sensual fever, sensual fascination, sensual craving. This is the yoke of sensuality.
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipit...tml#sensuality

[Gem]

Originally Posted by RaveCrazedDave

I am a complete newbie to meditation, and when I first thought about getting involved with it (a long time ago), my purpose was solely to increase my ability to concentrate, as I believe concentration is the tool with which we conquer existence; any and all other achievements would come with time, given that skill to be well honed. I have a few questions:

After way too long of postponing the one thing I've regarded as being the key to life, I bought the book "Mindfulness in plain english", by Bhante Gunaratana, and while the book wasn't really what I was expecting - though, thinking about it now, I didn't know what to expect - it did present that idea of "mindfulness". While parts of it seem wonderful, there's also something that's bothering me and scaring me; to put the question simply and bluntly: will I still enjoy things after I begin to attain the "mindful" mindset? Will I still enjoy books, hanging out with friends, eating chocolate, sex; or will those pleasurable things feel dissolved in a way? Do I just think those things are pleasurable because I can't see beyond them? I'm not fully comprehending this part of the deal. The book is great, by the way.

One thing the book also mentioned is that this kind of meditation is not really aimed at developing concentration very much; where should I look for this?

And what about practicing multiple kinds of meditation, does that hinder progress?

I was wondering if there were any kinds of meditation that focused on developing inner mental abilities: the mind's eye, the mind's ear, the mind's body.

Thank you in advance for all the help provided. Maybe some of these are dumb questions, but I'm still trying to get my thoughts sorted on meditation in general.

It won't reduce enjoyment of things you like. It'll probably reduce the tendency for living in the persuit of pleasure alone, though. Mindfulness includes being less distracted and the less distracted mind is a more concentrated mind. It does enhance one's ability to focus.The title is a little confusing because mindfulness doesn't typically include visualisation. It's probably a good idea to practice one sort of meditation rather than flitting about from this to that. The mindfulness practice doesn't work directly on 'inner abilities' but works on a more primary healing level which can lead to opening up that kind of thing.

[RaveCrazedDave]

Thank you for all the thoughtful - and somewhat scary - answers. I guess I just can't yet see a life without - for lack of a better word - vices. I can't see myself living for anything other than the next spike of pleasure after the despair valley is over; I guess many people define life as a series of ups and downs, and looking at it, isn't that what drives us?

We only climb because we want to reach the top of the next spike, and when there, it's easy to fall over and back down, meaning we'll be climbing again, and so on; if that ceases to be the case, won't we stop going forward? Why would we do anything then? We'd be effectively dead, wouldn't we? So this can't be it, we can't really just flat everything out or else there'd be no motion, right? Is mindfulness then a way to look at all these hills and valleys from a top-down perspective? Like to see beyond what is immediately in front of us?

What else is there other than the pursuit of pleasure?

This does not feel clear, but I guess it's one of those "see for myself" deals, huh?

[rijhumal]

Originally Posted by baro-san

Don't worry about side effects! Start meditating now, keep reading things, and you'll find what you're looking for.

It's likely that a 6th sense, inner voice, higher self, or such, pushes you on the meditation path.

Remember my words: if you don't start it now, then sometimes in the future, be it 1 year or 40, you'll look back and ask yourself: "if I started meditating at that time, were would I be now?".

Good luck on your path!

.nice to hear this. I agree with you