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  #181  
Old 27-12-2018, 07:03 PM
ImthatIm ImthatIm is offline
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Sentient

Found this guy. he's got some skills. Both outdoor skills and video skills.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_8wwAwEDeGo

He's got a few videos they seem to be around 20 minutes.
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  #182  
Old 27-12-2018, 10:27 PM
sentient sentient is offline
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Originally Posted by ImthatIm
Sentient

Found this guy. he's got some skills. Both outdoor skills and video skills.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_8wwAwEDeGo

He's got a few videos they seem to be around 20 minutes.
Good on him! – whoever he is.

In Norway, Sweden and Finland you have “Allemannsretten” (= All Men’s Right) to camp on anybody’s land in the wilderness and to fish and pick berries and mushrooms and herbs, but of course you have to do so without harming the environment.

If you have the best berry picking grounds in the forest on your land – you are traditionally responsible and accountable to the whole village to only take what you need and do sensible logging that does not disturb the forest floor.

And of course as a kid – you learn to make a shelter of them “Christmas trees” – if you ever do get stuck in the forest during the snow storm.
Traditionally you also have to listen to the wisdom of those highly respected Tree Elders - where to build your cabin/house (= a kind of a "vision quest").
Also – you know when you have entered the “Council of Tree Elders” – be it a Melaleuca forest across the world.

What you cannot do on somebody’s land is to hunt or harvest the chaga mushroom or to drain the sap of the birch trees during the Earth Moon (i.e. March when the earth comes visible from the snow) and drink the “renewal of life” - water.

*

Heh – I have got one of those fire starters (in the video) from Lapland – have tried the Aboriginal way, but am hopeless at that despite the tutoring.

*

Last edited by sentient : 28-12-2018 at 12:14 AM.
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  #183  
Old 28-12-2018, 12:40 AM
ImthatIm ImthatIm is offline
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I have no idea who that guy in the video is either, but I can see he has been doing his skills for some time and he makes a lot of his own tools. Also the fact he does not talk, I like that.

Vision quest, this is something I have a lot of respect for and really wish people would get back into it, so they would gain the respect and oneness of earth and nature. I believe all peoples had this way at one time. Different traditions but still quested.
Do you purify in the steam lodge before you quest?

I think the chaga is starting to be a big seller to a lot of people.

I heard of Birch sap being used. Is it drank only in sap form in ceremony or can you make a syrup too?

I Love the mushroom that grows on the Diamond Willow. For burning/smudge.

Fire starting is a passion of mine also. I have only made smoke with the bow drill.
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  #184  
Old 28-12-2018, 02:46 AM
sentient sentient is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImthatIm
Vision quest, this is something I have a lot of respect for and really wish people would get back into it, so they would gain the respect and oneness of earth and nature. I believe all peoples had this way at one time. Different traditions but still quested.
Do you purify in the steam lodge before you quest?
I just used the “vision quest” description there earlier for not finding better words.
But basically – you enter the Forest with respect anyways.
Then if you wish/intend to build a cabin/house there, you bow, make offerings, fire/smoke – whatever you have learned to do and sit and sleep under a Spruce Tree Elder and wait for the vision, which comes to you when you are either awake or asleep.
If the vision is favourable, you are allowed to build – if no vision comes then you must leave the site.


But of course all the talk about Spirits of Trees had been forbidden and in great fear that Spirit Trees would be cut – many parents or grandparents would at times say nothing - but take their children to sit under specific trees and transmit ‘the way’ - through silent communion with the Tree.


My grandmother, a traditional healer (though only in secrecy in fear of being labelled) – knew the different woods to use for different purposes when heating up Sauna, though she didn’t teach me that.
Sometimes I would watch her though in action – doing everything so precisely like in a “Japanese-tea-ceremony-meditation”.


Quote:
I heard of Birch sap being used. Is it drank only in sap form in ceremony or can you make a syrup too?
I have only drank it in the ‘water form’. It is one of those – in rhythm with nature and its season’s thingies.
But of course you thank the tree and make sure you didn’t damage it.

*
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  #185  
Old 28-12-2018, 11:45 AM
ImthatIm ImthatIm is offline
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Sentient
Sorry about asking so many questions, but your talking my language.

Quote:
Sentient
I just used the “vision quest” description there earlier for not finding better words.

I understand. To pay the respect to the land/place and spirits that inhabit the land. To ask permission in a Spiritual sense. To not just intrude in an area without paying the proper respect. Saying here I am and here is what I wish to do in a Good Way, and to spend time blending in that area and communing with the spirits. Letting them examine your Heart and get to know you. They (Trees) know whats best in their area. Of course the trees are chief beings of the plant kingdom.
We have our favorite cedar and yew wood tree areas in the mountains. All this is of course communing with what the Creator has made for us all, to Live in peace and harmony. it is the most beautiful Way to do things to sit and commune with nature. It gets harder for people to take time nowadays.

Quote:
Sentient
I have only drank it in the ‘water form’. It is one of those – in rhythm with nature and its season’s thingies.
But of course you thank the tree and make sure you didn’t damage it.

Yes, I can see the sap as the first nutrients coming forth after a long winter. The first show of life moving again. The new years "Water of Life" breaking through and flowing.

Quote:
Sentient
My grandmother, a traditional healer (though only in secrecy in fear of being labelled) – knew the different woods to use for different purposes when heating up Sauna, though she didn’t teach me that.
Sometimes I would watch her though in action – doing everything so precisely like in a “Japanese-tea-ceremony-meditation”.

We would always have a sweat lodge as part of the most meaningful activities. To purify and to get ones mind,body,spirit right, to enter into something in a sacred manner.
Matter of fact most of my time spent in the wild/natural has been to sweat, and seek visions for the path ahead.

It has been a real pleasure Sentient.
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  #186  
Old 28-12-2018, 09:45 PM
sentient sentient is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImthatIm
To pay the respect to the land/place and spirits that inhabit the land.
That is the old animist world view. The ground you walk on is sacred and everything has spirit and/or soul - that reveals itself through spatial communion.
Quote:
To ask permission in a Spiritual sense. To not just intrude in an area without paying the proper respect. Saying here I am and here is what I wish to do in a Good Way, and to spend time blending in that area and communing with the spirits. Letting them examine your Heart and get to know you.
Exactly.
And when you commune with the Guardian Spirit of a Tree Elder, within that communion you are totally open and transparent, psycho-spiritually there can be no hidden corners you can hide in.
Quote:
They (Trees) know whats best in their area. Of course the trees are chief beings of the plant kingdom.
Or some rock formations – they radiate or ‘sing’ – i.e. they’ll tell you about the Law on the land, if you *shift* your awareness and listen.

Quote:
Yes, I can see the sap as the first nutrients coming forth after a long winter. The first show of life moving again. The new years "Water of Life" breaking through and flowing.
Yes. The Great Birch Tree grows in the upper world:
Quote:
“At the roots of the tree, a spring flows and marks the source of the world river. Near the tree and spring there is a warm lake, or 'sea of life', where water birds and human souls are renewed. This upper world is ruled by an old woman, the ruler of all life, protector of childbirth, motherhood and water birds”.
So when you drink the gift, the waters of the birch tree – it is the eternal circle of life that you reflect upon as mythology and the natural law are but reflections of each other.
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We would always have a sweat lodge as part of the most meaningful activities. To purify and to get ones mind,body,spirit right,
The same with Sauna tradition.
Quote:
Matter of fact most of my time spent in the wild/natural has been to sweat, and seek visions for the path ahead.
I don’t know about the Native American “vision quest” – I just see it as the way one; - psycho-spiritually operates in life.

*

Earlier on I quoted a poem that spoke about all our eyes and hearts becoming as one in the sun.
Well, that is also the message of the drum, which is the central sun oriented 'cognitive map'.

*
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  #187  
Old 31-12-2018, 05:49 PM
ImthatIm ImthatIm is offline
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Quote:
Sentient quote"
Earlier on I quoted a poem that spoke about all our eyes and hearts becoming as one in the sun.
Well, that is also the message of the drum, which is the central sun oriented 'cognitive map'.

Maybe tomorrow
all our eyes and hearts will be as one
then nunjull the sun
can shine to warm even the darkest thought

Maybe tomorrow
then in this warm light the earth will be seen
her beauty and power felt
her tales of creation heard
through story rocks and sacred waters

Maybe tomorrow
we will not mine, dig or sift
for the gift
the earth our mother has to give us

Maybe tomorrow
the keepers of her secrets will be heard
word for word
then our journey can begin together
our mother will give way
as we walk and talk
to retrace the footsteps of time itself

then

Maybe tomorrow
we will all sit in the circle of life
same rhythm
same time

This poem tells of my great hope. i would often get upset when people would come together and argue and fight over the smallest things.
I keep walking on with this hope still. Unity in purpose of making things better. Small steps, step by step.
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  #188  
Old 11-01-2019, 04:49 PM
Lucky 1 Lucky 1 is offline
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Originally Posted by Gem
There has been a history of refusing to eat meat dating back, but veganism, as far as I know, is recent. For example, the Jain, who are strict about killing things, consume dairy, as do Buddhist vegetarians who's teaching on morality, based on the general ethical principle of do no harm, stipulates that one should not be involved in killing anything directly or indirectly. For example, one should not consume meat or sell meat or raise animals for slaughter, or in any way conduct oneself in a way that even remotely entails harming living things. However, such tradition has roots in places that have climatic conditions that make vegetarianism feasible, unlike the Aboriginals of central Australia, for example, whose environment does not allow for a vegetarian diet. In fact, vast regions of the world are dry, cold, high in altitude or otherwise don't allow for a complete vegetarian nutritional profile. Hence, environments that enable veganism are limited to those that are warm, fertile and moist, or populations in regions that are developed and affluent, and indeed, veganism is really only feasible in wealthy populations.


The people who make noise in the shop aren't really thinking things through. They don't appreciate issues such as poverty, geography and environment both material and social. They are merely virtue signaling.


The rhetoric on compassion isn't simple because virtue ethics doesn't deal with what is simple, black and white right and wrong. Ethics operates in the realm of dilemmas that present grey areas and the narrative on compassion isn't one to be used for virtue signaling.



It is important to try to understand that the peoples who fish and hunt did so for generations without depleting the environment they shared with wildlife. For example, the Aboriginal people around here used to manage the environment so that it produced greater abundance of wildlife than it would if left to go wild, knowing their own bounty depended on the bounty of nature. In this way, one can be responsible for increasing the capacity of the land to support life, which is the responsibility to care for the country, and kill the wildlife one needs to eat, all the while ensuring all living things have what they need. Hence, compassion is a practically and not so much a sentiment.


There was a story about Yellowstone park where nature was unbalanced, and the trees were not regenerating, the grazing animals were overpopulated, and even the terrain itself was degenerating. Wide scale ecological devastation. They assessed that the problem was due to lack of predator wolves, so they brought some in and let them loose. The wolves started killing the grazers, and their population exploded because there was so much 'dog food' running around. The trees started regenerating as everything began to balance out, and the terrain, the rivers etc. began to flourish with fish and frogs and water animals of all kinds, and the birds came back etc. etc. etc. A people could actually live off the bounty if need be, as a wide variety of flora and fauna became available, and those people would be a part of the natural world in which they have a place, the wolf has a place, the deer have a place, trees have a place - everything has a place. But 'place' is not a concept which is well understood in the Western world. (End Gem's quote)



This is a post Gem made in another unrelated thread....but I liked what it had to say a lot and in its way relates to the "spiritual path of the hunter".

As far as I know every hunting society around the world and through the ages has followed such ideals...

In other words....Hunters are the true environmentalists and care for the natural world is part of the hunters path.

Insuring that nature remains in balance is paramount to the hunter.

Insuring that the wild places are healthy and sustained for the benefit of all....from the plants and animals to humans.

The hunter feels these places in his heart and soul and loves the wild places and the plants and animals that inhabit them in a way that a non-hunter can never know.

One who follows the "spiritual path of the hunter" only takes what he needs to survive.

As far as Gem's mention of the issues Yellowstone had before the reintroduction of the wolf....here is a quote by naturalist (and a follower of the spiritual path of the hunter) that Aldo Leopold made more than 100 years ago

“We reached the old wolf in time to watch a fierce green fire dying in her eyes. I realized then, and have known ever since, that there was something new to me in those eyes – something known only to her and to the mountain. I was young then, and full of trigger-itch; I thought that because fewer wolves meant more deer, that no wolves would mean hunters’ paradise. But after seeing the green fire die, I sensed that neither the wolf nor the mountain agreed with such a view.”
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