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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > Death & The Afterlife

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  #61  
Old 16-06-2012, 02:07 PM
res
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knightofalbion
1) Were you?

2) You'll be a long time in the dark then.

It won't drop in your lap. Truth needs to be sought, learnt, understood - and passed on.

No i wasnt there and thats the reason why i wouldnt presume to tell any individual that i know the truth behind their reason for living.

I can agree that truth needs to be sought, learnt and understood though that would seem to contradict your stopping at this one concept when the truth may just still be out there yearning to be sought, learnt, understood and passed on. But hey its your journey and i wish you well.

For me ill keep seeking the truth.
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  #62  
Old 16-06-2012, 06:52 PM
knightofalbion knightofalbion is offline
Master
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 18,675
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by res
No i wasnt there and thats the reason why i wouldnt presume to tell any individual that i know the truth behind their reason for living.

You could though apply the same criteria to every prophet, saint, disincarnate and incarnate spiritual teacher, which would mean closing your heart and ears to wisdom and wise counsel, which wouldn't do much for your spiritual progression.

It wouldn't be a good idea to give spiritual instruction to anyone unless you were sure it was correct.

In any case, I don't see a vast gulf between my 'life is a school' statement and your life is 'like a school' statement.
That only leaves my statement that the purpose of life is 'to advance the soul'.
As a matter of interest, what do you say it is? To descend into hedonism. Or to learn, evolve and strive for a higher light. It really is a case of either or, no matter how you look at it.
__________________
All this talk of religion, but it's how you live your life that is the all-important thing.
If you set out each day to do all the goodness and kindness that you can, and to do no harm to man or beast, then you are walking the highest path.
And when your time is up, if you can leave the earth a better place than you found it, then yours will have been a life well lived.

http://holy-lance.blogspot.com
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  #63  
Old 17-06-2012, 01:16 AM
res
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by knightofalbion
You could though apply the same criteria to every prophet, saint, disincarnate and incarnate spiritual teacher, which would mean closing your heart and ears to wisdom and wise counsel, which wouldn't do much for your spiritual progression.

I suppose im a bit different in that i try not to accept others truth but rather search for it myself in my own experiences. This way of thinking makes it difficult for me to say that anyone has the truth to share but they may have clues that may lead me toward it. I dont see myself as a follower of anyones truth but more a leader of my own observations of truth. Did i put that the right way?


Quote:
Originally Posted by knightofalbion
It wouldn't be a good idea to give spiritual instruction to anyone unless you were sure it was correct.

That is a great point and i agree. For me the realisation of certain truth would have to be without a doubt 100% fact before i pass it off as a spiritual truth or spiritual law. For me its one thing to say "i believe we are here to advance the soul" and another to say " i know you are here to advance your soul".


Quote:
Originally Posted by knightofalbion
In any case, I don't see a vast gulf between my 'life is a school' statement and your life is 'like a school' statement.
That only leaves my statement that the purpose of life is 'to advance the soul'.
As a matter of interest, what do you say it is? To descend into hedonism. Or to learn, evolve and strive for a higher light. It really is a case of either or, no matter how you look at it.

Sorry if i put my observation of Chalk1990's statement in wording that implied to you that it was my own.

To answer your question i dont believe i have enough proof to make any claim to knowing the truth of the meaning of life. If you consider the way that i approach truth as i shared above it may be fair to say that i will not reach that conclusion while i am living on this earth. When i pass over and if i am standing before a panel of higher beings reviewing my life and can be shown proof that i actually asked someone to abuse me, then i may feel that the theory holds sometoward others theories but please dont take that as me judging your observation of truth its just that i am very skeptical unless the experience is my own.

Ill share a story to help you see me for me.

For around 5 years i attended either a group or a school each week in person to learnt about spirituality. The accumulation of what i had learnt led me to believe in life purpose/soul advancement etc. I signed up to a diploma course which led to setting up a business that was proposed by the teacher of our group. I sold my harley davidson (my baby) and invested the $9k in to the course, advertising, media access to the training etc. Toward the last few weeks of my course i felt uneasy about who the beliefs that we were passing on that could affect people that tend to look at the darker aspects of the teachings. This led to me looking in to the business more deeply. i found that the teacher did not have permission from the founder of the system to use his name and his work as the basis of our teachings. My teacher said that she had his permission as she aquired it in meditation and i was evil for challenging her and the group. The daughter of the founder provided me with a copy of the founders last will and testament, which coincided with her claims that we could not use his name or link our work to his spiritual teachings. The daughter of the founder approached my teacher and threatened her with international law and the business came to an end.

Needless to say, two weeks from graduating i chose to forfeit my diploma and walked away with a few thousand business cards, brochures and less $9k. I did however walk away with a valuable lesson and should the day come that i have to face the founder in the etheric realms i can feel secure in the knowedge that i will be greeted with open arms.

Suffice to say that i learnt a very valuable lesson in putting too much stock in to others that claims to have the truth to share and sincerley hope this helps you to see me for who i am and how i got to my way of thinking today. I realise my view can be challenging to others though i feel it is healthy to challenge the way you think.

Its great for everyone to have their own beliefs but when some sign others up to their beliefs and impose their beliefs on to others as a spiritual truth it reminds of the lesson i learnt.

Maybe it is in the use words like "you do" or "you have" or "we all did" that is the difference betwen putting a theory forward to be considered as opposed to sharing it as a spiritual truth?
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  #64  
Old 17-06-2012, 07:02 AM
res
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by res
To answer your question i dont believe i have enough proof to make any claim to knowing the truth of the meaning of life. If you consider the way that i approach truth as i shared above it may be fair to say that i will not reach that conclusion while i am living on this earth. When i pass over and if i am standing before a panel of higher beings reviewing my life and can be shown proof that i actually asked someone to abuse me, then i may feel that the theory holds sometoward others theories but please dont take that as me judging your observation of truth its just that i am very skeptical unless the experience is my own.

It annoys me when i highlight one word to corerct a typo and its erases 2 or so lines so the sentence makes no sense at all. Allow me to correct it.

To answer your question i dont believe i have enough proof to make any claim to knowing the truth of the meaning of life. If you consider the way that i approach truth as i shared above it may be fair to say that i will not reach that conclusion while i am living on this earth. When i pass over and if i am standing before a panel of higher beings reviewing my life and can be shown proof that i actually asked someone to abuse me, then i may feel that the theory holds some salt. I can see that this may be challenging toward others theories but please dont take that as me judging your observation of truth its just that i am very skeptical unless the experience is my own.

Hope that makes more sense
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  #65  
Old 17-06-2012, 09:11 AM
knightofalbion knightofalbion is offline
Master
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 18,675
 
Res: I'm sorry to hear you got ripped off. I can understand now why you're so wary.
As I say in my signature it doesn't matter what religion you follow, it's how you live your life that is the all-important thing.

I think I get your core point. How do you tell the good from the bad? You must establish what the 'teacher' is seeking.

Are they asking for money? Even a lot of money? Truth is free!, not something to be hawked or sold for profit. Anyone seeking to make financial gain is corrupt.

Are they advocating damnation/eternal hell etc? Is God a vicious, spiteful monster?! No of course not. There are certain eternal spiritual laws in place. In this instance, the law of Cause and Effect. We reap what we sow. It is an entirely self-regulating law. No vengeful God punishes 'you'. You create your own destiny through your actions. There are lower realms in the spirit world for everything must find its mark, but there is no eternal damnation. Anyone who says there is, doesn't know or understand the Divine.

Is the person displaying ego? There is no place for ego. The messenger is just that, the messenger. They are a channel for wisdom, not the source.

'By their fruit you shall know the good from the evil'. What is their message? Are they promoting goodness and kindness, kinship/brotherhood, peace and harmony? If there message is one of love and non-violence then they do understand the Divine and the nature of true religion. One must ask oneself is their message is going to make you a better person, if it is then it's worth listening to. If it isn't, then it's not.

As the words of the poem go
'YOU are the master of your fate,
YOU are the captain of your soul.'

That says it all.
__________________
All this talk of religion, but it's how you live your life that is the all-important thing.
If you set out each day to do all the goodness and kindness that you can, and to do no harm to man or beast, then you are walking the highest path.
And when your time is up, if you can leave the earth a better place than you found it, then yours will have been a life well lived.

http://holy-lance.blogspot.com
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  #66  
Old 17-06-2012, 11:48 PM
res
Posts: n/a
 
Thanks knigthofalbion. It took me a while to get past that one. It was very innocent and the teacher lost the same as the rest of us though i think the rest stuck around to get the diploma. we were led to believe that it was our soul purpose to bring others to the truth and this business would be the medium so that we could get the message out and support our families at the same time. it wasnt charging for truth but our time and investment to get the word out. i honestly dont feel that we were conned but the teacher felt she was above the founders rights and i found that out a little too late. thanks for your kind words.
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  #67  
Old 18-06-2012, 01:13 AM
RichMartini
Posts: n/a
 
wow Res, that's an awful story. A Harley for a class with a lame teacher? Really should have gotten your money back.

Friend of mine was living in the garage of his girlfriend - she'd come out there and say "You're a loser, you need a life, why don't you get a job?" and he just kept living in her garage. He had a Harley as well - cherry red - beautiful bike.

finally, after one night where she verbally abused him for a couple of hours, telling him how screwed up he was, he went back to the garage, went online, sold his Harley and moved to Montana. He met the love of his life there, and found a great job programming, his first love. So the Harley took him to Montana, in its own way, which turned out to be a good thing.

We can't always see the value in what appears to be negative. I once chased a guy who had gas coming out of his car, the gas cap was off - sparks were flying - I sped up, honked, he sped up, I had to really drive fast to catch him, he jumped out of the car with a baseball bat. "***?!!" he screamed. "Your gas cap is off! You're about to blow up!" I screamed. He was startled. Oh. What he thought was negative was positive.

That motorcycle accident that you signed up for? Didn't happen. Events changed so you didn't have to learn those events in this lifetime. Harley still exists. You still exist. One day you'll have it again. It's a matter of perspective.

When you imply that people sign up for abuse because it's assigned to them.. "Ok, all those who want to be abused by Catholic priests, raise their hands. Bueller? Bueller?" That's not how it works - and isn't how its reported in anything I've cited either. There aren't assignments assigned by teachers. "We want you to see what it would be like to experience this lesson." Nope, not what's reported. Doesn't happen like that. No one signs up for any lesson that they didn't volunteer to learn - or to help someone else learn.

And those who volunteer are usually more spiritually advanced (older souls) than the young ones. Because they know we have thousands of lives, and to sign up for a difficult one is just that. The mark of sin - the act of anger - the fury and rage and humiliation - is all temporary. The healing and forgiveness, the letting go of anger, the ability to see beauty and love and have compassion for everyone and all people - that's eternal.

But there's always someone in the back of the class who never signs up for anything. They're lazy, they're selfish, they don't want to learn anything more than what they have in their desktop. And that's ok too - because we don't have to agree to any lifetime - or any event - or any problem. We don't have to sign up to go to the Twin Towers on 9-11. But some people did - and those people were shown by and large that they would gain benefit from doing so - giving up their lives so that other lessons could be learn from thousands and millions of other people - so that those who were going to harm millions of people could be hunted down and prevented from doing so. But if these folks hadn't volunteered - we might not have a forum to discuss.

I'm not saying this was the case - it is discussed in Newton's books - I'm just saying that for the thousands of people who report the events of how the afterlife works in Newton's books, and the dozens that I've filmed and interviewed for my book - they all say the same thing about the process.

So thank you for signing up to lose your Harley to a charlatan - because it's entirely possible the charlatan saved your life. Just a matter of perspective.
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  #68  
Old 18-06-2012, 02:47 AM
res
Posts: n/a
 
Hi Rich, Geeeeeeez........... and i just bought myself a triumph too

It wasnt pleasant and i didnt have the energy to chase her for my money back. I wrote the bike off as a learning experience and took some time away from study and reiki. I wouldnt go as far as to label her a charletan as she was very well educated in spiritual matters and very gifted in areas of healing. I honestly feel that she thought she was communicating with the founder of the work although it looks to me that she was tricked by the spirit in to thinking it was her teacher that had past over. Thats the problem with bringing out information using an altered state of consciousness, you never really know who you are talking to and if they are genuinely telling the truth.

Thats interesting that you say some dont sign up. So would you say it is possible that my spiritual research and search for the truth is just a force of habit and that i could have actually just come here to have fun and enjoy having a family and all the little things that physical life has to offer? So it may be possible that i havent signed up for anything at all?

thanks for sharing your thoughts rich.

Last edited by res : 18-06-2012 at 07:09 AM.
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  #69  
Old 20-06-2012, 02:10 AM
RichMartini
Posts: n/a
 
A triumph! a metaphor!

Res, you just reminded me of another bike story - wow. This very dear friend of mine, who has since passed away (and I'm happy to tell you in the sessions I've had, he's shown up quite a bit - whether its real or not, it's a treat to see him and hear what sounds like his unique wit), had this issue with his bike.

He fell in love late in life - and it was painful for him, as all the teenage emotions of jealousy, passion, regret - were new to him. And at some point he loaned his lover his motorcycle. And then they broke up, and there had been a promise for payments but the payments never came. So my pal was furious, just really beside himself, asking me if he should sue or what the hell could he do to get his motorcycle back?

And I said "Send the title. Tell your lover that there's no person on the planet you'd rather be riding your motorcycle. That you appreciate all the love you shared." He did just that. And got a check the next day... although I don't think the check mattered. I had to track down his lover the day he died - and it was really painful to have to pass along the information. But I'm so very glad they worked at least that part of it out beforehand.

Thanks for reminding me of that story.
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  #70  
Old 20-06-2012, 07:34 AM
res
Posts: n/a
 
lol......not a metaphor, this model shown below . Not quite back to the Harley though one step at a time is fine with me. Theres just a little bit of difference between the 1969 Trophy i had about 20 years ago and this one. Where did the years go Thanks for sharing your story.

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