Linguistic Limitations

Originally Posted by VesicaPhoenix11

*nods* Yes, forum language is a horse of a completely new color... in verbal communication we can depend on our nonverbal signals to underlie our words and give them another layer of meaning. In the typed word on the page there are so many ways in which they can be misinterpreted, the intent of our words completely lost in the glare of the screen and the reflection of someone we're never seen.

One of the main reasons I brought this subject up during my first week really actively participating here is I was active on another forum years ago where similar subjects were discussed at great length and this came up - it came up quite a lot due to intentional and unintentional misunderstandings. I thought to cut through all of that and to open up a place to discuss the ways in which language is limited; or at least to know I had attempted to with forethought, learning from my past experience and all. *grin* Sometimes its not enough to just communicate, we must also discuss how we communicate and the ways in which we do so, language, to ensure real communication is occurring. Otherwise we all may as well be sitting in rooms separately talking to ourself out loud.. which is okay as well, just a perspective. *smile*

Thank you.. it was very interesting to discuss the manner in which we attempt to communicate on a forum such as this one....I certainly have had my share of problems.....There is also another factor involved in communication.....What is considered rude in--say Iowa, would not be considered so in New York, also cultural and/or ethnic differences in the way subjects/issues are addressed......That said, truth be told, we all get angry from time to time and break the rules.... :-)

Salutations! *tips hat*

Originally Posted by PapaBear

My own experience when reaching in, through the development of Spiritual self-healing, evolved an energy flow understanding which had no words to express meaning. But then I found the `chakra` in word and system, to express what I understood before I had the words. And realized that for every discovery in subtle insight I may yet flow or harmonize with, there have been many, many, before me, who have already `created` the word, from within the same currents and flows of interconnectivity. So with respect and humility, I use their expressions to reflect my own experiential awareness, in honour of those who gifted me with their words. Yet still…” language evolves as a reflection of those who wield it...”

I concur, it is wise to widen one's linguistic limitations by "discovering" language to describe our seemingly new experience, with words created and applied by those who have gone before us rather than to create new language.... as with many concepts which are descriptions of experience it is prudent to learn from others' experience as well as our own. Or more simply put, there is no need to reinvent the wheel each time we need to go to the store.

The evolution of language is an interesting concept - one of the reasons I bring it up is that it is rarely addressed that language is a construct created by humans, it is made up, the English language in particular is a reflection of history & now as it soaks up multiple meanings easily - which is one cause for misinterpretations & misunderstandings. Yet, also allows for flexibility & fluidity when applied with mutual understanding & acceptance of differences in perception.

A bridge or a chasm, words join together and words divide; its in the application & intent of their use in communication that this is decided.

Originally Posted by PapaBear

We are the same, but in this time in this place I have granted myself a freedom in expression, contrary to a lifetime of sharing your own reflection. It is a self luxury I have gifted myself, for in doing so I seek to extend my own understanding of my own limitations in expression, and to seek in trial or error, to give form to formlessness, in words.

An endeavour that carries its participants from the conventionality of tradition, in meaning, use or rationality and invites the `Spirit` to express in manifest words, is one I share.

Approaching it from opposite sides of the linguistic spectrum, I see. I often say I write poetry for myself, I write stories, essays & posts for others; in poetry I seek to describe to myself experiences that defy description, an internal eternal conversation that yes, invites the spirit to present itself between and behind the words that I apply. It's a hobby, keeps me interested & occupied as it's endless. *smile*

Originally Posted by PapaBear

When I was younger, I remember being rather fond of the word `vibration` until I shared a discussion with two physicists, who were discussing string theory. And when I apologized and highlighted the restrictions in generality the word vibration brought to my vocabulary, one of them said, “try, `resonance`, it is more precise to what produces it”. I then discovered in research, that everything produces resonance waves/flows in reflection of its presence. Like an invisible pebble entering a pool, the ripples identify its presence, and there are many pools and many pebbles formless to human perception, and I had a `word` to identify a presence in formlessness.

Science has been such a boon in this area, explorations of language, I feel - for in exploring and describing the natural world it has been necessary to invent & reinvent language to record observations. Resonance is a lovely word that says so much with so little...

Originally Posted by PapaBear

As I also enjoy gliding within your most eloquent flows in expression and enquiry, for they reflect from a pioneering Spirit.

Graciously said and received. Pioneering spirit indeed (oddly enough I recently received that description of self in a Karmic astrology interpretation of my natal chart, a practical spiritual pioneer who dreams), although as of yet I have only begun to stretch boundaries previously defined - yet I anticipate my journeys joyfully as they will take me to vistas not yet seen and I only hope to have the discipline, consciousness, and creativity to name that which I will see in a way that it may be understood, which is the intent of language at its core - to impart understanding.... cheers to those who find joy and life in navigating the spaces in which language has reached its limit. *chuckles* We're going to need a bigger boat.

Originally Posted by American Prayer

Jim Morrison, A fellow pioneer
Do you know the warm progress under the stars?
Do you know we exist?
Have you forgotten the keys to the Kingdom?
Have you been borne yet & are you alive?
Let's reinvent the gods, all the myths of the ages
Celebrate symbols from deep elder forests
[Have you forgotten the lessons of the ancient war]

Originally Posted by Juanita

Thank you.. it was very interesting to discuss the manner in which we attempt to communicate on a forum such as this one....I certainly have had my share of problems.....There is also another factor involved in communication.....What is considered rude in--say Iowa, would not be considered so in New York, also cultural and/or ethnic differences in the way subjects/issues are addressed......That said, truth be told, we all get angry from time to time and break the rules.... :-)

Thank you! That is a very good point for a forum such as this since there are members from all over the world. Not only is how language is applied (which words mean what for who) a possibility for misinterpretation but the cultural differences in the application of those words & the attitudes behind the words can cause difficulties as well. This came up recently in another thread. It is a wonderful opportunity for self-reflection and for new ways of ensuring we understand and we are understood...