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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > Non Duality

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  #1  
Old 03-08-2019, 03:00 PM
redsox87 redsox87 is offline
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Consciousness

What if “individual consciousness” never arose? What if there was just the absence of any observer from the very beginning (complete void and blackness)? Could nonduality even be posited or be true?
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  #2  
Old 04-08-2019, 05:47 AM
Phaelyn Phaelyn is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redsox87
What if “individual consciousness” never arose? What if there was just the absence of any observer from the very beginning (complete void and blackness)? Could nonduality even be posited or be true?

How do we know individual consciousness exists? Maybe it doesn't.
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  #3  
Old 04-08-2019, 07:56 PM
iamthat iamthat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redsox87
What if “individual consciousness” never arose? What if there was just the absence of any observer from the very beginning (complete void and blackness)? Could nonduality even be posited or be true?

We are dealing with a world of "what is", not a world of "what if".

Peace
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Old 04-08-2019, 07:58 PM
iamthat iamthat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phaelyn
How do we know individual consciousness exists? Maybe it doesn't.

Look within. Are you not consciousness expressing through a particular identity? This suggests that individual consciousness is present.

Peace.
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  #5  
Old 05-08-2019, 07:22 PM
Lord_Viskey Lord_Viskey is offline
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Quote:
What if “individual consciousness” never arose? What if there was just the absence of any observer from the very beginning (complete void and blackness)? Could nonduality even be posited or be true?

Individual Consciousness arises within Absolute Consciousness. Without Individual Consciousness, there can be no reference to Absolute Consciousness.

- therefore ; "If" individual consciousness never arose, there would be no "Reality" to compare anything else within.

- "If" individual consciousness never arose, the Divinity of "Self-Realization" could not exist to present such a question.

- therefore ; "In the absence of any observer from the beginning" means to preclude the Divinity from attempting self awareness; ergo: Divinity/ Absolute Intelligence/ Intelligent Design would not exist either, nor "in the first place" to pose a question of self expression.

- However; when individual consciousness no longer is "arisen", then Absolute Consciousness would still persist - and definitely in a manner without any and all nondualistic attributes.

(at the risk of sounding religious : "within the infinity of God, all opposites are combined". For the devout of this world, God is "The Infinite". Regardless the religious persuasion though, it is accepted that all things originate from that which would be the personal description individually held of God. As we conceptualize God, the common denominator is that God includes and involves all that is "infinite"; an infinite, which, by its nature is not limited to any singular conceptualization of it. (parahrasing what Nicolus du Cosa said)

"When Yahweh created the world from his prima materia, the 'Void,' he could not help breathing his own mystery into the Creation which is himself in every part, as every reasonable theology has long been convinced. From this comes the belief that it is possible to know God from his Creation. When I say that he could not help doing this, I do not imply any limitation of his omnipotence; on the contrary, it is an acknowledgment that all possibilities are contained in him, and that there are in consequence no other possibilities than those which express him." (Carl Gustav Jung)

Summary : to preclude "individual consciousness" is the same as precluding "Absolute Consciousness". Because of the two "perceptions," duality must exist by nature of it being associated to one who perceives or the other one. When only one (who perceives) exists, then dualism does not...

Guess which one is the "persistent" perceiver.
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  #6  
Old 07-08-2019, 12:09 PM
Shivani Devi Shivani Devi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redsox87
What if “individual consciousness” never arose? What if there was just the absence of any observer from the very beginning (complete void and blackness)? Could nonduality even be posited or be true?
From whence does the notion of an individual consciousness arise in juxtaposition to that which IS Non-Dual?

There is no "observer" in relation to that which is observed for the premise to be self evident.

Therefore Non Duality is the only truth, whether it is posited as being true or not, because what is "true" and what is "not true" is still confined within the whole Dualistic framework of material nature.

Welcome to the forum.
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  #7  
Old 08-08-2019, 02:13 AM
Starman Starman is offline
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For me duality is but a reflection. Like looking in a mirror your left is on your right and
your right is on your left, duality are opposite reflections. "If" there were no opposite
reflections experience would be a lot different then it is inhabiting a human body. I
believe and observe that everything is connected, and as nothing can function in a
vacuum, I do not embrace the idea of individual consciousness.

Consciousness only seems individual because of the illusive concept of ego, and the
experience of individual vessels or bodies, in my opinion. In a state of "cosmic
consciousness" consciousness grows and expands beyond our physical body; this I
have experienced. It moves out on all sides in a spherical fashion, and you find your
physical body is inside of you, inside of your consciousness, and not vice versa.
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Old 08-08-2019, 02:25 AM
Unseeking Seeker Unseeking Seeker is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Starman
For me duality is but a reflection. Like looking in a mirror your left is on your right and
your right is on your left, duality are opposite reflections. "If" there were no opposite
reflections experience would be a lot different then it is inhabiting a human body. I
believe and observe that everything is connected, and as nothing can function in a
vacuum, I do not embrace the idea of individual consciousness.

Consciousness only seems individual because of the illusive concept of ego, and the
experience of individual vessels or bodies, in my opinion. In a state of "cosmic
consciousness" consciousness grows and expands beyond our physical body; this I
have experienced. It moves out on all sides in a spherical fashion, and you find your
physical body is inside of you, inside of your consciousness, and not vice versa.

***

As long as ‘I expand’ instead of ‘we expand as one’ is there not duality?

The key word seems to be interconnectedness rather than oneness.

***
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  #9  
Old 08-08-2019, 02:34 AM
Starman Starman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unseeking Seeker
***

As long as ‘I expand’ instead of ‘we expand as one’ is there not duality?

The key word seems to be interconnectedness rather than oneness.

***

In the expansion of cosmic consciousness the "I" becomes a collective "we." But the "we" is not
multiple. Actually the human language is inadequate to describe this state of being, as a seemingly
individual consciousness can expand infinitely, blending with all of existence and non-existence,
at least that is my theory, but it is a fact that human imagination can not envision or conceive of infinity.
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  #10  
Old 08-08-2019, 02:49 AM
Unseeking Seeker Unseeking Seeker is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Starman
In the expansion of cosmic consciousness the "I" becomes a collective "we." But the "we" is not
multiple. Actually the human language is inadequate to describe this state of being, as a seemingly
individual consciousness can expand infinitely, blending with all of existence and non-existence,
at least that is my theory, but it is a fact that human imagination can not envision or conceive of infinity.

***

Even in the vibrant void of emptiness (fullness), dissolved yet in as ordained distinct, we are ‘as He’ but not He. As long as we are within the continuum of Oneness as in divine entwined interconnectedness we too are Absolute without limitation as the ultimate Love vibration. However, back to form, duality is, separateness is ... as above so below.

The truth, as felt.

***
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